Questions about a .223

[30-6]

I have had an acquire for a .223 for over a year. My decoying seems to be getting less through no fault of my own and to be honest sometimes I was struggling too much with the gear, I believe things happen for a reason so perhaps it is meant to be.

 

I enjoy going out with the rimmy's which is ok as recoil is negligible, and I only use 30g or less and don't fire that many in a session while decoying, and the odd alphamax is ok.

 

I used to go with a shotgun hound pack pre ban but have never owned a centre fire, so please advise me on questions as below.

 

Health problems (arthritis) and damaged spine are a big problem for me.

 

Q1 at 60 is it worth me getting a centre fire ?

 

Q2 how severe is the recoil of a .223 ? All shots would be off a tripod standing or sitting, can't lay prone. All rounds would be factory loads, and from the research I have done for fox, corvid and rabbit 40 to 56 grain would be best with a 1 in 12 twist rate and 20 inch barrel.

 

Q3 I would like to pay about £700, but can only see a tikka T3 series or a remington 700 series that do 1 in 12. Or have I missed any ?

 

More people seem to be asking me to deal with a "problem fox" , and when I try to oblige, you always get the odd one sitting out at 100 plus yds.

 

All advice much appreciated.

[30-6]

To add to above post can anyone recommend any particular models that they think would suit me ?

 

I would prefer to buy new.

 

Cheers

[Newbie to this]

Can't really help, but you are never too old for a centre fire.

 

Sorry I can't help with anything else.

[Mice!]

Have you had a read of the fox club on the other shooting/ vermin section? Plenty of info on there with the guys saying what there using, might even be someone close by you who you can meet up with??

[Stonepark]

A 223 recoils a about half of a 410 depending on weight of the gun, so not significant.

 

If you are after foxes (and not deer) a lighter recoiling rifle might be a 22 Hornet with about half the recoil of a 223 for the same gun.

 

For a work horse of a rifle cz are hard to beat with their 527 american in 223 or 22 Hornet

Edited September 26, 2017 by Stonepark

[team tractor]

The recoil is the same as a spring air rifle or a .410 really. It's smooth unlike bigger guns.

I picked a howa .223 stainless with mod and scope for £500 . I've fired 7-800 rounds through it in 3 years + and it's grouping 1/2" at 112 yards.

Flat shooting out to 250 yards

[cervusman]

A 223 has about the same recoil as a 410 or less if you have a moderator. I have a Remington 700 in 223 and use 50gr V-max bullets which are deadly for accuracy and the fox hates them. A friend of mine uses 40gr V-max factory loads in his 223. Go for it you won’t look back.

[Good shot?]

I'm 70 and only recently got my first centre fire..(pre owned) , CZ 527, .222 with 1-12 twist rate I believe with 21.5" barrel and I use 50g Hornady SP.. Negligible recoil. Bit top heavy with mod and scope to carry but manageable, I only use quad sticks. Age is no reason not to get one.

Got two fox on my first proper outing with it.

I have CZ .22LR and 17hmr and that's why I got CZ in centre fire, cannot fault CZ.

Where in Wales are you approximately?

Edited September 26, 2017 by Good shot?

[30-6]

Usually near Cardiff.

 

Seems all systems go then. Reason it is a .223 is because that's what was suggested on renewal last year, due to being a common calibre, ammo availability etc.

 

Am I right in thinking 40 to 55 grain ammo 1 in 12 twist with a 20 inch barrel would be best ?

 

Like I said, with that twist rate, only ones I can see are Remington 700 or tikka T3 X. But which model, are any more suited for tripod shooting, stock shape etc than another ?

 

Edit to add - did look at cz but they only have a 1 in 9 twist which from what I can understand is not preferred for light grain ammo.

Edited September 26, 2017 by 30-6

[Albert 888]

I have a 1:9 cz 527 23.5" it shoots 40g -60g home loads very well. For target I use 52g amax homelands and Fox I use 55g vmax factory rounds,muntjac 55g sp ppu factory rounds. My friend has the 1:12 527 he mainly shoots 40g and has shot 60g they both go well in that also.

Rifle recoil is a bit different than a shotgun you get more of a push feeling from a shotgun. A moderator makes a a 223 feel simular to a 22lr with no moderator.

I would get someone to let you have a go first to see what you think.

Good luck

[Benthejockey]

Go for it! You're never too old to be flinging lead round the countryside. It should be prescribed by the NHS in fact because it's good for your health. Had a bad day? Go and blast a few rabbits or foxes. Had a good day? Go and blast a few rabbits and foxes. Fed up? Go and blast a few rabbits and foxes. It's a cure all! My uncle got back into rifle shooting in the last 2/3 years after years away from it and hasn't looked back. The Howa packages are good value new and even better value second hand! The 223 is very soft shooting. When I shot his it didn't recoil enough to lose the sight picture so it's very nice to shoot.

[snow white]

Why not get a 17 hornet same ballistics as a 223.

