Channel Migrants

[12gauge82]

30 minutes ago, Good shot? said:

We have the technology to see and register these craft leaving French beaches and as said we should immediately return them to that area.The coast according to the French is too big to see all craft leaving so it is also too big to see craft arriving. The fact that the French will not like it does not matter.

It all boils down to this. 

On one side you have the French who have rightly had enough of economic migrants flocking to their country, due to our over generous hospitality. The French clearly justify it to themselves reasoning its okay to turn a blind eye to them reaching the UK as its our own fault for being so stupid. 

We have a government, the majority of which are infatuated with a globalist ideology and are woke EU sympathisers who are more concerned about their future careers within the EU Parliament, or virtue signalling and it appears they'd rather literally watch fellow human beings die, than risk being called racist by simply make new laws to stop it happening, its nonsense it can't be done, they did it quick enough during the pandemic, despite alot of the rushed laws likely being illegal. I also blame our own population for constantly voting the same shower of **** in, a never ending cycle of Labour and Conservative, with a rearing of an ugly Lib dem head along the way. If we as a country want change, we need to vote it in and its not going to come from any of the main parties. 

11 minutes ago, Jega said:

Stop the benefits and hotels and the boats you'll stop the boats .

This is also very true, but again our government won't do it due to image. Never mind that the very same people they're pretending to care about are drowning in the channel, or being sold into a life of crime and prostitution. 

Edited December 15, 2022 by 12gauge82

[Rewulf]

21 minutes ago, 12gauge82 said:

We have a government, the majority of which are infatuated with a globalist ideology and are woke EU sympathisers who are more concerned about their future careers within the EU Parliament, or virtue signalling and it appears they'd rather literally watch fellow human beings die, than risk being called racist by simply make new laws to stop it happening, its nonsense it can't be done, they did it quick enough during the pandemic, despite alot of the rushed laws likely being illegal.

This.

[Vince Green]

6 hours ago, Good shot? said:

I believe they are not claiming asylum in France (or any other safe country they have passed through) 

However if they did would they get the same treatment that they get in the UK?

If not, why not, bearing in mind we are all subject to the same international rules are we not? I am being naive?

The French make it extremely difficult for them to claim asylum or get documented in any way. That way they are deniable. No record of them ever having been there

[old man]

8 hours ago, JohnfromUK said:

I don't think the French 'do' that.

I beg to differ John, they have joined up thinking which says they are of no benefit to France so they help them on their way to us. Simples!

5 hours ago, Good shot? said:

I do agree John.

The truth is I have run out of reasons why so called well educated well paid leaders of this once great country cannot do what is needed to resolve this one problem, let alone others. No other political parties have an answer either it is not only a Tory problem.

oh I forgot it has been put on a priority list.

There is no real will to resolve it.

I despair.

Worry not, the Christmas Spirit is flowing already so the promises have been forgotten?

[old man]

4 hours ago, Mice! said:

If only, I'd put the Marines out, nobody lands on our shores, training exercise!

SBS stopping them while still in the French surf would be nice, it's not as if the French fo anything about what goes on on there beaches.

Israel would have it sorted in a couple of days?

[Mice!]

2 hours ago, 12gauge82 said:

This is also very true, but again our government won't do it due to image. Never mind that the very same people they're pretending to care about are drowning in the channel, or being sold into a life of crime and prostitution.

They should report that there are dozens dying every day in the cold sea, it might put a few off?

35 minutes ago, old man said:

Israel would have it sorted in a couple of days?

Wouldn't they just, I can picture the gun boats patrolling 

[armsid]

Easy start conscription for all men under 30 there wont be enough planes for the exodus and that would deter them

[Rewulf]

I see the MP's 'desperate' to solve the asylum crisis, have thrown the Rwanda bill out. 

More interested than keeping their jobs, than actually fixing the problem. 

At least Nottinghamshire put in a good showing, with the only 2 Labour MP's to support the Bill, among others. 

[Dave-G]

Meet them and their French escorts at the halfway point with a prison boat that drops anchor there - should sort it within a week, but I'm suspecting there might be a rule about anchoring up in the channel.

[Rewulf]

57 minutes ago, Dave-G said:

Meet them and their French escorts at the halfway point with a prison boat that drops anchor there - should sort it within a week, but I'm suspecting there might be a rule about anchoring up in the channel.

