armsid Posted March 14, 2021 Report Share Posted March 14, 2021 See they are back in lockdown a third wave Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Newbie to this Posted March 14, 2021 Report Share Posted March 14, 2021 Should have sorted their own vaccination program, rather than relying on the overly bureaucratic shambles of an EU one. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mungler Posted March 14, 2021 Report Share Posted March 14, 2021 7 minutes ago, Newbie to this said: Should have sorted their own vaccination program, rather than relying on the overly bureaucratic shambles of an EU one. Bingo. I go to Italy at least once a year and have done for the last 10 years. They all say they want change and are against corruption and bureaucracy but they all just shrug their shoulders in a ‘whatcha going to do though?’ fashion. Until they hit rock bottom and vote in their own version of Mrs Thatcher then they will continue to remain the doggy do on the bottom of German and French boots. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scully Posted March 14, 2021 Report Share Posted March 14, 2021 That’s my holiday pooped again this year then. 🙂 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ordnance Posted March 14, 2021 Report Share Posted March 14, 2021 10 hours ago, Newbie to this said: Should have sorted their own vaccination program, rather than relying on the overly bureaucratic shambles of an EU one. That's only going to get worse, some EU countries including the ROI have suspended the use of the oxford AstraZeneca vaccine because of concerns over blood clots. The EU medicines regulator and the UK have said its safe and the number of blood clots are no more than expected in a population. But even if the countries that have suspended its use come out and say its safe, with all the other EU anti AstraZeneca scapegoating the damage will be done and people will refuse to get it, another EU own goal. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vince Green Posted March 15, 2021 Report Share Posted March 15, 2021 (edited) 16 hours ago, ordnance said: That's only going to get worse, some EU countries including the ROI have suspended the use of the oxford AstraZeneca vaccine because of concerns over blood clots. The EU medicines regulator and the UK have said its safe and the number of blood clots are no more than expected in a population. But even if the countries that have suspended its use come out and say its safe, with all the other EU anti AstraZeneca scapegoating the damage will be done and people will refuse to get it, another EU own goal. It seems strange to me that all this comes from three cases of blood clots reported by Norway, and quickly shown to be unrelated to the vaccine. It seems the EU is trying very hard to discredit what they see as the British vaccine. I suppose its easier to say they suspended its use than to admit they haven't got enough. First they said it didn't work in over 65s, then they had to admit that wasn't true. Now this, well carry on, all the more for us Edited March 15, 2021 by Vince Green Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TRINITY Posted March 15, 2021 Report Share Posted March 15, 2021 Dont give a twit about the Europeans. This is fantastic news, long may they continue to find reasons not to use it. More for the UK 👍 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cuffy Posted March 15, 2021 Report Share Posted March 15, 2021 2 hours ago, TRINITY said: Dont give a twit about the Europeans. This is fantastic news, long may they continue to find reasons not to use it. More for the UK 👍 Exactly Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jim Neal Posted March 15, 2021 Report Share Posted March 15, 2021 Sometimes I think it would be better to hand over the management of the world to primary school kids. Top level government strategies and decisions would still be just as farcical but at least we'd get free sweeties.... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WalkedUp Posted March 15, 2021 Report Share Posted March 15, 2021 I feel for the Italians and other EU nations as it is a complete debacle. I am proud of the UK 🇬🇧 and our government. I don’t think Johnson would have survived a third wave. The vaccination programme has been well handled by the government and it was enabled by decades of scientific excellence in our nation. Proud to be British, and pleased we are vaccinated. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mungler Posted March 15, 2021 Report Share Posted March 15, 2021 I am genuinely mystified with what is going on in Europe and their trying to pee all over the GB manufactured vaccine. At a point in time where vaccine denying and lack of take up is a real problem, it’s not just negligent it’s criminal. So so so counterproductive and damaging for them - this is the essence of European governance..... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WalkedUp Posted March 15, 2021 Report Share Posted March 15, 2021 Written by my Cambridge PhD physics / statistician pal Phil who’s wife is a medical doctor: “Here’s some stats for anyone worried about blood clots (VTE) and AZ vaccine. 37 reported incidents of blood clots in the 17 million people in Europe that have received the AstraZeneca vaccine. That’s about 1 in 459,000 having a reported blood clot within (presumably) a day or so of having the jab. In general, the incidence of blood clots are between 1-2 in 1000 annually (let’s call it 1.5 +/- 0.5 but incidence also increases rapidly in older age groups). On average that’s an incidence rate of about 1 in 243,000 people daily. In other words, of the 17 million people receiving a vaccine we would expect about 70 +/- 23 of those individuals to have a blood clot on the same day. If we adjust that based on the age profile of those who receive the vaccine first then we would also expect that number to increase. Given that, if you have a blood clot on a particular day and you’re going to a clinic, it may be more likely to be identified when you’re in the clinical setting with healthcare professionals, it follows that timing of detection of blood clots in those receiving a vaccine on the same day would be biased towards the time they received the vaccine too which may be the cause for an apparent association with the administration of a jab. Perhaps there is also an effect from sitting/standing still and waiting for your turn in the vaccination queue or even driving some distance to vaccination centres. To suggest, with such low rates of incidence that appear to lie well within the normal ranges, that vaccination programs should be halted appears, at best, premature and ill informed but verging on reckless! The cynic in me would point to politicians across Europe that have failed to effectively roll out their vaccination programs seizing on the opportunity to deflect attention away from how their failures have limited their citizens’ access to the vaccine in the first place.” Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TRINITY Posted March 15, 2021 Report Share Posted March 15, 2021 I wonder if wee Jimmy cranky will be withholding the AZ vaccine in her fiefdom in order to impress her European friends Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cosmicblue Posted March 16, 2021 Report Share Posted March 16, 2021 The rate that fake news (in this case the AZ vaccine and clots) gains credibility and becomes accepted fact to the point that countries act upon it to the detriment of their populations, some of whom will die prematurely because of a malicious, unfounded rumour is scary. Was on a call with my German colleagues yesterday who are staring down the barrels of a 3rd lockdown with the chance of a vaccine jab a distant hope some way off in far distance. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
oscarsdad Posted March 16, 2021 Report Share Posted March 16, 2021 The Italians and the french have now admitted that there was political motivation in stopping the use of AZ British jabs as they are unhappy about Brexit. So someone somewhere in the EU leadership made a politically motivated decision on healthcare which will have resulted in deaths...I hope they are found and punished. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mungler Posted March 16, 2021 Report Share Posted March 16, 2021 7 minutes ago, oscarsdad said: The Italians and the french have now admitted that there was political motivation in stopping the use of AZ British jabs as they are unhappy about Brexit. So someone somewhere in the EU leadership made a politically motivated decision on healthcare which will have resulted in deaths...I hope they are found and punished. It is criminal what they have done. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ordnance Posted March 16, 2021 Report Share Posted March 16, 2021 Even if it turned out there was a 1 in a million chance of blood clots after having the vaccine the benefits would far outweigh the risk, they seem to have lost the plot in the EU. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mice! Posted March 16, 2021 Report Share Posted March 16, 2021 4 minutes ago, ordnance said: Even if it turned out there was a 1 in a million chance of blood clots after having the vaccine the benefits would far outweigh the risk, they seem to have lost the plot in the EU. You can get blood clots from flying, I doubt the EU would ban that. Just shows we are better off out of Europe. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Smokersmith Posted March 16, 2021 Report Share Posted March 16, 2021 Way more than Italy with rising cases ... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vince Green Posted March 16, 2021 Report Share Posted March 16, 2021 (edited) Actually, the evidence is (rather strangely) that the vaccine may actually prevent blood clots because the rate is lower than for a normal sample of the age related population It just goes to show how low the likes of Macron and Merkel are prepared to descend to score points against Britain, playing silly games with people's lives. So glad we are out of the vile cesspit that is the EU Edited March 16, 2021 by Vince Green Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scully Posted March 16, 2021 Report Share Posted March 16, 2021 I don’t know of anyone who this is putting off getting the vaccine. Mate ( 57 ) is going for his first dose tomorrow, ex (58) has had her second just yesterday. Anyone I’ve spoken to about this has just shrugged and of the opinion that the risks are so small they’re insignificant. I’ll be getting mine asap. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Yellow Bear Posted March 16, 2021 Report Share Posted March 16, 2021 32 minutes ago, Vince Green said: Actually, the evidence is (rather strangely) that the vaccine may actually prevent blood clots because the rate is lower than for a normal sample of the age related population exactly Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
39TDS Posted March 16, 2021 Report Share Posted March 16, 2021 I'm 57, booked in for my second dose of AZ jab on 4th May and I will be there. It hasn't put me off at all. Just puzzled why from the evidence so far presented why any of the vaccinations have been halted. Don't the stats say you would expect more people with blood clots if they hadn't been vaccinated? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jim Neal Posted March 17, 2021 Report Share Posted March 17, 2021 4 hours ago, Smokersmith said: Way more than Italy with rising cases ... That chart is meaningless and deceptive. It's yet another example of someone trying to fool idiots with statistics. It's comparing raw numbers of cases, not numbers PER CAPITA. If you added, let's say, India to that list with its 1.4Bn population and India's cases were 14K, you'd think that covid was as bad in India as it is in Turkey who've also got 14k cases, right? Wrong. Because 14,000 cases in India is 0.00001% of their population, whereas Turkey's got it roughly 16 times as bad divided by their comparatively measly 85 million population. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Smokersmith Posted March 17, 2021 Report Share Posted March 17, 2021 No-ones fooled ... I said that there’s more than Italy going up, and that’s also what the chart says. Growing case numbers. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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