KB1 Posted November 16, 2021 Report Share Posted November 16, 2021 You couldn't make it up! 🙄 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mungler Posted November 16, 2021 Report Share Posted November 16, 2021 As a conservative, I have to say that this conservative government is shaping up to be a real disappointing waste of time and opportunity. Yes, any Tory government holds the looney left off for a while longer, but this government has had a chance to implement conservative policies and change but seems obsessed with PR, polling and anything slightly green no matter how impractical or economically crippling. One of the big elephants that remain in the room is uncontrolled mass migration to our shores and yet no one seems to want to get behind Priti Patel or take action. As a bit of a history nerd, I am troubled by refuge migration - knowing what we know now would anyone stand in the way of someone wanting to get out of Nazi Germany before 1939 and regardless of where they wanted to get to in the world. However, what appears to be different is that back then it was women and children first but now as I watch the news I only see the faces of migrating men between the ages of 18 and 40. The ratio looks to me like 95%. As Fidel Castro did, we know that in the region the Taliban opened up all the prisons and let out the mad and the bad and we have no idea who is arriving. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
oldypigeonpopper Posted November 16, 2021 Report Share Posted November 16, 2021 3 hours ago, Mungler said: As a conservative, I have to say that this conservative government is shaping up to be a real disappointing waste of time and opportunity. Yes, any Tory government holds the looney left off for a while longer, but this government has had a chance to implement conservative policies and change but seems obsessed with PR, polling and anything slightly green no matter how impractical or economically crippling. One of the big elephants that remain in the room is uncontrolled mass migration to our shores and yet no one seems to want to get behind Priti Patel or take action. As a bit of a history nerd, I am troubled by refuge migration - knowing what we know now would anyone stand in the way of someone wanting to get out of Nazi Germany before 1939 and regardless of where they wanted to get to in the world. However, what appears to be different is that back then it was women and children first but now as I watch the news I only see the faces of migrating men between the ages of 18 and 40. The ratio looks to me like 95%. As Fidel Castro did, we know that in the region the Taliban opened up all the prisons and let out the mad and the bad and we have no idea who is arriving. Good post 👍 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
oldypigeonpopper Posted November 16, 2021 Report Share Posted November 16, 2021 7 hours ago, KB1 said: You couldn't make it up! 🙄 Hello, I agree KB1, Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TRINITY Posted November 16, 2021 Report Share Posted November 16, 2021 We need to stop giving them any incentive to come. Trouble is there are hundreds of thousands already here and over the years they have built up various organisations and support systems within the country which help attract them and once here make it hard to send them back. Quite simply it is a 'soft invasion' . It will be wave after wave and there is no doubt that the numbers will continue to grow Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scully Posted November 16, 2021 Report Share Posted November 16, 2021 Just been on the news that the bloke who detonated the bomb in the Liverpool taxi was an asylum seeker from the Middle East. Who’d have thought! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wymberley Posted November 16, 2021 Report Share Posted November 16, 2021 6 minutes ago, TRINITY said: We need to stop giving them any incentive to come. Trouble is there are hundreds of thousands already here and over the years they have built up various organisations and support systems within the country which help attract them and once here make it hard to send them back. Quite simply it is a 'soft invasion' . It will be wave after wave and there is no doubt that the numbers will continue to grow Literally! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Newbie to this Posted November 16, 2021 Report Share Posted November 16, 2021 6 minutes ago, Scully said: Who’d have thought! Obviously not our government Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wymberley Posted November 16, 2021 Report Share Posted November 16, 2021 27 minutes ago, oldypigeonpopper said: Good post 👍 Frighteningly so. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
yates Posted November 16, 2021 Report Share Posted November 16, 2021 (edited) I’m very much not a Tory but totally agree with Munglers post Edited November 16, 2021 by yates Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TRINITY Posted November 16, 2021 Report Share Posted November 16, 2021 Yes munglers post sums up the situation and I agree. However I have yet to hear one word about any of this whole situation from the main opposition parties. Their silence speaks volumes about them! So it's Boris and his mob, we have no other choice unfortunately. It's quite ironic that Labour are always looking at ways to bring this government to account or better still remove them and they seem to always fail. Yet here we have a situation that any credible opposition could use to bring the government tumbling down quite easily. I wonder why they are so quiet and not questioning what is being done. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
