m3vert Posted January 27, 2019 Report Share Posted January 27, 2019 Looks like there will be a shake up of the antique gun rules if the National Ballistics Intelligence Service get their way!! This will no doubt effect a lot of law abiding owners as usual. https://www.bbc.com/news/uk-england-merseyside-46841591 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rewulf Posted January 28, 2019 Report Share Posted January 28, 2019 The creeping death of private firearm ownership. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scully Posted January 28, 2019 Report Share Posted January 28, 2019 17 minutes ago, Rewulf said: The creeping death of private firearm ownership. Yep. We must surely be the laughing stock of the so called free world. You really couldn't make it up. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dibble Posted January 28, 2019 Report Share Posted January 28, 2019 (edited) What are they trying to achieve? I have a Lathe and a milling machine, give me a week in the garage and I could make you a smoothbore STEN gun. Ban machine tools and I could make a musket with a hacksaw, chisel and file ( and the right pipe). Your going to be banning a lot of stuff thinking you are keeping people safe ,I can Knapp flint as well! Edited January 28, 2019 by Dibble Clarifying that parts of post are hypothetical. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
243deer Posted January 28, 2019 Report Share Posted January 28, 2019 50 minutes ago, Dibble said: What are they trying to achieve? votes Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kamyonsofor Posted January 28, 2019 Report Share Posted January 28, 2019 1 hour ago, Dibble said: What are they trying to achieve? I have a Lathe and a milling machine, give me a week in the garage and I'll make you a smoothbore STEN gun. Ban machine tools and I can make a musket with a hacksaw, chisel and file ( and the right pipe). Your going to be banning a lot of stuff thinking you are keeping people safe ,I can Knapp flint as well! Hi not being a "stick in the mud"but I think it would be wise to retract your post.Just to be on the safe side some people could read it in a different context as to how you want it to read. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rewulf Posted January 28, 2019 Report Share Posted January 28, 2019 18 minutes ago, kamyonsofor said: Hi not being a "stick in the mud"but I think it would be wise to retract your post.Just to be on the safe side some people could read it in a different context as to how you want it to read. Really ? Saying something is possible, doesnt mean they are going to do it. And if anyone reads what Dibble said in a 'different context' then its them thats the issue. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dibble Posted January 28, 2019 Report Share Posted January 28, 2019 (edited) Should I clarify to "I could make" and "I could build" I have no intention of doing so! Edited January 28, 2019 by Dibble Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mossy835 Posted January 28, 2019 Report Share Posted January 28, 2019 they will keep pecking away, till they get them all.just give it time. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dibble Posted January 28, 2019 Report Share Posted January 28, 2019 Edited it, if you want to edit or remove your quote Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scully Posted January 28, 2019 Report Share Posted January 28, 2019 1 hour ago, Dibble said: What are they trying to achieve? I seriously doubt they know themselves; they give the impression they are clutching at straws in their attempts to curb or stop certain ethnicities shooting each other, and not knowing how to achieve this ( and just as they have done with knife crime ) they target the easiest part of society there is, namely the law abiding. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dibble Posted January 28, 2019 Report Share Posted January 28, 2019 (edited) 21 minutes ago, Scully said: I seriously doubt they know themselves; they give the impression they are clutching at straws in their attempts to curb or stop certain ethnicities shooting each other, and not knowing how to achieve this ( and just as they have done with knife crime ) they target the easiest part of society there is, namely the law abiding. Or "Crime" as we used to know it before we realised removing knives from the world will remove all violent crime. I'm a Scout Leader and am often surrounded by youngsters of all ethnicities carrying knives, sometimes quite a lot of very large knives. Edited January 28, 2019 by Dibble Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pointy Hat Posted January 28, 2019 Report Share Posted January 28, 2019 NABIS said such weapons had been linked with at least four homicides. It said gangs had increasingly used antique firearms over the past 10 years to get around the UK's strict laws restricting access to handguns. Nonsense. Gangs easily have access to automatic weapons and shotguns and four homicides is nothing compared to the knife killings and acid attacks on our city streets. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bluesj Posted January 28, 2019 Report Share Posted January 28, 2019 I would guess that the number of antique firearms used in crime is very low, I know that ammo to fit a 44 Russian can reasonably easily made but at a couple of grand or more not really the cheapest option when you can buy a 9mm cz for £420 new and probably cheaper in eastern Europe and just drive back with it! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wascal Posted January 28, 2019 Report Share Posted January 28, 2019 42 minutes ago, Pointy Hat said: NABIS said such weapons had been linked with at least four homicides. A very quick google found 4 rolling pin murders within the last 5 years so - "BAN BAKING !!" Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lord v Posted January 28, 2019 Report Share Posted January 28, 2019 2 minutes ago, wascal said: A very quick google found 4 rolling pin murders within the last 5 years so - "BAN BAKING !!" That would certainly help my waistline as well. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Feltwad Posted January 28, 2019 Report Share Posted January 28, 2019 The antique gun rifle and pistol with its long dead crafts of the gun maker is a vital part of our gun heritage not too dispose of has we feel we hold them in trust for those that come after Feltwad Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
