Dsc1 requirement becoming more common.

[Green hornet]

I’ve got quite a lot of land to shoot on and I can also shoot Deer and have the rifle and condition on my ticket.About a year ago I came across a farm getting destroyed by pigeons so offered my services and farmer was happy with me to shoot.

Eventually about 6 months in I asked if I could shoot the foxes with my rifles as I was seeing afew about and he was more then happy with this too.

I always see deer on this land and I mean always never been a day I’ve never seen one and there brave as **** You could easily walk upto 100 yards of them and they don’t even care.

I thought I’ve been here while and trusted  by now so I will ask when I next see him.Then I bump into him yesterday and mention about the Amount of deer I’ve seen since shooting there and how the farm manager was saying to me about the damage there doing and he’s had enough.

 Straight away he comes out with he wants them shot and what experience do I have I mentioned I have 10 years experience and know all my species and seasons and can provide refs from my other land owners.

Next thing he asked was have I done a dsc1 I said no so he’s reply was he’s looking for some one that’s done dsc1? And if I know anyone that had done one to take care of them.

[sako751sg]

Not on farmland up this way.

Would be shocked if any of the 25ish places would even know such a thing existed.

[spandit]

Then do DSC1 and crack on.

[Scully]

It isn’t a legal requirement to have DSC1 or 2, for that matter, but in the face of a lack of resistance I can see it becoming so eventually.

None if the shooting representative bodies will oppose it as most run courses and profit from people undertaking them.

As Spandit says, sit it and crack on.

[spandit]

It’s a good course and a recognised qualification. Many on here and TDS would be over the moon to have a large deer permission so don’t spoil it by refusing to do the course. 

[scotslad]

I'd 2nd wot spandit has said above it is quite a decent course. And u will learn something

I'm guessing if there is a farm manager it's possibly an estate farm or decent sized farm so might be more clued up about insurance or something hence the DSC1

 

I'd guess most farmers wouldn't have a clue about it or really care about it

[lloydi73]

Why don't you team up with somone who has DSC 1, get an agreement you will accompnay them on all stalks until you get it, and then either sahre the stalking, or they have to call it quits when you say....that way you won't lose then deer shooting when/if you eventually get DSC 1 certified......

[Dunkield]

It's a requirement for my estate, a friend of mine wanted to join my syndicate and had an interest in learning more so just took the course - now he is in.

You could spend time joining in with arguments over why you shouldn't have to do it, or just do it an enjoy the stalking - chances are you will learn something even if you are quite experienced.

[oowee]

I was lucky enough to get a sponsored place off Stalking Directory. Well worth the time. 

[Dekers]

The DSC is a requirement for more and more estates and of course, the FC.

DSC1 is bad enough but some ask/demand DSC2.

I have historically been a Deer Mentor for Wilts, Thames Valley and the Met Police, they are more than happy to accept my reports on shooters yet I have no DSC at all.   

Who would you rather go Deer stalking with, the Gamekeeper, whos Father, Grandfather, Great Grandfather, etc.,  have all been Gamekeepers all their lives, or the Accountant who has never been before but just spent £300 getting a DSC1? 

Let me be clear here, I am not per se, ANTI the DSC, some training may well be useful, what I am seriously ANTI is groups/organizations/landowners/etc., demanding it simply as an **** covering exercise, which is exactly why most do ask for it!

[bostonmick]

Regardless of whether you think it is worth anything the man owns the land and his rules are sacred. 

[Green hornet]

Totally agree with u dekers.when I was first granted a deer rifle I was given the option by my Feo he said do a dsc course or find someone who had the experience of deer stalking to mentor me.

i was lucky enough to find someone who had nearly 20years experience with deer  to mentor me and I was granted the deer condition and rifle.

unfortunately it does look like he’s trying to cover he’s back side but I can’t see how a dsc1 will make me be a better shot on he’s land or any safer.

 I will do in the dsc in the future as I think it’s going to be more common for land owners to request this oneday.I do have other land for deer so think I’m going to let him find someone else. 

[lloydi73]

15 hours ago, Green hornet said:

I will do in the dsc in the future as I think it’s going to be more common for land owners to request this oneday.I do have other land for deer so think I’m going to let him find someone else. 

Why don't you suggest he looks on here, or advise area and put someone off here in touch with him and help out fellow shootiers who are struggling to find land/pernisions?!?

[GingerCat]

For the short amout of time and  small expense it would take, its a no brainer to get it done and shoot the deer yourself. 

A couple of deer and it's paid for itself. 

[activeviii]

i have been controlling deer numbers for many years, never thought i needed the DCS and use to poo poo it as a money making scheme. might well be but. i has a few £££ spare a few years back and thought why not, went off on my own, did the 3 days, think i might have known enough to pass it without doing the classroom stuff but, in all truth, i still learnt a lot. not all relevant to me but still nice to learn a few new things.

i personally think we should have a competency test before you are allowed to have FAC, saw a few things on the course that was worrying, and taken people out that are also worrying.

even the DSC2 would be better than nothing. if its done properly, and not in the pub, then at least people put into practise what they have learnt in the DSC1. I did mine this year as i needed it for something else but in all fairness, not that i learnt anything on it but i did met a couple of stalkers, that really do know their stuff, one gent that i have been lucky enough to be invited over to help him with culls.