London Best Posted November 16, 2021 Report Share Posted November 16, 2021 Because, once here, the invaders vote Labour? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gordon R Posted November 16, 2021 Report Share Posted November 16, 2021 (edited) Priti Patel vows to keep out 100% of Channel crossers, but why is no-one taking any notice? I would make it clear to all those bringing them ashore that they were aiding and abetting criminals and should face the sack if they work for any Government Agency. Heads need to roll in whoever is managing this at ground level. Edited November 16, 2021 by Gordon R Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
welsh1 Posted November 16, 2021 Report Share Posted November 16, 2021 Take away the incentive for them to be here, our benefits system is seen as very generous, stop it and they will stop coming. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gordon R Posted November 16, 2021 Report Share Posted November 16, 2021 In addition to our ridiculously generous benefits system, there is every chance to be in the black economy. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JohnfromUK Posted November 16, 2021 Report Share Posted November 16, 2021 4 minutes ago, welsh1 said: Take away the incentive for them to be here, our benefits system is seen as very generous, stop it and they will stop coming. Agree that is one side of the coin. The other side of the coin is the French end. The French refugee camp sites (which I believe are unofficial) are very unpleasant indeed - they are muddy tented shanty towns with no proper accommodation, very limited sanitary facilities and lacking any comforts at all. These are frequented by the organised crime smugglers who arrange boats for migrants - and who are seldom inconvenienced by the French Authorities. There is obviously (and correctly) a view that the more uncomfortable and unpleasant staying in France is made, the more likely the migrants will take a boat out to the UK, where they will have expectations of being put up by the UK Gov't in reasonable accommodation, cash handouts, assistance with asylum applications and a sympathetic welcome. A belief the smugglers will no doubt reinforce, and they will no doubt have heard good tales from successful channel crossers. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
old'un Posted November 16, 2021 Report Share Posted November 16, 2021 1 hour ago, Scully said: Just been on the news that the bloke who detonated the bomb in the Liverpool taxi was an asylum seeker from the Middle East. Who’d have thought! The asylum flag is a gift horse for terrorists, what better way to get your terrorist fighters into the countries of people you wish to harm. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rob85 Posted November 16, 2021 Report Share Posted November 16, 2021 7 minutes ago, old'un said: The asylum flag is a gift horse for terrorists, what better way to get your terrorist fighters into the countries of people you wish to harm. Also a nice easy way to target a Royal Navy patrol boat or even the RNLI, hide among the asylum seekers and detonate the second they pull along side or better still pull you onboard. Terrorists have never minded killing their own as collateral damage before. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JohnfromUK Posted November 16, 2021 Report Share Posted November 16, 2021 (edited) 13 minutes ago, old'un said: The asylum flag is a gift horse for terrorists, what better way to get your terrorist fighters into the countries of people you wish to harm. There are three main reasons for moving; Asylum - which is "a person who has left their country and is seeking protection from persecution and serious human rights violations in another country." To be granted asylum (to get refugee status), you need to show that you have a well-founded fear of persecution. Persecution, in terms of claiming asylum, is serious, targeted mistreatment of an individual because of who they are, or what they do, or what people think they are or do. It is mistreatment of someone because of their identity. Refugee - "A refugee is a person who has fled their own country because they are at risk of serious human rights violations and persecution there. The risks to their safety and life were so great that they felt they had no choice but to leave and seek safety outside their country" Migrants - There is no internationally accepted legal definition of a migrant. Most agencies and organizations understand migrants to be people staying outside their country of origin, who are not asylum-seekers or refugees. Some migrants leave their country because they want to work, study or join family, for example. Others feel they must leave because of poverty, political unrest, gang violence, natural disasters or other serious circumstances that exist there. What should be clear is that "Asylum" needs to be granted only where the above applies - which is typically (but not necessarily) political suppression. Note that it applies to individual persons. The above are drawn from here https://righttoremain.org.uk/toolkit/asylumintro/ and here https://www.amnesty.org/en/what-we-do/refugees-asylum-seekers-and-migrants/ Edited November 16, 2021 by JohnfromUK Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
