Coronavirus (Covid-19) Is this it?

[JohnfromUK]

In perspective (copied from post elsewhere, but no reason to doubt it)

One of the worst days so far for Coronavirus was the 10th of February. On that day, 108 persons in CHINA died of Coronavirus.

BUT, on the same day
26,283 people died of Cancer
24,641 people died of Heart Disease
4,300 people died of Diabetes
and on that day, Suicide, unfortunately, took more lives than the virus did, by 28 times.
Moreover, Mosquitoes kill 2,740 people every day, HUMANS kill 1,300 fellow humans every day and Snakes kill 137 people every day.

[henry d]

The problem with those figures is that cancer, diabetes, heart disease etc are not transmitted from person to person, this virus is.

[12gauge82]

On 26/02/2020 at 17:04, henry d said:

Go have a read on HIV and how it came about.

Interesting one this, I know HIV originated from primates, but how did it infect Humans, to my knowledge HIV can't be spread through casual everyday contact?

[JohnfromUK]

20 minutes ago, henry d said:

The problem with those figures is that cancer, diabetes, heart disease etc are not transmitted from person to person, this virus is.

That is of course true, but flu (which has had its figures quoted earlier in the thread) is similarly transmitted.  I think the key thing at present (and it may not remain that way) is that in thre big picture of mortality, corona virus barely figures.

[henry d]

4 minutes ago, JohnfromUK said:

That is of course true, but flu (which has had its figures quoted earlier in the thread) is similarly transmitted.  I think the key thing at present (and it may not remain that way) is that in thre big picture of mortality, corona virus barely figures.

Again it's bigger than that, Spanish flu affected around a quarter of the earth's population, image the economic catastrophe if that is the likely outcome again!

8 minutes ago, 12gauge82 said:

Interesting one this, I know HIV originated from primates, but how did it infect Humans, to my knowledge HIV can't be spread through casual everyday contact?

It was originally SIV (simian, or monkey HIV if you like) passed from small monkeys that were killed and eaten by chimpanzees. People in Africa caught it from butchering and eating chimps, probably by blood entering wounds or being wounded by a chimp.

Imagine if it were a bird flu and prevalent in pheasants, we'd be very careful picking up a bird with a smashed wing, I don't know how many times I have been cut by a struggling pheasant, but it will be quite high.

[Retsdon]

8 minutes ago, JohnfromUK said:

I think the key thing at present (and it may not remain that way) is that in thre big picture of mortality, corona virus barely figures.

That's because in the big picture nobody has caught the COV-19 virus. Contrast that to the flu.  How many times have you had the flu yourself? How many times has everyone you know in your life had the flu? In fact a better question perhaps would be - do you know anyone who hasn't had the flu at least once? 

 

[grrclark]

Just now, Retsdon said:

That's because in the big picture nobody has caught the COV-19 virus. Contrast that to the flu.  How many times have you had the flu yourself? How many times has everyone you know in your life had the flu? In fact a better question perhaps would be - do you know anyone who hasn't had the flu at least once? 

 

I have never had the flu.

 I’ve had plenty colds that make you feel rotten, i know plenty people who have a day or two off work and proclaim they have had the flu, but all they had was a cold.

[JohnfromUK]

3 minutes ago, Retsdon said:

How many times have you had the flu yourself?

In my life (I'm near enough 63) - I have had proper 'flu probably twice.  Having said that - I have had a vaccination probably 15 to 20 years over my life including continuously over the last 5 or so years.

I have however had many what I consider to be a bad cold - but some people call 'flu.  It is a question to which you will get a variety of answers because the perception of "flu" differs so much.

[Penelope]

21 minutes ago, grrclark said:

I have never had the flu.

 I’ve had plenty colds that make you feel rotten, i know plenty people who have a day or two off work and proclaim they have had the flu, but all they had was a cold.

Maybe once, everything else has been a cold.

[Newbie to this]

Not certain if I have had the flu or just bad colds, never go to the Doctor to get diagnosed.

[Jaymo]

4 minutes ago, Newbie to this said:

Not certain if I have had the flu or just bad colds, never go to the Doctor to get diagnosed.

Those who say they have flu, have a cold!!!

Those who have flu, can’t, as you literally cannot comprehend anything except life as you lay there aching so much that you cannot move.....

