Eley pro eco wads - awful!

[Jimbo yorks]

Probably going to create an argument but here it goes.

Me and my friend got a few boxes for duck flighting (32gram 3) and have decided they are the worst steel cartridges we have ever used!

We had no clean kills between us i shot one it came down, shook its self off and flew off like nothing ever happened. Same experience with my friend shot a duck and it pretty much just stunned it and it flew off.

We decided to stop shooting because i refuse to shoot anything that doesn't produce clean kills. I went clay shooting with them the next day thinking it was maybe just my shooting(surley im not that bad?!). Edge on targets wouldn't  break and you could hear the shot bouncing off the clay at abround 30 yards!

I've spent 2 hours cleaning my gun today with solvents and a bronze brush on an electric drill just to remove the coaling in the barrel from them.absolutely awful things, looked like chunks of wad baked onto to the barrel walls and pitch black fouling.

Never experienced problems with other steel cartridges like this in the 15 years of using them.

What are other peoples experiences of these cartridges? Intrested to here!

Il be sticking to supersteels like I used to use from now on, it's a shame as the eleys sounded promising.

[neutron619]

Tested a box of these (#5, but the same cartridge) over the summer on pigeons and crows and they were not convincing. The patterns had looked OK - nothing special - but they didn't kill cleanly over the course of a box and the wads I found were absolutely mangled. No damage to the gun, but they looked pretty smashed up, holes and all.

My instinctive response on reading your post plus my experience was:

• propellant gas getting past the wad skirt, and
• I'd never expect to hit edge on clays reliably with steel #3 unless I was firing it from a 6" field gun.

I preferrred the equivalent Hull / Gamebore offerings. Super Steels are still my favourite; the greenish coloured Dark Storms were good too, but bloody expensive.

Edited November 21, 2022 by neutron619

[B725]

Me and my mate had the same problem with them

Steel v Lead - Bullets, Cartridges and Reloading - Pigeon Watch Forums

[London Best]

I have very limited experience of Pro-Eco Steel 3’s (less than one box up to now) but everything I have shot has come down seriously dead. That is a few ducks and the odd couple of pheasants, so not conclusive, but so far so good. I only have the 3’s as 5’s we’re unavailable.

[Scully]

You need to let Eley know, return the box to them and discover what the problem is. They will want to know, believe me. 

[Jimbo yorks]

 

I may have one or two left from clays but I certainly have the boxes left with the batch number.

They have been stored inside the house in a warm dry room, I got them last year but there's been no need to use any as we didn't get chance to use them.

Steel in general is very good but I do feel disappointed with these. Considering they were also 15 quid a box I'd expect better.

The only thing I can think of is the wad has started to degrade?! 

Maybe they should of gone down the hull cartridge or gamebore route with the it will decompose but not immediately.

Honestly I was convinced  mine was a dead duck. It absolutely stoned it in the air at about 25 yards landed belly up in the water. Literally shook its self of wondered what the hell happened and flew of like it hadn't been shot! 

 

[Dangerous Brian]

I have been using Pro-Eco steels left over from last year and they seem fine. 5's on the pheasants work well for me (didn't see a difference compared to lead 6's) and 3's for duck (also work well if I shoot the right bit of sky). Having said that, I heard the pellets hit a duck at the weekend which made it drop. It then flew off when the dog went up to it. I assumed I had just hit wing feathers hard enough to unbalance it. The other duck I shot that day was dead in the air. 

One thing to watch with the 3's is the pattern can get quite thin depending on the gun/ choke combo. If that all checks out, I would have a word with Eley- they should go better than what you've seen.

[Poor Shot]

Thanks for the review.

I've got purchase some steel biowads for an upcoming driven day. I had considered the eleys as the cheaper option but was hesitant as they are Standard steel with a low advertised velocity (1325 fps).

Probably worth going with a HP steel option like the dark storm Precision Steel and limiting the amount of shooting I do where steel ecowad cartridges are mandatory.

[Stonepark]

Eley pro eco steel are an experiment by Eley and whilst the ones I have fired when fresh seem to have been ok, the wads have appeared to age by drying out slightly (becoming less flexible), cardboard and "plastic" wads (whether oil or bio oil based) on otherhand are as good as when loaded.

[Jimbo yorks]

Strange thing is I load the cardboard ones in my 10 bore and have nothing but good stuff to say about them!

I mean they are trying to re invent the wheel really.

I know the whole marketing thing but federal have released a fibre wad hybrid that looks great in America. Standard fibre wad to get stack height then a cardboard tube around the steel shot. Now that's would be somthing I would use. Cheap as chips and most of all effective.

[Smudger687]

@Jimbo yorks Those 10 and 12 gauge clay and game card wads didn't prevent scoring of my chokes. I don't rate them at all. 

Personally having been burned with these biowads I'd be inclined to just buy a box at a time and use them quickly until the manufacturers have ironed out the problems with long term storage. 

Also of note is that the eley 32g 3 offering is not a size 3 (3.56mm) but is in fact a size 4 (3.25mm) - 4 is the maximum shot size for standard steel, which these cartridges are marketed as. 

