Italian Bridge Colapse

[TIGHTCHOKE]

here is a link to the BBC News article;

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-europe-45208420

Shocking to see that the private Company that were responsible for the upkeep of the collapsed bridge in Genoa seem to have spent very little on it whilst charging high tolls. Thay also seem to be rather slack on paying their taxes as they are based in Luxembourg for tax purposes!

Edited August 16, 2018 by TIGHTCHOKE
Spellage!

[ditchman]

dont quote me on this but i heard that in Italy there had been 12 bridge failures since 2002 all bridges built in the same era............

[Penelope]

2 minutes ago, ditchman said:

dont quote me on this but i heard that in Italy there had been 12 bridge failures since 2002 all bridges built in the same era............

I believe that you are correct.

[Lloyd90]

15 minutes ago, ditchman said:

dont quote me on this but i heard that in Italy there had been 12 bridge failures since 2002 all bridges built in the same era............

A friend had a business out there for a few years, he said the corruption, back handers and violence against those that don’t pay was a very real thing and it was absolutely rife! 

He said if you don’t pay your business is burned down and he saw it happen. 

Sounds like a shambles of a country... 

Anyone else ever experience or hear stories like this? 

[Walker570]

They had warnings about the design/materials etc a long time ago and basically ignored them.  The powers that have now atken over..ok they are for getting out of the EU anyway....have put some of the blame on the constraints on spending put on by the EU.  

Some very very lucky people though. The family who had to make a pit stop for toilet made them 10 mins later reaching the bridge and the green van driver only yards from the edge.

I did hear it was accepted as an additional 'tax'

 

Edited August 16, 2018 by Walker570

[Vince Green]

1 minute ago, Lloyd90 said:

A friend had a business out there for a few years, he said the corruption, back handers and violence against those that don’t pay was a very real thing and it was absolutely rife! 

He said if you don’t pay your business is burned down and he saw it happen. 

Sounds like a shambles of a country... 

Anyone else ever experience or hear stories like this? 

Its a throw back to Roman times then, by the sound of it! This sort of stuff is hardly new

[krugerandsmith]

52 minutes ago, TIGHTCHOKE said:

here is a link to the BBC News article;

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-europe-45208420

Shocking to see that the private Company that were responsible for the upkeep of the collapsed bridge in Genoa seem to have spent very little on it whilst charging high tolls. Thay also seem to be rather slack on paying their taxes as they are based in Luxembourg for tax purposes!

The...Two ....  A frame sections of the bridge looked very frail to me considering the height of the construction.

[oldypigeonpopper]

hello, all most certain to have Mafia connections, sad for all those that died or were injured not forgetting those brave search and rescue teams, i suppose we are lucky in the UK although we have a ****** goverment our health and safety standards are better than most countries, 

[Scully]

1 minute ago, oldypigeonpopper said:

hello, all most certain to have Mafia connections, sad for all those that died or were injured not forgetting those brave search and rescue teams, i suppose we are lucky in the UK although we have a ****** goverment our health and safety standards are better than most countries, 

Have a mate who was born in Malta to English parents and returns there quite regularly. I have no idea how he knows nor if it's true, but he says Mafia money funds many things on the island as well as Italy. 

[Medic1281]

10 minutes ago, Scully said:

Have a mate who was born in Malta to English parents and returns there quite regularly. I have no idea how he knows nor if it's true, but he says Mafia money funds many things on the island as well as Italy. 

Same with Sicily I believe. 

[oldypigeonpopper]

22 minutes ago, Scully said:

Have a mate who was born in Malta to English parents and returns there quite regularly. I have no idea how he knows nor if it's true, but he says Mafia money funds many things on the island as well as Italy. 

hello, i am sure we have corruption and the like in UK but nothing like those countries, 

[Jason_ox]

22 minutes ago, oldypigeonpopper said:

hello, i am sure we have corruption and the like in UK but nothing like those countries, 

Hate to say it but I believe I heard the UK is the top of the list for money laundering in the world. As said on some news channel not too long ago. You are quite correct we are fortunate that we don’t have the same level of incidents like this as other countries. 

[KB1]

2 hours ago, krugerandsmith said:

The...Two ....  A frame sections of the bridge looked very frail to me considering the height of the construction.

[TIGHTCHOKE]

2 hours ago, krugerandsmith said:

The...Two ....  A frame sections of the bridge looked very frail to me considering the height of the construction.

I think they have been up since the 1950s or 60s, if that was the case you would hope someone may have mentioned it a little earlier!

[Rewulf]

1967 it was built, and had some work done in 2016, when I assume it was given a check over/evaluation.
Its a poor state of affairs when heavy rain puts a construction like that down.
Poor concrete ?

[oldypigeonpopper]

2 hours ago, Rewulf said:

1967 it was built, and had some work done in 2016, when I assume it was given a check over/evaluation.
Its a poor state of affairs when heavy rain puts a construction like that down.
Poor concrete ?

hello, its a well known fact you can juggle the amount of cement going into construction projects using concrete, some of the buildings i have seen in china being constructed would make you think twice to buy.  

Edited August 16, 2018 by oldypigeonpopper

[KB1]

3 hours ago, krugerandsmith said:

The...Two ....  A frame sections of the bridge looked very frail to me considering the height of the construction.

I'd love to see your qualification of this?

[Munzy]

3 hours ago, Lloyd90 said:

A friend had a business out there for a few years, he said the corruption, back handers and violence against those that don’t pay was a very real thing and it was absolutely rife! 

He said if you don’t pay your business is burned down and he saw it happen. 

Sounds like a shambles of a country... 

Anyone else ever experience or hear stories like this? 