 

do i think DSC need for shooting deer? at the moment yes, as its better than nothing, but i would like to see formal training being introduced.

[Scully]

What is your reason for believing there is a need for formal training or a competency test for FAC, and what advantages does it have over the present system? 

[Walker570]

I spent some time guiding both in the UK and overseas and have taken out the 'Good Bad & the UGLY believe me. A few could not wait on their arrival at our first meeting to tell me they had their DSC1 and one particular said he had his DSC2 and bar whatever that is. He turned out to be a complete paper hat and for certain I would not leave him in a high seat on his own.

Others have proved to be similar bit not quite as bad. Had one, wounded a deer, then instead of sitting tight as he should have done, went wandering off in pursuit, eventually I heard a shot and when finding him he pointed to an open spot between the trees with sky behind and said he had shot the deer again when it put it's head round the tree ...that bullet would have gone a couple of miles into the village for all I know. I then informed him that there was a track and footpath just beyond that tree and it did not seem to register. It was not my area and I was just helping out a friend or he would have been on his way home at that point.  He was bragging all rhe way down in the truck how he had passed his DSC1 and 2 and shot a perfect group on the tests etc etc.

I have been shooting some kind of gun for 71yrs, 40 of those on deer both in the UK and other countries, I served 14yrs as a Tactical Firearms Officer with my police force.  I want to see the CV of the person issuing the Certificate. I also hold a driving license as do many others but that doesn't prevent them from crashing into and killing each other.

Now having had that ..ok rant ... I am not against education but it was brought in by insurance companies and then persons seeing it as a money tree.  I don't recollect any great problems with stalkers/shooters prior to this requirement.

If it becomes law, then I will be spending a lot of time in Slovenia.

Edited July 29, 2018 by Walker570

[WelshMike]

The issue with a "formal qualification" is what people do when they are out in the field. I bet most of us drive in a way that doesnt match the standard required to pass a driving test and I imagine the same of shooting unfortunately. Also (and no disrespect is intended) but the DSC1 isnt exactly challenging and if you cant pass the shooting assessment you probably should pick another hobby. 

I did my DSC1 a few years back and shoot a couple of deer a year with a friend. He doesnt have DSC1 and shoots around 100 or so a year. If I was a farmer I know who I would want and it wouldnt be me. 

The world has gone qualification over experience mad. Does a 17th Ed piece of paper (soon to be 18th Ed) make you an electrician...nope. 

[Dunkield]

In many cases it's a back side covering exercise, same in any profession 

Of course having it doesn't automatically make you great deer stalker, in same way stalking for years and shooting hundreds of deer doesn't either.

A stalker of 40 years + was re-taking his shooting test when I did mine, as he failed it first time round, and you can't put that down to nerves.

I have had mine for 15 years and shoot about 60 deer a year, I learn something new every time I go out.

[oowee]

12 minutes ago, Dunkield said:

In many cases it's a back side covering exercise, same in any profession 

Of course having it doesn't automatically make you great deer stalker, in same way stalking for years and shooting hundreds of deer doesn't either.

A stalker of 40 years + was re-taking his shooting test when I did mine, as he failed it first time round, and you can't put that down to nerves.

I have had mine for 15 years and shoot about 60 deer a year, I learn something new every time I go out.

I think the constant learning is part of what makes the sport so addictive. 

When i did my DSC there was a professional keeper that had to have a few go's to pass the shoot test. The more he missed the more nervous and so on. Part of me thinks that in some ways that 'pressure' is what brings an element of realism to the shooting. 

The paper work is just a way to demonstrate that you have at least done the basics. 

[ShootingEgg]

On 29/07/2018 at 16:40, Scully said:

What is your reason for believing there is a need for formal training or a competency test for FAC, and what advantages does it have over the present system? 

There are no needs as such, firearms dept though are starting to say you have to do an awareness course and in some cases dsc1. 

[Scully]

9 hours ago, ShootingEgg said:

There are no needs as such, firearms dept though are starting to say you have to do an awareness course and in some cases dsc1. 

Yes, some are, but that doesn’t answer the questions I asked. There is absolutely nothing wrong with the present system. It works fine, and has done so for as long as people have been stalking.

[Mungler]

I did the DSC1 a few years back with BASC because I could see the writing on the wall and it’s the only paper based way to show that you have been tested on knowing one end of a rifle/deer from another.

Turned out to be a massively good crack with likeminded people and hey I actually learnt a thing or too as well; who knew that could happen ?

As has been said, he who owns the land makes the rules and has the final say, so that’s that.

[Old farrier]

Hi 

i did the Basc one a couple of years ago 

sadly it wasn’t very good 

presenter kept harping back to what he’d shot in the 1980s and not very good at holding anybody’s attention 

only 2 on the group had shot bigger than air rifle 

so consequently the course was directed at the weakest person on it (who didn’t even know you could shoot if sticks seated or kneeling) 

personally found it not a very good experience and a bit of a ripoff 

sure there’s good courses however this one wasn’t 

who tests the testers?

 

[Redgum]

On ‎24‎/‎07‎/‎2018 at 11:38, lloydi73 said:

Why don't you suggest he looks on here, or advise area and put someone off here in touch with him and help out fellow shootiers who are struggling to find land/pernisions?!?

Ha Ha, in an ideal world