[JohnfromUK]

9 minutes ago, Jaymo said:

Those who say they have flu, have a cold!!!

Those who have flu, can’t, as you literally cannot comprehend anything except life as you lay there aching so much that you cannot move.....

The real 'flu put me in bed for over a week on each occasion - and I am someone who has never had more than 2 days in bed for anything else (including operations under general anaesthetic and a suspected heart attack).  Colds might make me have an early night.

[oldypigeonpopper]

hello, just been confirmed of  Wales first person tested positive

[RockySpears]

11 hours ago, JohnfromUK said:

BUT, on the same day
26,283 people died of Cancer
24,641 people died of Heart Disease
4,300 people died of Diabetes
and on that day, Suicide, unfortunately, took more lives than the virus did, by 28 times.
Moreover, Mosquitoes kill 2,740 people every day, HUMANS kill 1,300 fellow humans every day and Snakes kill 137 people every day.

  People keep bring this sort of thing up and I would ask of them:

If it is "just the Flu", why is China shut down?

Why can you not travel to Italy in my company?

Why are buses driven from Brize Norton to The Wirral?

Why are schools shut down just 2 miles from my home?

If it is "just the Flu" why the heck is the world destroying it's economy?

 

Either it is not "just the Flu" and they are justified in their actions, but this means they know it is more than "just the Flu" and are not telling us this.

Or ...

They just want more control over our lives while the crashing economies, which was coming anyway, happens.

 

RS

[12gauge82]

1 hour ago, henry d said:

Again it's bigger than that, Spanish flu affected around a quarter of the earth's population, image the economic catastrophe if that is the likely outcome again!

It was originally SIV (simian, or monkey HIV if you like) passed from small monkeys that were killed and eaten by chimpanzees. People in Africa caught it from butchering and eating chimps, probably by blood entering wounds or being wounded by a chimp.

Imagine if it were a bird flu and prevalent in pheasants, we'd be very careful picking up a bird with a smashed wing, I don't know how many times I have been cut by a struggling pheasant, but it will be quite high.

Thanks for that Henry.

I can't fathom why anyone would think it a good idea to eat chimpanzees, they are so genetically similar to us, it's no wonder a disease like HIV has been transmitted.

[GingerCat]

2 minutes ago, RockySpears said:

  People keep bring this sort of thing up and I would ask of them:

If it is "just the Flu", why is China shut down?

Why can you not travel to Italy in my company?

Why are buses driven from Brize Norton to The Wirral?

Why are schools shut down just 2 miles from my home?

If it is "just the Flu" why the heck is the world destroying it's economy?

 

Either it is not "just the Flu" and they are justified in their actions, but this means they know it is more than "just the Flu" and are not telling us this.

Or ...

They just want more control over our lives while the crashing economies, which was coming anyway, happens.

 

RS

I think it's like a bad case of the flu that spreads a whole lot easier. 

Having had flu I can confirm your pretty stuffed for a while. Stuffed being an understatement. 

If the flu spread like this one does I can see how so many have died and what the panic is about. 

[Newbie to this]

31 minutes ago, Jaymo said:

Those who say they have flu, have a cold!!!

Those who have flu, can’t, as you literally cannot comprehend anything except life as you lay there aching so much that you cannot move.....

I've probably only had Man-Flu then 

[Penelope]

11 minutes ago, GingerCat said:

I think it's like a bad case of the flu that spreads a whole lot easier. 

Having had flu I can confirm your pretty stuffed for a while. Stuffed being an understatement. 

If the flu spread like this one does I can see how so many have died and what the panic is about. 

It can and has, the 1918/19 'Spanish flu' pandemic.

Well worth watching.

https://www.bbc.co.uk/programmes/b0blmn5l

[JohnfromUK]

22 minutes ago, RockySpears said:

Either it is not "just the Flu" and they are justified in their actions, but this means they know it is more than "just the Flu" and are not telling us this.

Or ...

They just want more control over our lives while the crashing economies, which was coming anyway, happens.

Society reacts in strange ways to new 'unknown' threats. 

Flu is a nasty illness - it makes most people quite ill for a week or two - and takes a long time to fully recover.  A some don't recover - and it is actually quite a large figure, but mostly those with other underlying conditions who are least able to fight the nasty illness of flu.  But we as a world society have grown to accept flu.  Yes - we take precautions and vaccinate in the richer societies - I myself get vaccinated voluntarily every year and pay to have a vaccination because I don't underestimate flu.