Take them to one of the Channel Islands, a kind of limbo between the UK and France ?
Kit out the various Channel forts for holding purposes ?
Some bleak island in the Hebrides ?
Prison boats on the Thames ?
Rwanda ?

All these things could be considered, the Australians do it , Israel does it, even the Netherlands had a fast track , where they sent some straight home.
But we dont do it , because our political class doesnt have the WILL to do it, and our asylum system is on of the easiest to defraud in Europe.
This issue is going no where, as those in control of it dont want to or dont care.

We cant even admit what they are , economic migrants at best , criminals and opportunists at worst, all being fed, clothed, kept warm, and all needs taken care of in 4 * hotels , while there are people sleeping on the streets in sub zero temps, and pensioners and working people struggling to get by.

[discobob]

1 hour ago, Rewulf said:

while there are people sleeping on the streets

to diverge a little bit - We went to the Chester Christmas Market last night - I saw homeless that seemed to be made up with their lot - even bragging about how much money they had. Then I saw a fella by himself in a shop doorway being harrassed by police - they walked away and I walked over and slipped him a 20 - walking over it was obvious that he had psychiatric issues and I noticed he had a plastic biscuit tin full of stumps. My eyes are watering now for the poor sole.

What help is there for him and his like 😢 No 4 or 5 star hotels for our own....

When I see homeless with signs up about ex-forces I will always ask them a question - if they answer it I will give them something

[Newbie to this]

7 minutes ago, discobob said:

What help is there for him and his like 😢 No 4 or 5 star hotels for our own....

This is one of the driving forces in the current argument. If there is money to house the world's dregs, why do we have our own living on the streets. It's not acceptable.

Edited December 16, 2022 by Newbie to this

[Wymondley]

To be fair, if the government tried to tackle this with any vigour, the human rights lawyers would tear them to pieces.

The legal profession are worse than the politicians.

If the first lot to arrive had simply been put on a boat, no word to anyone,

and dumped back on a French beach still cold wet and hungry, this wouldn't be happening now

It's far too late to change things, there will be no mass deportations or changes in the law.

 

1 hour ago, Rewulf said:

We cant even admit what they are , economic migrants at best , criminals and opportunists at worst, all being fed, clothed, kept warm, and all needs taken care of in 4 * hotels , while there are people sleeping on the streets in sub zero temps, and pensioners and working people struggling to get by.

Even if we admit what they are, who's going to do anything?

[Rewulf]

2 minutes ago, discobob said:

What help is there for him and his like 😢 No 4 or 5 star hotels for our own....

Up until recently Ive tended to not give cash to homeless people , dont mind buying them a drink or sandwich, but often you see them with several drinks and snacks, Id rather not imagine them overdosing ect on money Id given them.
But maybe Im going soft or something , just lately there are some very genuinely desperate looking people about, so Ive started dropping the odd tenner, or one bloke who approached me the other night, with a blanket wrapped round him, shivering , got a £20.

Its disgusting that asylum seekers are set up in hotels , while homeless are freezing in shop doorways, if we can afford to house migrants , why cant we house them ?

2 minutes ago, Wymondley said:

Even if we admit what they are, who's going to do anything?

You cant begin to recognise the problem, if you dont recognise it exists ?

These people are not (for the most part) genuine refugees, their asylum claims are fake.
Even in the case f the Albanian ones , no recognition of the abuse of the asylum system ?
 

[JohnfromUK]

1 minute ago, Rewulf said:

why cant we house them

It isn't that straight forward.  Early in Covid, a local city took over one of the rather more 'tired' chain type hotels to house the homeless.  Unfortunately, there were a whole load of issues, fights, rooms damaged, drug taking, smashed glass, even burned out rooms.  Many of the homeless have serious behavioural issues of various types which means it isn't just a case of providing a warm room etc.

There is a regular rough sleeper in my local town.  Numerous attempts to help including being provided with a flat, furniture etc. have been arranged (council or a charity, I'm not sure which), but it was all wrecked within a month and a resulting fire endangered others and put them out of their flats as well.

It is very difficult to help some.

