BADGER.BRAD Posted February 7, 2020 Report Share Posted February 7, 2020 Not something I intend doing just yet but I've read that using fibre wads can result in a hole in the centre of the shot pattern as the wads punches through it, how is this avoided ? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Westley Posted February 7, 2020 Report Share Posted February 7, 2020 I used to load thousands of 12 bore cartridges using Winchester AA plastic cases with fibre and card wads. Although they never were patterned, I certainly managed to drop a lot of what was shot at, including geese. IF there were 'holes' in the patterns, it was never a problem. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Walker570 Posted February 7, 2020 Report Share Posted February 7, 2020 Not wishing to join Ditchie on 'holiday' for two weeks, that is a load of errrrr rubbish I load fibre wads in my 410 and get excellent coverage in the patterns. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dipper Posted February 7, 2020 Report Share Posted February 7, 2020 How did we go on before 🤑plastic ? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Walker570 Posted February 7, 2020 Report Share Posted February 7, 2020 4 minutes ago, dipper said: How did we go on before 🤑plastic ? According to some'experts' we missed a lot of birds or got them on the edge of the pattern. Total ballony. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
London Best Posted February 7, 2020 Report Share Posted February 7, 2020 11 minutes ago, Walker570 said: According to some'experts' we missed a lot of birds or got them on the edge of the pattern. Total ballony. Actually, most shooters still do that now! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TIGHTCHOKE Posted February 7, 2020 Report Share Posted February 7, 2020 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sitsinhedges Posted February 7, 2020 Report Share Posted February 7, 2020 I think you're confusing fibre wads with over shot cards when having rolled turn overs. Not that I think that happens with them. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sarah sbs Posted February 7, 2020 Report Share Posted February 7, 2020 Black powder home loaded cartridges can display an annular pattern on occasion. I thought this was more to do with the roll turn over and the fact it was black powder than the fibre wad. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Walker570 Posted February 7, 2020 Report Share Posted February 7, 2020 I have seen some slow mo films of shot strings with plastic wads but not with fibre, but I would doubt that a fibre wad would keep up with the shot after the whole lot left the barrel let alone plough through the shot string, disrupting it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
London Best Posted February 7, 2020 Report Share Posted February 7, 2020 I recall reading somewhere, years ago, that the over shot card was thought to interfere with the pattern as often as one in ten shots?? Dunno! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Spower Posted February 7, 2020 Report Share Posted February 7, 2020 My fibre wad homeloads in 12, 28 and .410 have all patterned more than satisfactory on the pattern plate from my experience. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Walker570 Posted February 7, 2020 Report Share Posted February 7, 2020 I have some factory Fiocchi 3 inch 18g with roll turnover overshot cards. I will give them a try next week and see the result. I also have some FOB with overshot cards 20g #9 I'll test one of those as well that light pellet in all essence should show if the card breaks up the pattern. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hawkfanz Posted February 8, 2020 Report Share Posted February 8, 2020 how on earth can the fibre wad overtake the lead,they come out the muzzle same speed,air resistance on the wad then slows it down quicker than the shot load,i think the first statement total rubbish. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
panoma1 Posted February 8, 2020 Report Share Posted February 8, 2020 33 minutes ago, hawkfanz said: how on earth can the fibre wad overtake the lead,they come out the muzzle same speed,air resistance on the wad then slows it down quicker than the shot load,i think the first statement total rubbish. That sounds right to me! The lightweight fibre wad is always to the rear of the shot load! How can it interfere with the shot? I can understand the theory of a card os wad on a RTO shell, deflecting a pellet or two on leaving the muzzle, but even if it is a fact........ I don’t consider it of any great importance! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BADGER.BRAD Posted February 8, 2020 Author Report Share Posted February 8, 2020 Thanks for all the replies everyone , I have three 12g under and over guns and thought I may swap a couple of them for something difference .410 ,20g or even a muzzle loading gun. As the cartridges for the .410 or 20 gauge guns are a little more expensive I thought about the possibility of reloading them then looked into it on Youtube and did a little reading and it did come up a few times that the over shot card can cause a hole in the centre of the shot pattern which made me wonder if that is the case how do Manufacturers do it. From what most of you say this is not the case. Thanks again everyone. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dave at kelton Posted February 8, 2020 Report Share Posted February 8, 2020 4 hours ago, hawkfanz said: how on earth can the fibre wad overtake the lead,they come out the muzzle same speed,air resistance on the wad then slows it down quicker than the shot load,i think the first statement total rubbish. I was going to say the same. Apart from my fowling guns where I use cup wads I load fibre and never noticed a problem. 