Lots of people also die from alcohol, smoking etc., but again we are used to those risks and understand them (or think we do).

This new virus is unknown -  hence the risks are unknown and the stock markets are 'spooked', the countries are taking quite tough measures to contain it.  If we believe what we are told, China is having success in this area.  Wuhan is a city of 11 million people.  There have been about 85,000 cases in China, mostly in Wuhan.  That is about 1% of the Wuhan population.  Tim Cook of Apple says that supplies from China are getting back to 'normal' as the Chinese get things under control. 

It has the capability to spread widely because modern society is very mobile.  I find it worrying that it has spread to Africa where care is less developed, but that was pretty much inevitable given the close ties between Africa and China.

Maybe it will end up like Spanish Flu 100 years ago and kill a huge number of people, but no one can say with certainty.  One day - someting like that will happen - and this could be that day ........ but no one knows.

[muncher]

I've had flu twice in my life, and believe me when you get the flu you will know the difference, bed ridden for over a week,just going to the toilet is like a marathon expedition. Flu isn't cold like symptoms, they come afterwards after your lungs etc have become damaged by the virus, that's how the chest infections come about, I believe.

[Smokersmith]

Normally flu 'goes away' over the summer … does anyone know if were likely to get some respite through this?

[Penelope]

8 minutes ago, muncher said:

I've had flu twice in my life, and believe me when you get the flu you will know the difference, bed ridden for over a week,just going to the toilet is like a marathon expedition. Flu isn't cold like symptoms, they come afterwards after your lungs etc have become damaged by the virus, that's how the chest infections come about, I believe.

The Spanish flu of 1918/19 hit the fit and healthy much harder than children and the elderly, it caused the immune system to go into overdrive and fill the lungs with fluid.

 

The programme that I linked to is an interesting watch.

[SpringDon]

18 minutes ago, JohnfromUK said:

Society reacts in strange ways to new 'unknown' threats. 

Flu is a nasty illness - it makes most people quite ill for a week or two - and takes a long time to fully recover.  A some don't recover - and it is actually quite a large figure, but mostly those with other underlying conditions who are least able to fight the nasty illness of flu.  But we as a world society have grown to accept flu.  Yes - we take precautions and vaccinate in the richer societies - I myself get vaccinated voluntarily every year and pay to have a vaccination because I don't underestimate flu.

Lots of people also die from alcohol, smoking etc., but again we are used to those risks and understand them (or think we do).

This new virus is unknown -  hence the risks are unknown and the stock markets are 'spooked', the countries are taking quite tough measures to contain it.  If we believe what we are told, China is having success in this area.  Wuhan is a city of 11 million people.  There have been about 85,000 cases in China, mostly in Wuhan.  That is about 1% of the Wuhan population.  Tim Cook of Apple says that supplies from China are getting back to 'normal' as the Chinese get things under control. 

It has the capability to spread widely because modern society is very mobile.  I find it worrying that it has spread to Africa where care is less developed, but that was pretty much inevitable given the close ties between Africa and China.

Maybe it will end up like Spanish Flu 100 years ago and kill a huge number of people, but no one can say with certainty.  One day - someting like that will happen - and this could be that day ........ but no one knows.

This^ very muchly. It’s not accurate to say “it’s just the flu” as it’s actually not even close to being as bad as the flu. But it is unknown and is revealing some unwelcome attributes such as asymptotic transmission and viral presence after recovery (are those people infectious?).

So whilst it’s possible it might morph into something unpleasant and should be respected, it’s nothing  to panic about. Yet.

[JohnfromUK]

4 minutes ago, Smokersmith said:

Normally flu 'goes away' over the summer … does anyone know if were likely to get some respite through this?

From what I have read, it is thought likely, but no one knows for certain.  Part of the reason is said to be that people spend more time in the fresh air and less cooped up in enclosed spaces.

[muncher]

19 minutes ago, Penelope said:

The Spanish flu of 1918/19 hit the fit and healthy much harder than children and the elderly, it caused the immune system to go into overdrive and fill the lungs with fluid.

 

The programme that I linked to is an interesting watch.

I watched a program on it years ago,but I might watch it again.