Brexit - merged threads

[Scully]

1 hour ago, oowee said:

 

So whats your best guess? Life as normal? 

I would think so, as others have said, what’s the worst that could happen? 

[JohnfromUK]

Interesting to hear Corbyn's views on Europe and second referendums; https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-6667879/Video-shows-Jeremy-Corbyn-branding-EU-military-Frankenstein-European-empire-21st-century.html

[Walker570]

On 27/01/2019 at 15:58, oowee said:

Bath and North East Somerest, JRM 58% remain to 42% quit. Moggy has betrayed and rejected his constituents. 

Yep but 50% of those where students and they are now turning against Comrade Corbyn in droves.  Ask yourself, did you know anyhting about life when you where 18, I knew how to calve a cow and drive a tractor but didn't have a clue about running the country.

[pinfireman]

17 hours ago, oowee said:

So you would prefer a politician to tell the people they cannot vote on a subject? I prefer the power to be with the people rather than with the politicians. 

As you say it is up to the politicians to enact the will of the people but what is that apart from leave?If we just leave the EU lots will be unhappy. Leaving everything is the politics of insanity. The politicians need to enact the will of the people. 

The power has NOT been with the people! It,s been with the UNELECTED EU Commissioners for 40 years!  But now it,s coming back to the people!

17 hours ago, panoma1 said:

How would we know whether the people wanted another vote? How would we find out? Hold a referendum? Or because remainers say we do?

What triggers asking the people whether they want another vote? A majority vote by the UK public? Or because the remainers say so?

Who decides when and whether we need to ask again? The majority or the minority? Remainers are the minority!

Would the referendum question be "do you want another vote, Yes or no?............then if the public voted "yes".......do then we hold another in/out referendum?

If this time the people voted to remain, would leavers be given a chance to reverse this decision too? With a third referendum? And so on ad infinitum

[pinfireman]

3 hours ago, oowee said:

We have a vote that we are running with for now. If for whatever reason we cannot get a deal and we go for a general election. It may be (and any guess is as good as the next) that the parties offer different options. No vote, in or out, customs union. Whichever party won would provide the question. 

 

I think there will be big differences.

Day to day life. Reduction in wage rate increases as we seek to be more competitive. A fundamental change in farming and food prices (up and down) as we do the trade deal with US and prices increase for EU produce. More UK grown fruit and veg. Inflation and currency devaluation following less efficient trade deal with EU. An increase in retirement age and an increase in taxation, reduction in spending. Less immigration. 

Day to day life the complete opposite of the above.

A lot of guesses there,  but I think you are unlikely to put your money on it!  

2 hours ago, oowee said:

 George is alright 🙂 

So whats your best guess? Life as normal? 

George is a bitter moron!

1 hour ago, Walker570 said:

Yep but 50% of those where students and they are now turning against Comrade Corbyn in droves.  Ask yourself, did you know anyhting about life when you where 18, I knew how to calve a cow and drive a tractor but didn't have a clue about running the country.

and some of those students voted twice! At uni digs, and back at parents home!

[pinfireman]

Gavin Barwell was spotted in St Pancras this morning getting off the 8.52am Eurostar from Brussels – complete with overnight bag and accompanied by an unidentified aide. A co-conspirator says Barwell was looking very pleased…

The PM’s Chief of Staff hasn’t been a regular visitor to Brussels during the negotiations so far and his visit wasn’t briefed out to the media. What could he have been up to?

Barwell is an arch Remainer! Thought to be behind the advice to the PM to hold the disastrous 2017 Election! He,s up to no good.................

Investor confidence has plummeted to a four-year low in the Eurozone, with a sixth consecutive monthly fall in the Sentix index taking it to its lowest level since November 2014. Sentix said Eurozone growth was “weaking dangerously quickly and strongly.” Meanwhile Germany’s investor morale dropped to its lowest level since August 2012 in a separate index as it teeters on the brink of recession…

Naturally Brexit is being blamed, despite the UK currently having higher investor confidence and the fastest growing European economy in the G7. It’s one thing for underperforming companies to use Brexit as an excuse for their poor results. It’s quite another for underperforming EU countries to use it as an excuse for why they’re doing worse than the UK…

Naturally, oowee and Retsdon will have a different take on this, with their "special" inside knowledge....