[Wymondley]

7 minutes ago, Rewulf said:

You cant begin to recognise the problem, if you dont recognise it exists ?

I'm sure many recognise the problem, but what to do?

Risk being accused of racism, career death by media, dragged over the legal coals?

No current politician is going to risk that.

Think you'll ever see anti immigration riots in this country?

 

[Wymondley]

36 minutes ago, JohnfromUK said:

It isn't that straight forward.  Early in Covid, a local city took over one of the rather more 'tired' chain type hotels to house the homeless.  Unfortunately, there were a whole load of issues, fights, rooms damaged, drug taking, smashed glass, even burned out rooms.  Many of the homeless have serious behavioural issues of various types which means it isn't just a case of providing a warm room etc.

There is a regular rough sleeper in my local town.  Numerous attempts to help including being provided with a flat, furniture etc. have been arranged (council or a charity, I'm not sure which), but it was all wrecked within a month and a resulting fire endangered others and put them out of their flats as well.

It is very difficult to help some.

Absolutely.

Mental health or addiction issues, often both.

The relative ease and cheapness of drugs and alcohol has not helped.

We did away with the dedicated mental health hospitals where many of these people would have been treated as in patients.

Care in the community? trouble is there's little care and no community.

Sold off the hospital land to build houses on, for an ever growing population, which is where we started.

 

Edited December 16, 2022 by Wymondley

[discobob]

15 minutes ago, Wymondley said:

We did away with the dedicated mental health hospitals where many of these people would have been treated as in patients.

Care in the community? trouble is there's little care and no community.

This in part what upsets me - having a Dad that spent most of his life in a Sanatorium (Rainhill Hospital), later to be moved out to a care in the community home on that being closed down and I wonder what would have happened to him in this day and age....

[Rewulf]

1 minute ago, JohnfromUK said:

It isn't that straight forward.  Early in Covid, a local city took over one of the rather more 'tired' chain type hotels to house the homeless.  Unfortunately, there were a whole load of issues, fights, rooms damaged, drug taking, smashed glass, even burned out rooms.  Many of the homeless have serious behavioural issues of various types which means it isn't just a case of providing a warm room etc.

You could apply the same charges to the asylum seekers ?
Many of the cheaper chain hotels in Nottingham now house them, this shows the scale of what we are dealing with, and at £150 + per DAY each , the cost, can you imagine giving the homeless £150 a day , I doubt they would choose a shop doorway to sleep in of a night ?
 

[islandgun]

2 hours ago, Rewulf said:

Take them to one of the Channel Islands, a kind of limbo between the UK and France ?
Kit out the various Channel forts for holding purposes ?
Some bleak island in the Hebrides ?

Theres no room on my bleak island..😄

[Yellow Bear]

8 minutes ago, islandgun said:

Theres no room on my bleak island..😄

plenty of room, just supply a tent.   After the first few the flow will stop when word gets back

[Rewulf]

14 minutes ago, islandgun said:

Theres no room on my bleak island..😄

No , a bleak island , I was thinking more like this one https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Soay,_St_Kilda

4 minutes ago, Yellow Bear said:

plenty of room, just supply a tent.   After the first few the flow will stop when word gets back

Exactly , you might find these desperate people are more inclined to claim asylum in France then.

[islandgun]

17 minutes ago, Rewulf said:

No , a bleak island , I was thinking more like this one https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Soay,_St_Kilda

Exactly , you might find these desperate people are more inclined to claim asylum in France then.

Hmm St Kilda Unesco world heritage sight a day trip ticket by fast boat cost's £260. Then you would have to supply buses to the Highlands with a nights stopover [Nottingham] perhaps a cup of tea and a sandwich, its adding up.....Jaywicks got some B&B's

 

[old man]

18 hours ago, armsid said:

Easy start conscription for all men under 30 there wont be enough planes for the exodus and that would deter them

Blimey. The supposed conscripts rushing for the exits would be the first in the queues to leave?

 

[islandgun]

52 minutes ago, Yellow Bear said:

plenty of room, just supply a tent.   After the first few the flow will stop when word gets back

Not many would survive in a tent the last few days 🥶. plus it takes 2 1/2 hrs to get here by ferry, even longer to get back in a rubber boat, im thinking somewhere nearer the south coast would be better..😉