bostonmick Posted February 3, 2017 Report Share Posted February 3, 2017 It'd be good to get some intel, I'm always slightly annoyed they get jobbed before we can squeeze info out of them. Wasn't water boarding mentioned recently...... i understand that yes if they told the authorities any useful information,however i dont think these fanatics will talk under any circumstances,water boarding was mentioned by president trump recently and the rest of the world slammed him for ir.also in most of these terror type attacks the police come out with they knew of them and their links to various groups so why not round them up and try to get info from them before any innocent people are killed by them.in this world of global terrorism i believe that detention camps should be reintroduced for this purpose. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TIGHTCHOKE Posted February 3, 2017 Author Report Share Posted February 3, 2017 I'd be interested to know the experience those criticizing the soldier's marksmanship have in shooting at someone/thing that is feet away and actively trying to kill them. Oh I suspect they would be very accomplished on the play-station! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
norfolk dumpling Posted February 3, 2017 Report Share Posted February 3, 2017 French police spokesperson said 5 shots but only one hit - someone needs a little practise me thinks! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
UKPoacher Posted February 3, 2017 Report Share Posted February 3, 2017 I'd be interested to know the experience those criticizing the soldier's marksmanship have in shooting at someone/thing that is feet away and actively trying to kill them. A mate of mine was on patrol in Nicosia during the EOKA period of troubles. He was carrying a Bren gun at the time and under a sudden threat situation dealt with it instantly. He basically emptied the magazine into a young EOKA fighter who had pulled a shotgun as the patrol passed by. Keith had been on all the training, knew all the tactics yet his trigger finger didn't leave the trigger until the magazine emptied. Later on the Armourer told him that in live fire situations he had never come across anyone using the two second burst and re-assess tactic that had been drilled into the squaddies.They all came back with an empty magazine. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ditchman Posted February 3, 2017 Report Share Posted February 3, 2017 9mm is rubbish...just one or 2 shots from colt 45acp....would be curtains.......when the 9mm hand gun came in....so did the "double tap"....before that it was the old 45 acp one shot by by.....also miss the old 7.62......you knew you were sending summat up the barrel then...not some nancy boy calibre... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
digger Posted February 3, 2017 Report Share Posted February 3, 2017 Maybe some think the gun used was some kind of super gun ? Or maybe the attacker stood stock still to allow the soldier to shoulder his gun and take good aim ? Can't imagine why he didn't get all 5 bullets in the same hole, after all its not like some nutter was rushing at him is it 😩 Threat neutralised = job done. I'm sure he's happier with that outcome than some Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
UKPoacher Posted February 3, 2017 Report Share Posted February 3, 2017 Maybe some think the gun used was some kind of super gun ? Or maybe the attacker stood stock still to allow the soldier to shoulder his gun and take good aim ? Can't imagine why he didn't get all 5 bullets in the same hole, after all its not like some nutter was rushing at him is it Threat neutralised = job done. I'm sure he's happier with that outcome than some Yep. And given that one of the soldiers was seriously wounded in the knife attack it must be pretty difficult to get that clover leaf five shot group while he's slashing the bejasus out of your colleague. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ditchman Posted February 3, 2017 Report Share Posted February 3, 2017 QUESTION is it true that armed personell in airports and cities use downgraded ammunition to prevent bystander injuries....seen to remember that when they first started policing Heathrow the ammo was reported to be "less powerful".... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
UKPoacher Posted February 3, 2017 Report Share Posted February 3, 2017 QUESTION is it true that armed personell in airports and cities use downgraded ammunition to prevent bystander injuries....seen to remember that when they first started policing Heathrow the ammo was reported to be "less powerful".... Well, you are not going to take a 1500 metre head shot at Heathrow are you? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dougy Posted February 3, 2017 Report Share Posted February 3, 2017 The thing is we were not there at the time, there may have been a struggle hence the minor injury. The shooter may have tumbled while shooting, (combat roll style) (beat you to it) we don't know do we, but the 1 shot was enough to stop him from maybe killing innocent bystanders. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
12gauge82 Posted February 3, 2017 Report Share Posted February 3, 2017 I'd be interested to know the experience those criticizing the soldier's marksmanship have in shooting at someone/thing that is feet away and actively trying to kill them.Hurrah for the voice of reason. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zapp Posted February 3, 2017 Report Share Posted February 3, 2017 9mm is rubbish...just one or 2 shots from colt 45acp....would be curtains.......when the 9mm hand gun came in....so did the "double tap"....before that it was the old 45 acp one shot by by.....also miss the old 7.62......you knew you were sending summat up the barrel then...not some nancy boy calibre... You must be older than I thought. There hasnt been a .45ACP weapon in service with the British armed forces since 1945. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