26 minutes ago, BADGER.BRAD said: Thanks for all the replies everyone , I have three 12g under and over guns and thought I may swap a couple of them for something difference .410 ,20g or even a muzzle loading gun. As the cartridges for the .410 or 20 gauge guns are a little more expensive I thought about the possibility of reloading them then looked into it on Youtube and did a little reading and it did come up a few times that the over shot card can cause a hole in the centre of the shot pattern which made me wonder if that is the case how do Manufacturers do it. From what most of you say this is not the case. Thanks again everyone. Get a good usable muzzle loader and enjoy yourself. Great fun and just that bit different. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Perazzishot Posted February 8, 2020 Report Share Posted February 8, 2020 Potentially in an over bored gun I would imagine that escaping gasses going past the wad before the seal is made in the forcing cones could disrupt pattern. It could also be figured on the same principal on a heavy load especially that the wad could be initially moving faster than the payload it is pushing out, and again in an over bored gun push into the botton of of the pay load causing disruption to the pattern. was this the reason plastic wads were developed with petals? Or fibre wads with a plastic disc perform better! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
enfieldspares Posted February 8, 2020 Report Share Posted February 8, 2020 It was the overshot wad in old roll turnover cartridges that did this "hole" and then ONLY if fired through a barrel that was very open bored. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stonepark Posted February 8, 2020 Report Share Posted February 8, 2020 No issue with fibre wad and holes, nor top card. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rbrowning2 Posted February 8, 2020 Report Share Posted February 8, 2020 (edited) 43 minutes ago, Perazzishot said: Potentially in an over bored gun I would imagine that escaping gasses going past the wad before the seal is made in the forcing cones could disrupt pattern. It could also be figured on the same principal on a heavy load especially that the wad could be initially moving faster than the payload it is pushing out, and again in an over bored gun push into the botton of of the pay load causing disruption to the pattern. was this the reason plastic wads were developed with petals? Or fibre wads with a plastic disc perform better! Any gasses going past the wad before the seal is made in the forcing cone could only disrupt the pattern by balling, that is when lead pellets fuse together due to the escaping gasses being very hot. Given the wad is behind the shot, how can the wads ever be going faster than the shot? Yet alone initially within the barrel, surly the laws of physics just do not allow for that. +1 for Stonepark. Edited February 8, 2020 by rbrowning2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Perazzishot Posted February 8, 2020 Report Share Posted February 8, 2020 (edited) 2 hours ago, rbrowning2 said: Any gasses going past the wad before the seal is made in the forcing cone could only disrupt the pattern by balling, that is when lead pellets fuse together due to the escaping gasses being very hot. Given the wad is behind the shot, how can the wads ever be going faster than the shot? Yet alone initially within the barrel, surly the laws of physics just do not allow for that. +1 for Stonepark. Physics say the wad is moving before the pellets, if the pellets can then disperse sideways in an open bore then physics says that can happen. Like a fast car or train punching through the air the air is forced sideways, not pushed in front but that is very Basic physics! actually you also agree hot gasses mixing with shot especially soft game shot can cause some fusion disrupting the pattern! Edited February 8, 2020 by Perazzishot Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dipper Posted February 8, 2020 Report Share Posted February 8, 2020 As for gas getting past fiber wads all eley wads measure 750 .try getting a felt wad from your favourite cartridge and push it thro your gun with a cleaning rod it will be a tight fit. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Perazzishot Posted February 8, 2020 Report Share Posted February 8, 2020 1 minute ago, dipper said: As for gas getting past fiber wads all eley wads measure 750 .try getting a felt wad from your favourite cartridge and push it thro your gun with a cleaning rod it will be a tight fit. Nigel Teague is quoted as saying up to 30% pressure lost in over bored barrels with fibre and up to 15% with plastic after he did extensive research. Hence why as fibre becomes popular and more demanded bores are returning to 18.3/18.4 from the gun manufacturers. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dipper Posted February 8, 2020 Report Share Posted February 8, 2020 Before we had plastic there were a lot of old guns that had been lapped out so in fact over bored.In America in the 20s the super Foxes were over bored to 750 some more and they shot very tight patterns.All with felt wads. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Join the conversation
You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.
Note: Your post will require moderator approval before it will be visible.