Agriv8 Posted February 2, 2023 Report Share Posted February 2, 2023 Evening all just having a breather in van while out rat hunting. asked for a fac air rifle to go on my shiny new section 1 licence which is progressing along I belive So lambing time is due in a month or so and my quarry will be switching to corvids hassling mothers to be ! so fao looked through letter and approval to shoot over form from farmer and agreed on a fac air rifle is a good choice so i plumped for .177 fac as my sub 12 ratter is in.22 which is pcp bsa ultra so have charge bottle ! have I messed up ? and should I have gone for fac in .22 ? might still be time to switch so over to you air gunners to voice your opinions ps I have been using the 410 up until now but one shot and it clears the whole farm for 2 or 3 hours! Thanks Agriv8 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Spr1985 Posted February 2, 2023 Report Share Posted February 2, 2023 Could you possibly go for both? leaves you open to try both options and see which suits best. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ultrastu Posted February 2, 2023 Report Share Posted February 2, 2023 Ask for both . .177 and .25 . The .177 for elevated shots so squirrels birds in trees etc .and the .25 for ground quarry like rabbits and decoyed pige and crows . You will probably find with .25 and .177 a .22 fac air becomes irrelevant . As it does nothing as good as the other 2 .(in there areas .) Only 1 fac air .probably a .22 but it's still not as good as a .177 or .25 in there arena's Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ultrastu Posted February 2, 2023 Report Share Posted February 2, 2023 Specifically for crows on the deck over open ground then a .25 cal around 40 - 50 fpe is a fantastic tool . The main consideration is back stop as the .25 will plough right through a crow and keep going. So make sure there are no sheep behind (even at a 30 degree angle ) as the pellet can go off side ways .the .177 won't suffer from the pass through as much. But over open ground on a day with some wind your gonna be limited to around 50 for accuracy . .22 around 70 yds the .25 cal should hold out to around 90 yds for body shots and it will put them down . Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dougy Posted February 2, 2023 Report Share Posted February 2, 2023 Have they changed regarding FAC air Made no difference if you applied for FAC Air rifle it did not ask for calibre specific details. 177 would account for less shots per charge, personally i would go 22 and get the trajectory of the 177 with more hitting power, you would get average +975fps & 35ft/lb with the 22 but no where near that with 177 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Agriv8 Posted February 2, 2023 Author Report Share Posted February 2, 2023 I just asked for fac air on application form so maybe I will get to choose oh he did add a moderator as well which had not occurred to me ! Fao just kept asking what calibre so went .177 - it was a bit odd really he kept pointing out my sub12 .22 did not need to be in the cab with my other guns so I kept repeating there is room for it in the cab so why would I leave it lying around ! so seems to be more .22 in fac second hand so might give the office a call tomorrow as could do with knowing all is progressing before my 4 week extension expires! Keep the info coming to educate me ! thanks Agriv8 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
enfieldspares Posted February 2, 2023 Report Share Posted February 2, 2023 I use a BSA Scorpion T-10 that is sub 12ft/lbs so not FAC. But what I've always preferred is heavy for calibre bullets. That's why in that BSA I use the .177 Bisley Magnum. It's accurate and at 10.65 grains is the same weight as a more expensive .177 RWS Superfield Heavy. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dave-G Posted February 2, 2023 Report Share Posted February 2, 2023 I had the same quandary when choosing my FAC air several years ago. At that time almost everyone described .177 as almost wasteful and most advised a .22 as a best all rounder for rabbits in particular but almost anything lesser if I got a variable power .22. As it turns out my .22 BTAS FAC FX Cyclone carbine achieves a similar trajectory at 26ftlb as a 12ftlb 177 but with the larger clout and slightly reduced pass through - dependent on the three power settings. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mice! Posted February 2, 2023 Report Share Posted February 2, 2023 55 minutes ago, Agriv8 said: so seems to be more .22 in fac second hand so might give the office a call tomorrow as could do with knowing all is progressing before my 4 week extension expires! Definitely more choice for 22 in fac. Probably depends on what range you want to shoot and what you want to spend, lots of cheap ish second hand options, but if you go new in 25 it won't be cheap. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Good shot? Posted February 3, 2023 Report Share Posted February 3, 2023 Between the .177 and .22 options I personally have gone with the .22. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Andycf Posted February 3, 2023 Report Share Posted February 3, 2023 Having used both .22 & .25 for pest control I have settled on .22 using an FX Dreamline running at 40ft/lbs producing 1062ft/sec it provides more than enough clout using hades 15.89gr pellets, very quiet and is superbly accurate Squirrels & Corvids are dispatched cleanly! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