walshie Posted February 3, 2017 Report Share Posted February 3, 2017 QUESTION is it true that armed personell in airports and cities use downgraded ammunition to prevent bystander injuries....seen to remember that when they first started policing Heathrow the ammo was reported to be "less powerful".... No. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ditchman Posted February 3, 2017 Report Share Posted February 3, 2017 You must be older than I thought. There hasnt been a .45ACP weapon in service with the British armed forces since 1945. quite right......really i was questioning why the USA dropped the 45acp for the 9mm...it was partly thro' the arrogance of colt and refusal to develop a double stack magazine as opposed to the 9mm beretta the defence ministry was accessing....too say the least the armed forces were gutted to lose the 45acp as they preffered a one shot and down gun as opposed to what some thought the 9mm didnt deliver enough downing power........... at any rate the offender was put down and unable to carry out his full promise....so job well done.........if in the same situation i would have proberly shot my foot off.............. cant be easy for the french.....keyed up and ready to go 24/7....just knowing it is going to happen again and again............just hope to god it dosnt spread over here.... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jam1e Posted February 3, 2017 Report Share Posted February 3, 2017 I don't think he's dead That's a shame. Now tax payers money will put him right, then have to pay millions to keep him locked up! A double tap to the head would have saved the tax payer a fortune!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
scotslad Posted February 3, 2017 Report Share Posted February 3, 2017 Sorry for a daft pstol/calibre question?? (and i don't want to derail thread either) Never had anything to do with them in past ()apart from firing 6 shots from 'dirty harry' hand gun in OZ But with rifle calibres ur .223 = 5.56mm, ur 243 is about 6mm and 308 is 7.62, So does that not make a 9mm quite a large calibre handgun, or is it a large calibre but quite a small shell casing so little powder and under powered? Wot sort of size bullet wieght does a 9mm fire? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
walshie Posted February 3, 2017 Report Share Posted February 3, 2017 Sorry for a daft pstol/calibre question?? (and i don't want to derail thread either) Never had anything to do with them in past ()apart from firing 6 shots from 'dirty harry' hand gun in OZ But with rifle calibres ur .223 = 5.56mm, ur 243 is about 6mm and 308 is 7.62, So does that not make a 9mm quite a large calibre handgun, or is it a large calibre but quite a small shell casing so little powder and under powered? Wot sort of size bullet wieght does a 9mm fire? 9mm is a fairly small calibre for a handgun. Bullet weights in the 110-125gr range (ish). You're right about the small casing not holding much powder, hence they are a lot less powerful than rifle calibres. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dougy Posted February 3, 2017 Report Share Posted February 3, 2017 About 120 grain and 1300 fps ish. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
scotslad Posted February 4, 2017 Report Share Posted February 4, 2017 Cheers walshie and dougy. I've always wondered that as i sort of knew them were 'low' powered by comparsion to some other rounds Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
oowee Posted February 4, 2017 Report Share Posted February 4, 2017 9mm is a fairly small calibre for a handgun. Bullet weights in the 110-125gr range (ish). You're right about the small casing not holding much powder, hence they are a lot less powerful than rifle calibres. I fired a 9mm smg at a milk bottle and saw the rounds ricochet off leaving the bottle in one piece. Not what I expected at 10m. It could be I missed the bottle but i don't think so. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Muddy Funker Posted February 4, 2017 Report Share Posted February 4, 2017 I guess it's harder to get clover leaf groups when the target is trying to kill you or your mate with a machete. Who'd have thought it Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ordnance Posted February 4, 2017 Report Share Posted February 4, 2017 (edited) quite right......really i was questioning why the USA dropped the 45acp for the 9mm...it was partly thro' the arrogance of colt and refusal to develop a double stack magazine as opposed to the 9mm beretta the defence ministry was accessing....too say the least the armed forces were gutted to lose the 45acp as they preffered a one shot and down gun as opposed to what some thought the 9mm didnt deliver enough downing power........... at any rate the offender was put down and unable to carry out his full promise....so job well done.........if in the same situation i would have proberly shot my foot off.............. cant be easy for the french.....keyed up and ready to go 24/7....just knowing it is going to happen again and again............just hope to god it dosnt spread over here.... I have to assume you are joking, few believe the old .45 myth anymore. Its as well it was not in England by the time the unarmed police waited for armed police to arrive there could have being a lot of dead civilians. Edited February 4, 2017 by ordnance Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kyska Posted February 4, 2017 Report Share Posted February 4, 2017 I have to assume you are joking, few believe the old .45 myth anymore. Its as well it was not in England by the time the unarmed police waited for armed police to arrive there could have being a lot of dead civilians. What do you mean? I've no idea about handgun calibres, interested. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ordnance Posted February 4, 2017 Report Share Posted February 4, 2017 (edited) What do you mean? I've no idea about handgun calibres, interested. There is a myth mostly in America but obviously migrating to the UK that anyone hit with the .45 will will be knocked of their feet and be dead before they hit the ground, and anyone hit with 9MM will not notice and keep on fighting. The 9MM is the most tried and tested handgun ammo in history it is used by most police and armed forces in the world, it was used by both the Germans and British during WW2. Some police forces and the FBI in America went to .40 after the FBI made a mess of an operation in Miami and blamed the calibre. Most police including the FBI are now returning to 9MM, the .45 it was only really popular in America. PS The movies have a lot to do with keeping the myth going. Bruce Willis - Last.Man.Standing Shootouts - YouTube ▶ 3:36 26 Jan 2013 - Uploaded by gb5uq Edited February 4, 2017 by ordnance Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
welsh1 Posted February 4, 2017 Report Share Posted February 4, 2017 9mm is a very effective round, in my past i have run numerous 9mm pistol ranges and you don't want to be on the receiving end. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Join the conversation
You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.
Note: Your post will require moderator approval before it will be visible.