State Pension

[Penelope]

45 minutes ago, enfieldspares said:

Smoke and mirrors. It's the immigrants fault my state pension is poor, it's the woman down the road with six kids by three different fathers fault my state pension is poor. When the reality is Johnson has lead the UK into spaffing billions on Zelensky and Ukraine and then spaffed an almost equal eye watering sum on PPE equipment from Tory Party cronies. 

It's just easy though to blame some poor man in a boat or some poor woman in a council house rather than admit that the money actually is there but it can't be had because doing so would make the life of offshore fundholders like Jacob-Rees Mogg and and his cohort uncomfortably enough impoverished to have to have only the the one bottle of wine at dinner.

No, I was just clarifying where that particular £24 Billion has been spent, no more, no less.

[clangerman]

42 minutes ago, sportsbob said:

"poor woman in a council house" should be responsible for her own actions and not sponge of the people that get off their **** and go to work.

just like I did she’s probably raising two kids alone so sitting on her backside or even being sick is a luxury she can’t afford I worked doing it and still you had to top my wages up which would not have cost you a penny if gov made absent parents pay maintenance instead of letting them avoiding paying it 

[johnphilip]

The cost is 36 Billion 

https://youtu.be/0vjdZ3ahFiY?si=xH3xWn9Ovf78_T5X

[oowee]

6 hours ago, enfieldspares said:

But in every case they'd have been better off and received a better return than they have received by the state taking that money from them.

And lastly if they do or did pay into a private pension they did not expect Gordon Brown to the rip the backside out of it in 1997.

 

State pension is the cheapest pension you can buy far better return than any private pension. 

Brown merely taxed dividends on income paid to funds, putting them in exactly the same position as other businesses. Subsequent governments have not reversed the change. 

This govt has changed the receipt age for Sipp pension withdrawal.  Many were encouraged to pay into Sipp (a private pension pot) with an agreement that they could withdraw at 55.  This has been changed on a whim, not part of the contract for those paying in their own cash. The whole purpose for some being to use the cash to provide a pension before other schemes kick in. 

This govt has cut tax relief on private pension contributions and restricted the life time allowances.

Whatever changes are made need to be slower so that people have the opportunity to adjust savings accordingly. Retrospective changes should not be permitted. Unfortunately we have lost the protection of article 41 of the EU so it would be reasonable to expect changes to be less fair going forward. 

 

[Charliedog]

16 minutes ago, oowee said:

State pension is the cheapest pension you can buy far better return than any private pension. 

Brown merely taxed dividends on income paid to funds, putting them in exactly the same position as other businesses. Subsequent governments have not reversed the change. 

This govt has changed the receipt age for Sipp pension withdrawal.  Many were encouraged to pay into Sipp (a private pension pot) with an agreement that they could withdraw at 55.  This has been changed on a whim, not part of the contract for those paying in their own cash. The whole purpose for some being to use the cash to provide a pension before other schemes kick in. 

This govt has cut tax relief on private pension contributions and restricted the life time allowances.

Whatever changes are made need to be slower so that people have the opportunity to adjust savings accordingly. Retrospective changes should not be permitted. Unfortunately we have lost the protection of article 41 of the EU so it would be reasonable to expect changes to be less fair going forward. 

 

Not sure this is correct, I can start claiming my private pension at 55 (rising to 57 in 4 years time from memory), I pay no tax on my contributions and the lifetime allowance is over £1 million pounds (which is sufficient for most)?

8 minutes ago, Charliedog said:

Not sure this is correct, I can start claiming my private pension at 55 (rising to 57 in 4 years time from memory), I pay no tax on my contributions and the lifetime allowance is over £1 million pounds (which is sufficient for most)?

And the limit on the lifetime allowance is to be abolished in April 2024 by the current government?

Edited February 21 by Charliedog
update

[bigroomboy]

1 hour ago, johnphilip said:

The cost is 36 Billion 

https://youtu.be/0vjdZ3ahFiY?si=xH3xWn9Ovf78_T5X

Clearly skewed figures. 1) he is the product of migration so it's a bit ironic getting all nationalist about it. 2) foreign students contribute massively to the economy by paying for large parts of our university system. To get a foreign student visa you need to get a university place, prove you are financially independent, including the ability to pay huge fees and accomodation costs and you are not entitled to income benefits. Yes they benefit from health, social care, policing, council services whilst here just like any other student. You could put a number on that eg. £12b but it's far less than the money being put into the economy. If you are really lucky they will stay here with their advanced skills and potentially be the person that saves you life as a doctor or scientific researcher.

[oowee]

51 minutes ago, Charliedog said:

Not sure this is correct, I can start claiming my private pension at 55 (rising to 57 in 4 years time from memory), I pay no tax on my contributions and the lifetime allowance is over £1 million pounds (which is sufficient for most)?

And the limit on the lifetime allowance is to be abolished in April 2024 by the current government?