oldypigeonpopper Posted February 3, 2023 Report Share Posted February 3, 2023 Hello, 22, plenty of good branded pellets to choose from, Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
oowee Posted February 3, 2023 Report Share Posted February 3, 2023 15 hours ago, Dougy said: Have they changed regarding FAC air Made no difference if you applied for FAC Air rifle it did not ask for calibre specific details. 177 would account for less shots per charge, personally i would go 22 and get the trajectory of the 177 with more hitting power, you would get average +975fps & 35ft/lb with the 22 but no where near that with 177 I tried leaving my application blank and they insisted I put a calibre in. I went for .22 again. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ultrastu Posted February 3, 2023 Report Share Posted February 3, 2023 (edited) A fac .177 will use less air at 17 fpe than a .22 at 30 fpe . That's very obvious and much less than a .25 cal at 50 fpe . So if you were wanting a small /light pcp with a reasonable shot count then .177 is the better choice . As you go up in cal and power you need a longer barrel with a bigger bottle /tube of air . When you get to .25 cal bullpups are best as other wise they(rifles ) get very long and heavy out front . Edited February 4, 2023 by Ultrastu Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dougy Posted February 3, 2023 Report Share Posted February 3, 2023 22 minutes ago, oowee said: I tried leaving my application blank and they insisted I put a calibre in. I went for .22 again. Just a silly rule for FAC air, I would be stubborn and ask why i needed to specify a particular calibre. It has to be added onto your ticket at point of sale so whats the reasoning. Ive not asked for any variation for a while (6 years i think) but when i did i asked for 17 cf, yes i we did go through the "must state calibre" my variation came back with authority to purchase 17 cf. But realy FAC Air Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ultrastu Posted February 3, 2023 Report Share Posted February 3, 2023 Thing is we can have fac air these days that the can make a .22 lr look like a toy and hit with more energy at 100 yds than a 17 hmr . That would be a .35 cal 100 grn slug . A beast of a projectile that's as leathal as a 9 mm bullet . I'm not surprised your feo is asking which calibre . - you should also already know your answer before application its expected that you will have done your research and applied for the correct tool and calibre for your specific "problem quarry " Dithering and uncertainty won't help your application . Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Agriv8 Posted February 3, 2023 Author Report Share Posted February 3, 2023 (edited) Hi ultrastu first venture into fac so the form had me guessing a bit. my homework said either would do And as I had acquired a fine bsa ultra from some fellow on here😜I plumbed for .177 it was only when I started costing that decision did I realise fac 177 are not as available as in.22 All hell broke loose at work so plan to pick this up with fao next week. had a natter with my farmer freind last night while locating his old deaf sheepdog ( isn’t thermal useful! ) and discussed hide locations on his lambing fields that will get me desired backstop. in reality .177 sounds like safer ( less pass through risk ) but more susceptible to wind and shorter killing range if a177 what comes through on new ticket I recon i will shoot within my limits and that of the gun I will purcase thanks for the info from all of you that have real world experience in this field ( usually literally) ATB Agriv8 Edited February 3, 2023 by Agriv8 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Weihrauch17 Posted February 3, 2023 Report Share Posted February 3, 2023 23 hours ago, Agriv8 said: Evening all just having a breather in van while out rat hunting. asked for a fac air rifle to go on my shiny new section 1 licence which is progressing along I belive So lambing time is due in a month or so and my quarry will be switching to corvids hassling mothers to be ! so fao looked through letter and approval to shoot over form from farmer and agreed on a fac air rifle is a good choice so i plumped for .177 fac as my sub 12 ratter is in.22 which is pcp bsa ultra so have charge bottle ! have I messed up ? and should I have gone for fac in .22 ? might still be time to switch so over to you air gunners to voice your opinions ps I have been using the 410 up until now but one shot and it clears the whole farm for 2 or 3 hours! Thanks Agriv8 Should have gone for a 204! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ultrastu Posted February 3, 2023 Report Share Posted February 3, 2023 1 hour ago, Agriv8 said: Hi ultrastu first venture into fac so the form had me guessing a bit. my homework said either would do And as I had acquired a fine bsa ultra from some fellow on here😜I plumbed for .177 it was only when I started costing that decision did I realise fac 177 are not as available as in.22 All hell broke loose at work so plan to pick this up with fao next week. had a natter with my farmer freind last night while locating his old deaf sheepdog ( isn’t thermal useful! ) and discussed hide locations on his lambing fields that will get me desired backstop. in reality .177 sounds like safer ( less pass through risk ) but more susceptible to wind and shorter killing range if a177 what comes through on new ticket I recon i will shoot within my limits and that of the gun I will purcase thanks for the info from all of you that have real world experience in this field ( usually literally) ATB Agriv8 That's. Cool .I'm in no way criticising you about your fac .application and asking on here is a great way of being prepared for the feo. A .177 fac can be a great tool . And if you want to really smack quarry .you can shoot 13 grn slugs at 1050 fps these expand and really hold well in the wind .the only problem is they can be hard to get the right gun / tune to get them shooting accurately . A safer bet /easier , for the same smack / energy is the bigger caliber like .25 . Where you can use pellets instead of slugs . Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ultrastu Posted February 3, 2023 Report Share Posted February 3, 2023 (edited) To be fair to .177 fac (in pellet form ) if you run a jsb heavy (amazing bc on these ) at say 950 fps for around 20 fpe these still hold 11 fpe at 70 yds which is more than enough energy for a crow . You can zero at 50 yds and only 3 inches of hold over at 70 yds which is pretty useful and a flat trajectory . To get this power you will probably need a pretty long barrel ( 18 inches plus) so think bullpup or decent bottle gun like an r10 or daystate . Or even a big hatsan . Good thing about a set up like this is that it will do what is required out to around 70 yds .but at say 100yds plus after hitting the ground or quarry won't have much energy left to do any damage (it's only a 10 grn pellet. ) as opposed to say a 25 grn .25 or heavy .22 that takes a lot of stopping even after going through stuff or bouncing of the soil . Just don't expect to drop crows at 100 yds with it .(I certainly haven't got the power or projectiles in .177 to achieve that in my arsenal yet ) . 11 hours ago, Ultrastu said: . Edited February 4, 2023 by Ultrastu Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Agriv8 Posted February 3, 2023 Author Report Share Posted February 3, 2023 (edited) 1 hour ago, Weihrauch17 said: Should have gone for a 204! wish we could all shoot like https://forums.pigeonwatch.co.uk/forums/profile/56146-simon6ppc/ but it you’d had seen my barrel bounce about at 30 yards never mind 300 ! Agriv8 Edited February 3, 2023 by Agriv8 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mice! Posted February 3, 2023 Report Share Posted February 3, 2023 8 hours ago, Dougy said: Just a silly rule for FAC air, I would be stubborn and ask why i needed to specify a particular calibre. It has to be added onto your ticket at point of sale so whats the reasoning. The first thing I thought was it should be anything up to .25 3 hours ago, Ultrastu said: That would be a .35 cal 100 grn slug . Because. 30 and up is easily obtainable these days and will carry some serious power. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tweedledee Posted February 5, 2023 Report Share Posted February 5, 2023 177 fac will kill but it's slightly harder work....have had both and it's 22 fac for me all the way Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
THEINVISIBLESCARECROW Posted February 8, 2023 Report Share Posted February 8, 2023 (edited) On my grant years ago I asked for .177 & .22 & told the FEO at visit time my intention was a sub 12ftb HW80 collection to use one rifle swopping barrels so the seriel number would be the same on both cal' & I would self FAC the rifle. No problem with that theory but as soon as my ticket arrived I was offered a .177 pcp at a price not to be missed. Used it for a while, about 2 years, realised not for me & sold it on. I then got a .22 pcp when I sold the .177 & that's a keeper. The .177 turned into a HMR variation. Why not apply for both ? With the price of powder power ammo sky rocketing I'm casualy thinking of useing FAC air a little more. Edited February 8, 2023 by THEINVISIBLESCARECROW Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
villaman Posted February 9, 2023 Report Share Posted February 9, 2023 Really can’t see the point of .177 FAC when you could get the same results with .22 using lighter pellets. With .22 you have a great choice of pellets or slugs . A good aground FAC gun , specially with Fx guns so tuneable for pellet or slug in fact can’t see the point of .22lr and more with FAC air now days Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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