I am off to protest: 20mph Wales

[captainhastings]

This is one occasion of many when they should listen to the people as they work for us 

[discobob]

1 hour ago, Poor Shot said:

It feels to me that the Senedd is often prone to ignoring anything other than their own opinion and they'll double down on this despite the clear dislike of these new speed limits from the vast majority of the population.

I agree - the last one was a load of lip service - This one they will quote Edinburgh study while ignoring the more widely recognized Belfast Study yadda yadda yadda - however, people are finally waking up to this waste of money - a lot of outrage is now brewing over the increase of 36 Assembly Members at an average cost of £500,000 per AM as a lot of people are starting to twig that they may never be able to get labour out with this type of set up. There are a lot of calls to abolish the WA. 

Lets face it, this "Devolution" is actually a EU/Globalist idea to split the country(s) up and even the cities - a divided people are easier to conquer....

[Poor Shot]

39 minutes ago, discobob said:

There are a lot of calls to abolish the WA. 

 

I fully support the abolition of the WA. It was a great idea in theory but it's quickly being turned into a socialists wet dream by extremists for the benefit of extremists. We run the risk of ending up in basket case country without a pot to **** in. Don't get me started on Welsh independence... 

I'm not saying that 100% rule by Westminster is ideal but from where I'm sat it's the best option we have available. 

[Gordon R]

The UK only needs the one Parliament. The others are just a complete waste of time. More MPs, more Ministers, way more Civil Servants. 

20 mph limit in Wales will cost businesses, tourism and extra costs of signage, plus the cost of enforcement. Enforcement officials will cost a real chunk, unless they expect the Police to divert their resources away from murder, robbery, mugging, rape, shoplifting etc, etc.

As someone has pointed out, the next logical step would be 10mph on normal roads, with perhaps a new 30mph on motorways / dual carriageways.

I am appalled by the way the Tories are running the country, but more worried by the alternatives - Starmer, Jimmy Krankie (before her fall), Drakeford, Khan, Yousaf etc.

[discobob]

20 minutes ago, Poor Shot said:

I'm not saying that 100% rule by Westminster is ideal but from where I'm sat it's the best option we have available. 

I fully agree with that - but if not - we can sell water to England!!

I am on the groups pushing for a Peoples Union that would take on the Assembly over this - and other things at a legislative level - Party Agnostic - because you have NW Wales who will vote Plaid till hell freezes over, and also the same down the Valleys (and parts of NE Wales) and would never vote for conservatives. And that is where the problem stems from and the division just lets labour in again and again - and they can call on Plaid as a militant wing. People call the voting methods that are used by immigrant families in London etc where the head of the family casts the vote for all of them.

Well, this has been going on for decades in Wales.... I will never vote Conservatives because my great grandad would turn in his grave......

On another thing that I have heard - there is apparently a movement to make it a requirement employees to be able to speak Welsh in Private Sector Jobs in Wales.....

[London Best]

Just imagine........if every motorist living in Wales was to vote Conservative as a protest against 20 limits next time.

[Poor Shot]

16 minutes ago, London Best said:

Just imagine........if every motorist living in Wales was to vote Conservative as a protest against 20 limits next time.

There are voters in Wales (who appear to be of sound mind) that wouldn't vote conservative if it meant their first born child would be burnt at the stake and their grannies hands would be chopped off as a result. 

We truly do not deserve the right to vote if we are going to use it so irresponsibly. 

[Mice!]

4 hours ago, Ratlegs said:

Near our school, there are flashing speed signs both ways average speed is 47 including HGVs

I would gladly see speed cameras outside all schools on roads that need them, speed limits shouldn't be higher than 30mph even on main roads going past schools.

The numbers of cameras you see now are ridiculous,  it's pure money making, I go past two every week on the A590, one facing each way, on a rural road, with no reason for it to be that at all 60mph, yet people will slow down to 45 and creep past.

Drive around Preston or Blackburn these days and it's either average speed cameras or cameras on hills

[welsh1]

1 hour ago, Mice! said:

I would gladly see speed cameras outside all schools on roads that need them, speed limits shouldn't be higher than 30mph even on main roads going past schools.

The numbers of cameras you see now are ridiculous,  it's pure money making, I go past two every week on the A590, one facing each way, on a rural road, with no reason for it to be that at all 60mph, yet people will slow down to 45 and creep past.

Drive around Preston or Blackburn these days and it's either average speed cameras or cameras on hills

One of the schools i drive past on the way to work now has 20mph signs going one way and 30mph signs going the other way, so much for improving kids safety.

[captainhastings]

Made me laugh too when you turn out the village onto single lane bendy back road there’s a 60 sign.  Idiots 

[Poor Shot]

1 hour ago, Mice! said:

I would gladly see speed cameras outside all schools on roads that need them, speed limits shouldn't be higher than 30mph even on main roads going past schools.