I think that what I said, when I said the age at which you can draw it has increased. My wife retired at 48 and was expecting to draw Sipp at 55 but that has been pushed back two years. Also the pension contribution allowance for tax purposes was made subject to taper. The more you earned the less tax relief was available. 

The point I wanted to make is not so much the individual changes but the speed with which they are introduced or otherwise makes it difficult to plan. 

 

[Wymondley]

1 hour ago, bigroomboy said:

If you are really lucky they will stay here with their advanced skills and potentially be the person that saves you life as a doctor or scientific researcher.

Or they could go back to their own countries and improve society there to the extent that people don't need to risk their lives  traveling half way round the world for the chance of a better future.

[Lloyd90]

[johnphilip]

39 minutes ago, Wymondley said:

Or they could go back to their own countries and improve society there to the extent that people don't need to risk their lives  traveling half way round the world for the chance of a better future.

Is the right answer. 

[bigroomboy]

21 minutes ago, johnphilip said:

Is the right answer. 

So you would rather the NHS collapse and you can't get the treatment you need than be treated by a foreign doctor? Seems nuts to me, but then I'm not a heavy user of the NHS, if this were true across the board though I don't think we would be seeing the pressure on the NHS that we are?

[johnphilip]

15 minutes ago, bigroomboy said:

So you would rather the NHS collapse and you can't get the treatment you need than be treated by a foreign doctor? Seems nuts to me, but then I'm not a heavy user of the NHS, if this were true across the board though I don't think we would be seeing the pressure on the NHS that we are?

No I would rather we had people in this country  learning these professionals careers. 

These people coming here are a drain on there own countries health services. 

The pressure on the NHS is down to the covid issues  and delays in treatment and the great increase in migration. More demand on the NHS

 

Those coming here as you say to become NHS staff Is not  working is it , as we still have a shortage .hence the need to train out own staff 

 

 

 

Edited February 21 by johnphilip

[bigroomboy]

3 minutes ago, johnphilip said:

No I would rather we had people in this country  learning these professionals careers. 

These people coming here are a drain on there own countries health services. 

The pressure on the NHS is down to the covid issues  and delays in treatmeny , and the great increase in migration. More demand on the NHS

 

Those coming here as you say to become NHS staff Is notwe  working is it , as we still have a shortage .hence the need to train out own staff 

 

 

 

I agree it causes a brain drain in other counties, but I think it's clear the strain on the NHS is coming from increasing life expectancy and an older population, not from migrants.

It's amazing how many things can be blamed on migration. It may be an easy excuse, but if we don't understand the root cause of our issues we have no chance of fixing them.

[Wymondley]

3 minutes ago, bigroomboy said:

So you would rather the NHS collapse and you can't get the treatment you need than be treated by a foreign doctor? Seems nuts to me, but then I'm not a heavy user of the NHS, if this were true across the board though I don't think we would be seeing the pressure on the NHS that we are?

Seems quite a "white privilege" view that we in the west should benefit from those willing and able to come here and learn, so they can care for us.

The NHS is already collapsing, if all the people in your third world country with the ability to train to be doctors, nurses and  carers have left for foreign shores, what will you do when you need a doctor, nurse or carer?

Follow them...

And be treated by, and be a burden on the health service they have joined, to the detriment of those actually paying for it.

And of course once here, why leave?

You have to break the cycle, make things better in other countries so there is less incentive to come here.

There is little that is wrong with this country that cannot be traced back to immigration/overpopulation, it's about numbers not the colour of anyone's skin.

There are many countries that struggle to rise above poverty, we do them no favours by creaming off the best of their population to serve ourselves.

 

[Cosmicblue]

On 20/02/2024 at 17:06, steve_b_wales said:

I'm still working full time. I no longer pay National Insurance but my state pension is classed as income, and therefore I am taxed on it.

Having retired last year and started drawing the state pension from  September (month following my 66th birthday) I was surprised to find that it is paid in full (i.e. no tax deducted) - every 4 weeks.  HMRC, who never miss a trick then deduct the tax for it from other pension income.  

[steve_b_wales]

18 hours ago, Cosmicblue said:

Having retired last year and started drawing the state pension from  September (month following my 66th birthday) I was surprised to find that it is paid in full (i.e. no tax deducted) - every 4 weeks.  HMRC, who never miss a trick then deduct the tax for it from other pension income.  

Mine too is paid in full but I'm taxed on my wages owing to still working full time. As mentioned, my personal tax allowance had been reduced by £10,400, meaning that my yearly state pension is wiped out by my lower personal tax allowance. 

Edited February 22 by steve_b_wales

[12gauge82]

19 hours ago, Lloyd90 said:

They’re meant to make provisions for themselves so that when they reach retirement age, they have the means to retire and support themselves. 
 

Someone of working age is expected to have rent / mortgage, travel etc. 

I believe pensioners who don’t own their property are able to claim housing benefits to pay towards rent, as opposed to someone who’d paid off a mortgage and gets no money towards their housing costs. 
 