demonwolf444 Posted January 29, 2019 Report Share Posted January 29, 2019 Simple answer is just to have a collectors license where in the collector has to keep a record of sales and transfers between collectors much like an RFD but without the security aspect. Anyone without said license or who owns a gun that falls into license category without such a license can quickly and easily be prosecuted. I'm loathe to see any further restrictions but if its coming anyway we are probably better suggesting a method that is workable rather than being handed a restrictive set of laws which may damage collections of our heritage. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MartynGT4 Posted January 29, 2019 Report Share Posted January 29, 2019 2 hours ago, demonwolf444 said: Simple answer is just to have a collectors license where in the collector has to keep a record of sales and transfers between collectors much like an RFD but without the security aspect. Anyone without said license or who owns a gun that falls into license category without such a license can quickly and easily be prosecuted. I'm loathe to see any further restrictions but if its coming anyway we are probably better suggesting a method that is workable rather than being handed a restrictive set of laws which may damage collections of our heritage. This makes a lot of sense 👍 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rewulf Posted January 29, 2019 Report Share Posted January 29, 2019 (edited) 17 hours ago, Pointy Hat said: NABIS said such weapons had been linked with at least four homicides. It said gangs had increasingly used antique firearms over the past 10 years to get around the UK's strict laws restricting access to handguns. Does that mean they were the murder weapon ? Was it the same gun used in all 4 ? What does that mean 'restricting access to handguns' unless you have very special dispensation, there is NO access to handguns, but they are happy to state that gangs had increasingly used antique firearms, yet we only had 4 homicides that are 'linked' to them ? What kind of information gathering is that ? Ill tell you, its the kind of information designed to remove these kind of firearms from legal public ownership, OR , force them into deactivation. Meanwhile we have semi and fully automatic firearms and ammunition coming through our nice open borders probably every day.. Its like cutting your arm off because your nails need clipping Edited January 29, 2019 by Rewulf Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Benthejockey Posted January 30, 2019 Report Share Posted January 30, 2019 It’s all part of an anti shooting agenda over all. So potentially 4 antique firearms have been involved in violent crime. How many plastic BB guns have been used in armed robberies? I bet it’s more than 4. How many axe handles have been used in violent attacks? I bet it’s more than 4. How many terrorists used cars, vans or lorries in violent homicides? More than 4? Back on September the 11th how many planes fell out of the sky killing hundreds of people? They killed more than 4 people. Where do we draw the line? Ban everything? The most commonly used firearms in violent crime are illegally held and obtained. The bank robbers friend the old dawn off shotgun, 9mm handguns because they look gangstaaaaa and the good old AK47 because it’s cheap and almost indestructible. All of these are illegal to own. You wouldn’t even get a 9mm for HAD in this country I don’t think. I could be wrong. Instead of going after a perfectly legitimate and expensive hobby why don’t they get their act together and do some actual policing and target the actual criminals. Removing legally held firearms from legitimate owners would be a huge mistake. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vince Green Posted January 30, 2019 Report Share Posted January 30, 2019 (edited) On 28/01/2019 at 15:36, kamyonsofor said: Hi not being a "stick in the mud"but I think it would be wise to retract your post.Just to be on the safe side some people could read it in a different context as to how you want it to read. But he is not wrong, not that many years ago virtually all civilian guns were made in backstreet workshops in places like Birmingham or the East End of London using little more than hand tools. It wouldn't be hard to make a gun. Drugs and illegal immigrants seem to make it into this country with very little difficulty, why would it be any harder to smuggle in guns? Tackling that requires effort, banning antiques is way easier. Edited January 30, 2019 by Vince Green Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
1066 Posted January 30, 2019 Report Share Posted January 30, 2019 This is a ploy by NABIS to extend it's empire. I think an investigative journalist could have a field day digging into this organisation and it's funding, Private company/Public money/complete monopoly that all police forces signed up to. Remember this is the outfit that misinformed parliament in the recent High power and lever release rifle debate and also were behind the recent BBC production concerning antique weapons indicating that all the components to load cartridges could be bought online. It's also a fact that the number antiques firearms that have been linked to crime is actually falling from previous years. The four fatalities previously mentioned were over an eight year period. Among their advisors is Dr. Peter Squires, an avid anti-gun academic who is based at Brighton University. https://www.brighton.ac.uk/research-and-enterprise/groups/social-science-policy/research-areas/firearms-crime-and-gun-control.aspx https://theconversation.com/criminals-are-using-antique-weapons-due-to-a-loophole-in-uk-law-102666 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HW95J Posted January 30, 2019 Report Share Posted January 30, 2019 The most workable licensing solution would probably be something along the lines of the airgun one in Scotland i.e licensing the individual rather than specific guns. Having to prove 'legitimate' reason for ownership etc. Either way, there will be a significant amount of heritage lost through 'amnesties' etc if the law changes. I doubt the police will be advising individuals that there is potential historical/financial value in what they hand in. It'll just be straight into the crusher. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scully Posted January 30, 2019 Report Share Posted January 30, 2019 (edited) 1 hour ago, HW95J said: The most workable licensing solution would probably be something along the lines of the airgun one in Scotland i.e licensing the individual rather than specific guns. Having to prove 'legitimate' reason for ownership etc. Either way, there will be a significant amount of heritage lost through 'amnesties' etc if the law changes. I doubt the police will be advising individuals that there is potential historical/financial value in what they hand in. It'll just be straight into the crusher. I'm not sure how 'legitimate' reason would be interpreted. I have several, but I'm no longer a collector. I have them because I like them. Edited January 30, 2019 by Scully Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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