The numbers of cameras you see now are ridiculous,  it's pure money making, I go past two every week on the A590, one facing each way, on a rural road, with no reason for it to be that at all 60mph, yet people will slow down to 45 and creep past.

Drive around Preston or Blackburn these days and it's either average speed cameras or cameras on hills

Disagree. I would much rather that people are able to drive past a school giving their full attention to the road ahead than people keeping one eye plastered to the speedo to ensure they don't creep above an arbitrary limit and get fined. 

Perhaps some police resource could be given in the form of an officer or PSCO stood outside the school gates at pickup and drop off times. A right good telling off in front of the other parents would hit them right in the embarrassment and would serve as a much better and safer deterrent.  Said officer could also tackle phone use, parents parking on the yellow zig zags, littering and all the other issues that come with school drop off and pick up. Anyone speeding past but not stopping could be noted and stopped elsewhere on the road network for a talking to. 

[discobob]

2 minutes ago, Poor Shot said:

Disagree. I would much rather that people are able to drive past a school giving their full attention to the road ahead than people keeping one eye plastered to the speedo to ensure they don't creep above an arbitrary limit and get fined. 

Perhaps some police resource could be given in the form of an officer or PSCO stood outside the school gates at pickup and drop off times. A right good telling off in front of the other parents would hit them right in the embarrassment and would serve as a much better and safer deterrent.  Said officer could also tackle phone use, parents parking on the yellow zig zags, littering and all the other issues that come with school drop off and pick up. Anyone speeding past but not stopping could be noted and stopped elsewhere on the road network for a talking to. 

I live next to the 2nd biggest secondary school in Wales - apparently. A lot of the kids are shipped in and out from the surrounding areas. Also, a lot are brought by parents in their cars who don't give a **** about where they park and dump their car.

Our former (Independant) Councillor had been trying for years to get RTO for double yellow lines etc all around the school area. Well, when he lost his seat at the last elections, all that work was lost.... So much for safety of children. A couple of months ago we had the air ambulance land meters from our house to take a kid to hospital that had been knocked over on the main road - not caused by speed but by the parking.....

We have also campaigned for years for a crossing for the school - the first one is several hundred yards up the road and the path narrows right down at points. This was initially done selfishly as my wife had to walk up there with the kids to go to infants/juniors and she had to fight against them with the narrow paths as there was nowhere to cross. Kids from the school have to cross to get the bus at a stop that is the other direction from the crossing.

This main road supplies 3 schools with two of them being off on side roads. Also, that stretch has been 20 for quite a while now..

[Mice!]

1 hour ago, Poor Shot said:

Disagree. I would much rather that people are able to drive past a school giving their full attention to the road ahead than people keeping one eye plastered to the speedo to ensure they don't creep above an arbitrary limit and get fined. 

Perhaps some police resource could be given in the form of an officer or PSCO stood outside the school gates at pickup and drop off times. A right good telling off in front of the other parents would hit them right in the embarrassment and would serve as a much better and safer deterrent.  Said officer could also tackle phone use, parents parking on the yellow zig zags, littering and all the other issues that come with school drop off and pick up. Anyone speeding past but not stopping could be noted and stopped elsewhere on the road network for a talking to. 

Your having a laugh aren't you, a police officer or PCSO outside every school 😳 then more to stop them up the road 😅😅

There's nothing hard about thinking school it's 30, and there's a camera, people only slow down if there's a risk of getting caught.

Personally I slow down anyway when there are kids everywhere,  you just never know what they're going to do.

[ShootingEgg]

1 hour ago, Mice! said:

Your having a laugh aren't you, a police officer or PCSO outside every school 😳 then more to stop them up the road 😅😅

There's nothing hard about thinking school it's 30, and there's a camera, people only slow down if there's a risk of getting caught.

Personally I slow down anyway when there are kids everywhere,  you just never know what they're going to do.

If people were going to speed in a 30 they will speed in a 20, like anyone who breaks the law, changing the rule won't change a thing 

[Yellow Bear]

8 minutes ago, ShootingEgg said:

If people were going to speed in a 30 they will speed in a 20, like anyone who breaks the law, changing the rule won't change a thing 

Makes more money on fines though

[ShootingEgg]

13 minutes ago, Yellow Bear said:

Makes more money on fines though

That it does but won't stop the idiots doing 40+ on the roads. Just makes pedestrians Less aware as the expect to see a car at snail pace

[Poor Shot]

1 hour ago, Mice! said:

Your having a laugh aren't you, a police officer or PCSO outside every school 😳 then more to stop them up the road 😅😅

There's nothing hard about thinking school it's 30, and there's a camera, people only slow down if there's a risk of getting caught.