[rangey]

I wouldn't worry about twist rate to much 1-9 or 1-12 will both shoot the bullets you need for foxing.if your going to be carrying around a lot,have a look at the howa mini action in 223.had a few shots with my mates the other week and was very impressed with it.my own howas are heavy 24"barrelled guns..ok from the truck and static but can get a bit heavy with n/v on top and long treks...never to old to enjoy shooting....

[njc110381]

You're over thinking things for the needs you have. Relax, it's all easy when you know how!

 

1. Yes of course it is. If you need one and feel you'd enjoy it, go for it.

 

2. If you can shoot a 12g of any form you can shoot a .223. I'd say the .223 recoils similar to a 28 bore. What do others think? It's certainly not anywhere near a 12g.

 

3. In that price range the Tikka is close. I'd suggest you speak to a few dealers and have a feel of what's available and aim for something comfortable for you. Almost all rifles are accurate and functional enough to do the job, it's just how snobby/fussy you are that takes it beyond that. I've never owned a single gun that wouldn't do the job, from a £50 rimfire to a multi thousand pound fancy centrefire. They all go bang and generally group under 1.5", which is a dead fox out to 200+ yards.

 

Don't worry about twist rate. The 1-12 will shoot up to about 55gr and the 1-9 is happy to go that low. It's around that weight ballpark that you want to be so I'd forget that as being an issue.

 

Are you able to get to Magor on the last Sunday of a month at some point? We have a range day down there and a few of us own various .222/.223 rifles that you'd be welcome to have a look at.

[kennett]

As said don't worry about the technicalities too much. I've got a howa in 223 and couldn't even tell you what twist it is, all I know that with factory norma 50g ballistic tips it will shoot 3 shots touching at 100yds+ and makes a wobbly mess of foxes. The recoil is negligible from a bipod on the bonnet and the noise is barely recognisable as a gunshot away from the rifle.

[activeviii]

First thing would be a light weight mod. Go for an over barrel.

You need light to keep the weight off you carrying shoulder. But light isn't as good as heavy to cut the recoil as much as possible. If you have the funding then a titanium but reading between the lines I would suggest something like the DPT and add an extra baffle just to cut the recoil down as much as you can. Not that the 223 does recoil to much.

 

Rifle I would go with the Tikka as their a little lighter than the rem, second hand in 12 twist will deal with the 40 grain bullet very well. You could also use a 222 f needs be.

 

You don't need 50 grain bullets. Lighten the recoil by dropping to a 40 grain.

 

Limb saver do a straight swap recoil pad that will cut the felt recoil as well.

 

Stick wise, try quad sticks as you then take no weight when shooting and its very accurate shooting, plus acts as walking stick.

 

It's taken me many years to find a light weight set up, I have spent to much money trying to find the best I can.

[Dunkield]

There is stainless T3 on Gunwatch at the moment that would be perfect for the OP.

[njc110381]

A spot on first rifle that. I really like Tikka rifles. Nice build quality and accuracy for not silly money. Stainless saves an awful lot of worrying about rust when you get home late and want to clean it the next morning.

[Dekers]

A 223 recoils a about half of a 410 depending on weight of the gun, so not significant.

 

If you are after foxes (and not deer) a lighter recoiling rifle might be a 22 Hornet with about half the recoil of a 223 for the same gun.

 

For a work horse of a rifle cz are hard to beat with their 527 american in 223 or 22 Hornet

 

 

I would tend to agree, the .223 CZ527 is a cracking bit of kit for the money, I believe the newer ones are also 1-12 but be careful as I think a lot of them are 1-9, for shooting out to 100 yards I wouldn't get to excited about either twist rate though!

Edited September 30, 2017 by Dekers

[Dekers]

A spot on first rifle that. I really like Tikka rifles. Nice build quality and accuracy for not silly money. Stainless saves an awful lot of worrying about rust when you get home late and want to clean it the next morning.

 

My T3Lite is 1-12, its my understanding that all the T3 .223 are 1-8 these days and 1-12 are available to order, who knows, GMK change with the wind.

 

Fact is, mine shoots everything from 40-80g without problem, but fundamentally lives on 55g!

 

Easy enough on foxes at 100 yards and easy on the shoulder!

[MrDaveO84]

I have a sako 75 deluxe A1 for sale in 223 1-12 twist if the op really wants to treat himself. It's absolutely mint

[Savhmr]

CZ527 if in a budget. Sporter profile version as opposed to heavier varmint one for lightness. Lovely little rifles, light enough, and very accurate. Wildcat or dpt mod, job done. Tikka T3 also good but pricier, Sako 75 probably my favourite.

 

Faster twist 1/8 or 1/9 allows greater bullet choice and flexibility for longer range work. Why bother? well, for practical consideration if taking charlie out to say 300 yes, it allows higher BC bullets, less affected by wind drift to be used but will still send a 50gr bullet out way over 3200fps.

Edited October 1, 2017 by Savhmr