My friend is Sicilian from Catania and says that every single business in his city pays protection money to Cosa Nostra (Mafia) without exception. Small gift shops and bars right up to multinational coffee chains. The protection money is paid for “legitimate” services so that managers of multinational companies who may oversee spending cannot dispute the payments which go out of the door. They are a tax deductible part of doing business in Sicily.

It is the bread and butter of Cosa Nostra to tax the general public (financially) in this way but it also helps enforce the power and highlight the reach of the clans over their community which may become useful if a civilian should witness some serious crime or somehow become a threat to the criminals. In short it is a constant reminder that Cosa Nostra is always around, always watching and is as unstoppable as government.

Mafia has become a generic term for organised crime throughout the world but really it only relates to Cosa Nostra in Sicily. Other groups such as the Camorra and ‘Ndrangeta hold power elsewhere in Italy but most of the corruption is focussed in the south.

These gangs sprung out of the unification of Italy and the break up of large expanses of land owned by rich barons. Organised crime in Italy is now part of life, it wouldn’t surprise me at all if it played a part in cost cutting to generate profit in this bridge. However, it must be remembered that organised crime just represents another dirty finger in the pie, another nose in the trough alongside “legitimate” governments, businesses and individuals who are also self serving and looking for the money.

There is no difference in my book between Cosa Nostra skimming money off the maintenance contract for the bridge by not making necessary repairs over the years and a construction company in the UK increasing their profits by cladding a towerblock in unsafe material at the risk of endangering life.

Someone profits by cutting corners and some other poor soul pays the ultimate price.

*For the record these are hypotheticals... I have no idea if anyone was negligent in the Grenfell disaster or indeed this Genoese tragedy. I thought I would chime in because I would hate to read, “Mafia responsible for bridge collapse” and see the world shaking their heads at organised crime whilst turning a blind eye to corruption within our own government contracts, both nationally and locally.

[oowee]

3 minutes ago, Munzy said:

” and see the world shaking their heads at organised crime whilst turning a blind eye to corruption within our own government contracts, both nationally and locally.

There is certainly some corruption here but it's certainly nothing on the scale in Italy where it could be described as endemic. My friends in Rome even had to pay a fee to get their son into his University of choice. 

[Rewulf]

6 minutes ago, Munzy said:

 

*For the record these are hypotheticals...

Did the thought of a horses head in your bed , or a set of concrete boots pop into your head then ? ?

[guzzicat]

10 minutes ago, Munzy said:

My friend is Sicilian from Catania and says that every single business in his city pays protection money to Cosa Nostra (Mafia) without exception. Small gift shops and bars right up to multinational coffee chains. The protection money is paid for “legitimate” services so that managers of multinational companies who may oversee spending cannot dispute the payments which go out of the door. They are a tax deductible part of doing business in Sicily.

It is the bread and butter of Cosa Nostra to tax the general public (financially) in this way but it also helps enforce the power and highlight the reach of the clans over their community which may become useful if a civilian should witness some serious crime or somehow become a threat to the criminals. In short it is a constant reminder that Cosa Nostra is always around, always watching and is as unstoppable as government.

Mafia has become a generic term for organised crime throughout the world but really it only relates to Cosa Nostra in Sicily. Other groups such as the Camorra and ‘Ndrangeta hold power elsewhere in Italy but most of the corruption is focussed in the south.

These gangs sprung out of the unification of Italy and the break up of large expanses of land owned by rich barons. Organised crime in Italy is now part of life, it wouldn’t surprise me at all if it played a part in cost cutting to generate profit in this bridge. However, it must be remembered that organised crime just represents another dirty finger in the pie, another nose in the trough alongside “legitimate” governments, businesses and individuals who are also self serving and looking for the money.

There is no difference in my book between Cosa Nostra skimming money off the maintenance contract for the bridge by not making necessary repairs over the years and a construction company in the UK increasing their profits by cladding a towerblock in unsafe material at the risk of endangering life.

Someone profits by cutting corners and some other poor soul pays the ultimate price.

*For the record these are hypotheticals... I have no idea if anyone was negligent in the Grenfell disaster or indeed this Genoese tragedy. I thought I would chime in because I would hate to read, “Mafia responsible for bridge collapse” and see the world shaking their heads at organised crime whilst turning a blind eye to corruption within our own government contracts, both nationally and locally.

Read a book on holiday in Italy, re Mafia, into Everything, Toxic waste down wells by controlled companies, containers stuffed with dead Chinese who paid bogus companies to be buried in China,dodgy building supplies,book " Cammora", worth a read, I left mine  in villa when we left.

[Munzy]

10 minutes ago, Rewulf said:

Did the thought of a horses head in your bed , or a set of concrete boots pop into your head then ? ?

I wonder what percentage of Italian horses die as a result of “Sicilian Messages”... gotta be more than 0.2% surely? @Benthejockey should start an online petition!

[TIGHTCHOKE]

11 minutes ago, Munzy said:

I wonder what percentage of Italian horses die as a result of “Sicilian Messages”... gotta be more than 0.2% surely? @Benthejockey should start an online petition!

PW Gold! A brilliant retort, well done.

[Rewulf]

44 minutes ago, Munzy said:

I wonder what percentage of Italian horses die as a result of “Sicilian Messages”... gotta be more than 0.2% surely? @Benthejockey should start an online petition!

? Its an offer you cant refuse !

[jonny705]

Uk has been bang at it for ages:

https://www.ft.com/content/addd777e-de43-11e7-a8a4-0a1e63a52f9c

https://inews.co.uk/news/uk/ministers-rush-close-scottish-corporate-secrecy-loophole-amid-money-laundering-claims/

One of the main reasons property is so expensive in London and no tenants in a lot of them .

Edited August 16, 2018 by jonny705