Personally I slow down anyway when there are kids everywhere,  you just never know what they're going to do.

The Senedd has apparently spent a huge sum on 32 new Gosafe camera vans, operators and additional admin staff to support the anticipated rise in fines from the change in limit. That budget could well have been spent on additional police resources to help keep school zones safe. Or perhaps a small percentage of the £32m spent on changing signage?

It wouldn't need to be every school every day but a randomised approach with an initial heavy presence to establish that school zones will be policed.

[strimmer_13]

made me laugh when I got sent this earlier 

[Mice!]

1 hour ago, ShootingEgg said:

If people were going to speed in a 30 they will speed in a 20, like anyone who breaks the law, changing the rule won't change a thing 

You don't speed past a known speed camera,  unless your a total muppet. 

40 minutes ago, Poor Shot said:

The Senedd has apparently spent a huge sum on 32 new Gosafe camera vans, operators and additional admin staff to support the anticipated rise in fines from the change in limit. That budget could well have been spent on additional police resources to help keep school zones safe. Or perhaps a small percentage of the £32m spent on changing signage?

It wouldn't need to be every school every day but a randomised approach with an initial heavy presence to establish that school zones will be policed.

32 new vans is just ridiculous,  that's a pure money making scheme, there always positioned around bends or hidden somewhere. 

And £32 million on signage,, total madness as if it was spare money that needed spending. 

43 minutes ago, Poor Shot said:

wouldn't need to be every school every day but a randomised approach with an initial heavy presence to establish that school zones will be policed.

I'd just rather they put up a camera outside schools as its a permanent deterrent, that would be money well spent,  they are happy enough to put them everywhere on the dumb motorways. 

[Poor Shot]

16 minutes ago, Mice! said:

You don't speed past a known speed camera,  unless your a total muppet. 

The problem with fixed cameras is that they can only provide enforcement in the immediate area covered by the camera. Average speed cameras mitigate this but aren't perfect. Most areas that would benefit from ASCs are littered with junctions which make taking an exact average difficult. 

We also know that the issues in the vast majority of incidents aren't solely caused by speed but are more often other factors such as distraction, intoxication, phone use etc. A fixed speed enforcement camera cannot detect phone use, a school run mum applying makeup while driving, white van man eating his breakfast etc. They have a very limited scope. 

[WalkedUp]

On 15/09/2023 at 11:05, discobob said:

Wales has stopped all road improvements - including bypasses etc. that have been planned for years (so that money has been wasted) that would remove vehicles from a lot of places.

20mph just at the bottom of our road - a few months ago we had an air ambulance taking a kid to school that had been knocked over... main cause - all the stupid parking done by parents to pick their precious up - and despite years of complaining (it makes it nigh on impossible to get into our lane safely) nothing has been done about it (by a labour council)....

Our lane, is a public footpath, a shared surface, a safer routes to schools - it was upgraded from being a rough lane just at the start of lockdown - funded by a house builder who was building an estate on a meadow field not far from us...We have cars flying up it at up to 60/70 mph at times. Many complaints about it - what is done - nada.

I believe in 20 in the right places

This is 20 by us - a rural road

It isn't a built up residential area.....

Small world, I have four permissions within spitting distance of your house! 

[TOPGUN749]

On 15/09/2023 at 16:52, Yellow Bear said:

 

Following on from this I offer the iniquity 

Moped - petrol motor assisted pedal power - fully covered by law ie helmet, tax, insurance, number plate,  RFL, speed limits, and test or L plates.

Electric cycle - electric  motor assisted pedal power - NOT covered by law ie   NO  helmet, tax, insurance, number plate, RFL, speed limits, and test or L plates.

Both travel at similar speeds but one must not "pick on" the cyclist

The legal electric bikes with 250watt motors can only power up to 15.5 mph while pedalling,mopeds can reach around 30mph. The more powerful electric bikes 500-1000 watts are illegal on roads without tax insurance licence etc.

[Yellow Bear]

2 hours ago, TOPGUN749 said:

The legal electric bikes with 250watt motors can only power up to 15.5 mph while pedalling,mopeds can reach around 30mph. The more powerful electric bikes 500-1000 watts are illegal on roads without tax insurance licence etc.

This maybe the rule.   Matlock has a 20 limit in the town centre  but I have twice been over taken by EBs whilst slowing from 30 at the start.  This was not on the hills buy on the main valley bottom road which is flat, and one was not even peddling.    In fact I am often overtaken by those peddling in this area.

 

Edited September 20, 2023 by Yellow Bear

[RyanMc]

Labour told to U-turn on 'disastrous' 20mph speed limit in Wales as petition explodes (msn.com)

[discobob]

petition should be at close to 300K now.... 10% of the population