Once again, the “I’ve paid my stamp all my life” brigade, the vast vast majority of them have paid a tiny amount compared to the cost of the services provided. 
 

Either that, or they need to carry on working. Many people in the USA or similar places aren’t able to retire due to health costs and no pension plans. 
They get social security after a certain age (it’s higher if you take it later) but it’s only around $4000 a year. 
 

Here's the thing. There's plenty of money generated by the working masses in the UK, the problem seems to be where it all goes after that, one things for sure, it's not the people who laboured, wages have been stagnant, public services are a joke, infrastructure projects are not happening, yet the top percentage of society are wealthier than ever. Hitting pensioners is the last place we should be looking to make savings, if anything they should be given much more.

22 hours ago, bigroomboy said:

That's funny because that's exactly what I would say to you. I'm looking at this as everybody other than somebody reliant on the state pension. I'm thinking about our children in crumbling schools with 40 kids per teacher and no materials to do classes all while we spend twice as much on pensions than education. I'm thinking about the working people giving up 80% of their time to pay for these pensions knowing they will never get the same benefit. I'm thinking about the fact the country simply cannot afford to keep doing it. I'm thinking about the massive underinvestment in our infrastructure to pay for it and the closure of local facilities to pay for it. I suggest sir you take off your specs.

I can tell what your circumstances are from reading your narrow minded posts, yet you have totally misread mine. Perhaps you should widen your view point and consider it's not just those of working age who are toiling away who are struggling and hitting those who have worked all their life is not the right place to start.

[TRUEBRIT66]

10 hours ago, bigroomboy said:

I agree it causes a brain drain in other counties, but I think it's clear the strain on the NHS is coming from increasing life expectancy and an older population, not from migrants.

It's amazing how many things can be blamed on migration. It may be an easy excuse, but if we don't understand the root cause of our issues we have no chance of fixing them.

We all know the root cause of the problem, a shambles of a Government soon to be replaced by what could be a even bigger shambles of a Government.

Migration is not the problem but its a big £24 billion in four years part of the problem! The whole benefits system is flawed in this country but ask me if who I would rather receive benefits in the UK, someone who has contributed to the system for over 50+ years or someone who has just rocked up and not paid a penny. Any answer other than the first person is just insanity.     

[old man]

3 hours ago, TRUEBRIT66 said:

We all know the root cause of the problem, a shambles of a Government soon to be replaced by what could be a even bigger shambles of a Government.

Migration is not the problem but its a big £24 billion in four years part of the problem! The whole benefits system is flawed in this country but ask me if who I would rather receive benefits in the UK, someone who has contributed to the system for over 50+ years or someone who has just rocked up and not paid a penny. Any answer other than the first person is just insanity.     

Yes but if that were to happen just imagine the loss of politico prestige?

[12gauge82]

On 21/02/2024 at 09:12, Westley said:

That is probably why they raid 'Pickanic Baskets'   Boo Boo  !

If your lucky, you may find yourself a pensioner one day, I wonder if you'll be so flippent then.

Pensioners are vulnerable, if inflation causes them to find their living expenses unaffordable, or them needing care or help in the home due to the lack of government assistance, due to underfunding, they can't simply go back to work to make more money. When we as a country can pay billions for illegal immigrants, we should be looking after our pensioners.

[Westley]

6 minutes ago, 12gauge82 said:

If your lucky, you may find yourself a pensioner one day, I wonder if you'll be so flippent then.

Pensioners are vulnerable, if inflation causes them to find their living expenses unaffordable, or them needing care or help in the home due to the lack of government assistance, due to underfunding, they can't simply go back to work to make more money. When we as a country can pay billions for illegal immigrants, we should be looking after our pensioners.

For your information I am a  Pensioner of some 15 years, I just managed to retain my sense of humour though  !   🙄

[Westley]

15 minutes ago, Westley said:

For your information I am a  Pensioner of some 15 years, I just managed to retain my sense of humour though  !   🙄

I forgot to add, if you wish to look after me '   PM  me  !   🫠

Edited February 22 by Westley

[12gauge82]

34 minutes ago, Westley said:

For your information I am a  Pensioner of some 15 years, I just managed to retain my sense of humour though  !   🙄

Your comment went over my head, I didn't read it as a joke, the joys of speaking via Internet 👍

21 minutes ago, Westley said:

I forgot to add, if you wish to look after me '   PM  me  !   🫠

I already do via the serious amount of tax I pay 👌

[TRUEBRIT66]

Just popped up on my news feed

Britons could get ‘earlier access’ to state pension payments in Jeremy Hunt’s Budget (msn.com)

[Westley]

3 minutes ago, 12gauge82 said:

Your comment went over my head, I didn't read it as a joke, the joys of speaking via Internet 👍

I already do via the serious amount of tax I pay 👌

I also pay 'tax'  on my PENSION  !