[Dave at kelton]

Used these in both 12 and 20 bore effectively. When I am on the birds they are dead. Heavy fouling from the wads around the forcing cone but otherwise clean out fine. I use in imp cyl to 1/4 chokes.

[GSP84]

I have had great experience with the Eley VIP Pro eco wad, 32g 5s. Best steel I have ever used. Most estates I shoot are now requiring non toxic and non plastic wad. 
 

I’ve been knocking birds clean out of the sky at rediculous heights. No worse performance that the RC Sipe, and hull high pheasant extreme leads that I’ve used for years and years. 
 

i did try the Gamebore Quadseal, and they kept misfiring and blocking my barrel which put me off them massively. The Hull biowad just didn’t seem to kill nice at all. 

[Scully]

1 hour ago, GSP84 said:

I 
 

I’ve been knocking birds clean out of the sky at rediculous heights. No worse performance that the RC Sipe, and hull high pheasant extreme leads that I’ve used for years and years. 
 

 

That’s good to know; RC SIPE are my go to game cartridge. 👍

 

[GSP84]

19 minutes ago, Scully said:

That’s good to know; RC SIPE are my go to game cartridge. 👍

 

Do have much hearing left? I find the RC Sipe louder and punchier than any other cartridge. Even with ear plugs in I get a headache 

[The Mighty Prawn]

I’ve had mixed results with 32g 5’s with a few birds coming down and then heading off again in a minute

i needed some shot for a project the other day so opened one of these and found the eco wad a curiously sticky thing with a fair bit of shot stuck too it so maybe they’re just not releasing the shot very well?

these were bought end of last season and properly stored so don’t think the wad can be blamed on that

[flippermaj]

I have used both the 5s and 3s.  I have probably shot 300 plus over the last 2 years.  
My experience has been all positive, both sizes drop pigeons well and the both sizes drop teal and widgeon equally as well.

Last year I decided to use my old SXS for the wildfowling season so used the 3s for all my goose shooting, this was foreshore flighting.  As long as I kept the range sensible they killed pinks just fine, maybe 30 or so fell to that combo last year.

[neutron619]

I wonder if so-called "back bored" barrels are an issue.

Someone said above that the wads go hard after a while. I wonder if they aren't expanding in over-size barrels? - but I realize when I say that that a difference of 0.010"-0.015" (max) shouldn't be enough to affect a wad / seal expanding.

Perhaps I should have tried them in the Baikal with a .718" bore that I have in the cupboard... It's nearer a 13-bore than a 12.

Edited November 21, 2022 by neutron619

[Scully]

2 hours ago, GSP84 said:

Do have much hearing left? I find the RC Sipe louder and punchier than any other cartridge. Even with ear plugs in I get a headache 

Can’t say I’ve noticed to be honest, although OH reckons my hearing has worsened over the past couple of years. 🤷‍♂️

[rbrowning2]

35 minutes ago, neutron619 said:

 

Someone said above that the wads go hard after a while. 

I would expect the eley eco wads to go soft over time and possibly expand if absorbing water as they are hygroscopic hence they were or are? melting the petals of the case closure together to stop moisture entering through the hole/gap where the petals meet in the centre of the crimped case.  Even when removing a couple from a new box of cartridges they are a soft rubbery even sticky wad to start with as previously commented on.
Being hygroscopic is one of the disadvantages of any water soluble plastic, however they and the cardboard types do then degrade quickly once in the environment, which is very unlikely for other types which claim to be biodegradable by meeting industrial composting standards.

[bigroomboy]

I'm slightly worried about this thread. I got a slab of 32g 5s earlier this year and have not found them convincing. Seem to be ok close and centre in the pattern but as the range increase or the pellet strikes are lower myself and a few in the shoot had a fair number of runners or not even coming down. I assumed this was a shot size issue as I would often choose to shoot no 5 lead so 5 steel feels small. The problem is I just invested in another slob of the pro eco in no3....?

[Jimbo yorks]

After my experience I won't be buying them again.

I'm still removing the crudd. from inside the barrel as we speak it's properly stuck.

A couple of people from the shoot have commented on how rubbish they have been now I've said.

Forgot to put that out another night and the same happened shot a duck and it carried of flying clearly was hit. I put it down to my shooting rather than the cartridges. But it appears i was wrong!

[joejoe]

I have used the Eley Eco no. 5 for a few years now and not found them any worse than lead no. 6 pigeons loads which I have used for rough shooting pheasants and even the odd hare.  Some times perhaps a little more damage to the meat.

On the plus side it means I can feed game to my young son without the misses worrying. And the waste from the carcasses goes to a friend who feeds them for he’s hawks. 

 

[Scully]

6 hours ago, Jimbo yorks said:

After my experience I won't be buying them again.

I'm still removing the crudd. from inside the barrel as we speak it's properly stuck.

A couple of people from the shoot have commented on how rubbish they have been now I've said.

Forgot to put that out another night and the same happened shot a duck and it carried of flying clearly was hit. I put it down to my shooting rather than the cartridges. But it appears i was wrong!

Have you informed Eley? 

[Jimbo yorks]

Going to get onto it tommorow. Got the box out the car tonight so just need to look for the batch number!