old'un Posted November 16, 2021 Report Share Posted November 16, 2021 13 minutes ago, JohnfromUK said: There are three main reasons for moving; Asylum - which is "a person who has left their country and is seeking protection from persecution and serious human rights violations in another country." To be granted asylum (to get refugee status), you need to show that you have a well-founded fear of persecution. Persecution, in terms of claiming asylum, is serious, targeted mistreatment of an individual because of who they are, or what they do, or what people think they are or do. It is mistreatment of someone because of their identity. Refugee - "A refugee is a person who has fled their own country because they are at risk of serious human rights violations and persecution there. The risks to their safety and life were so great that they felt they had no choice but to leave and seek safety outside their country" Migrants - There is no internationally accepted legal definition of a migrant. Most agencies and organizations understand migrants to be people staying outside their country of origin, who are not asylum-seekers or refugees. Some migrants leave their country because they want to work, study or join family, for example. Others feel they must leave because of poverty, political unrest, gang violence, natural disasters or other serious circumstances that exist there. What should be clear is that "Asylum" needs to be granted only where the above applies - which is typically (but not necessarily) political suppression. Note that it applies to individual persons. The above are drawn from here https://righttoremain.org.uk/toolkit/asylumintro/ and here https://www.amnesty.org/en/what-we-do/refugees-asylum-seekers-and-migrants/ You forgot the fourth one, to commit acts of terrorism as the Liverpool bomber did. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
P08 Posted November 16, 2021 Report Share Posted November 16, 2021 I wish it was a bit more simple, push back, and maritime law stipulates boats in distress, ships have a clear duty to assist those in distress, The UK is considering push back from whence they came, if it is safe to do it, clearly these migrants will be made aware of this, maybe even jump in the water, Then what? The home secertary should resign, she can then say were are hands are tied, Also has anyone seen any figures of the return rate especialy this year. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gordon R Posted November 16, 2021 Report Share Posted November 16, 2021 We appear to rush to abide by maritime law, but the French ignore it. They actively assist boats to become "in distress". If migrants jump in the water, that is their choice. They can swim, get back in the boat or stay on the boat. Why should we create a fourth option? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rob85 Posted November 16, 2021 Report Share Posted November 16, 2021 If the French won't actively try to shut down the networks of scumbags that work as the fixers and traffickers for these migrants/asylum seekers then maybe its time we sent a covert task force over to have a quiet looksie into whats going on. Maybe find out who the big players are and remove them. It seems clear to me that they must have people at the top in France and in the uk who are running the show. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JohnfromUK Posted November 16, 2021 Report Share Posted November 16, 2021 (edited) 2 minutes ago, Rob85 said: If the French won't actively try to shut down the networks of scumbags It seems the French have acted today. https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-europe-59303652 Edited November 16, 2021 by JohnfromUK Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rob85 Posted November 16, 2021 Report Share Posted November 16, 2021 5 minutes ago, JohnfromUK said: It seems the French have acted today. https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-europe-59303652 Over 23,000 people this year alone, up from under 2000. Something definitely shows us as an attractive prospect. Thats a decent sized town of people. Its only a matter of time before we have an incident like they had in the med where the child was washed up on the beach and all of a sudden it was an outpouring of support for the migrants. Look at the ones freezing to death on the Poland- Belarus boarder, I wonder where they all want to end up eventually. Any migrants that do get here should have no access to hotels, send them to somewhere like an uninhabited island off the north of Scotland, once they realise that when they do get here they will be handed a tent to sleep in on some miserable island in the winter they might decide France is a nicer place to live Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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