[Rewulf]

4 hours ago, oowee said:

We have a vote that we are running with for now. If for whatever reason we cannot get a deal and we go for a general election.

Interesting take on it..'for now' so we are 'running with it' you make it sound like the whole 2016 Ref was a waste of time, a non event ?

And Im pretty sure parliament voted to trigger article 50 (by a huge majority) the fact that they got a vote on it was (courtesy of Gina soros) an attempt to destroy the Ref result and stop it dead.
Which gave parliament a vote on the final deal, with a recognised default position of WTO terms if the vote didnt pass.

Now we are saying , if parliament cant agree a deal, we need to have a general election to again pick a party that might deliver Brexit, the Brexit the MAJORITY voted for 2 and a half years ago !
So according to your wisdom we had a vote in June 2016, but we are just 'running' with that, in other words , we shall ignore it for now.

The government got taken to court by a foreign billionaire to get a vote on enabling the Ref result (A 50)
Which they voted to do en masse, but thats immaterial , so ignore that too eh ?

Then we have to go back to court to let parliament vote on any deal, again ignoring the Ref vote (At this point a referendum on whether this would be OK with the plebs could have saved mucho heartache)

May comes out with a deal that is designed to please both sides of the camp, its a rubbish deal that costs the country billions , and leaves us heavily attached to Brussels, with a proviso that, if we cant satisfy the EU on the NI border issue, we effectively leave NI in the EU.
The EU says its to protect the peace in Ireland, however, even my cat knows that splitting NI off from the UK is GUARANTEED to do exactly the opposite..
In the end Mays deal is resoundly clobbered in the house, any attempt to ask the plebs if they liked Mays deal, or would prefer WTO ? No, ignored again.

At what point did the decision about the future relationship with Europe get taken away from the people ?
Are we not intelligent enough to make that decision ? I suppose it depends which way you voted ?

Some people still vote labour and lib dems, despite the obvious mental deficiency in that action, do we tell them we have to go back to the polls if labour get in (and hell freezes over)
Why are we still letting our elected trough munchers keep trying to derail Brexit ? Dont we care enough ?
Democracy has been taken away from you, you voted, Brexit won, what is complicated about that, the default position is WTO in 7 weeks.

Ms Miller claimed after her first court victory 'Government forgot, Parliament is sovereign'
In fact , she forgot, the PEOPLE are sovereign, we elect them democratically, and we can boot them out democratically if they dont do their job.
And its time they either backed Mays deal, backed WTO or resigned, if their 'conscience' will let them do neither.
To make it fair , any MP who doesnt get behind Brexit, should face a by election, AFTER Brexit is delivered.

[motty]

5 hours ago, oowee said:

We have a vote that we are running with for now. If for whatever reason we cannot get a deal and we go for a general election. It may be (and any guess is as good as the next) that the parties offer different options. No vote, in or out, customs union. Whichever party won would provide the question. 

 

I think there will be big differences.

Day to day life. Reduction in wage rate increases as we seek to be more competitive. A fundamental change in farming and food prices (up and down) as we do the trade deal with US and prices increase for EU produce. More UK grown fruit and veg. Inflation and currency devaluation following less efficient trade deal with EU. An increase in retirement age and an increase in taxation, reduction in spending. Less immigration. 

Day to day life the complete opposite of the above.

Come again? You are saying that less immigration is a bad thing?

[Rewulf]

1 minute ago, motty said:

Come again? You are saying that less immigration is a bad thing?

Course he is , bring em all over , another 5 - 10 mil ,  theres plenty of room in Somerset , them apples need picking 🤣

[pinfireman]

Oldham’s Hill’s Panel Products, which manufactures boards, doors, and furniture fittings is booming, having opened a second production line, worth £3 million. This will increase output of goods by at least 50%, from 30,000 units to 45,000, and in the longer term 50,000. This new investment will create more local jobs.

No jobs being lost by Nissan deciding to not build something new made headlines for days. Will the media give proportionate coverage to real new investment..?

1 hour ago, Rewulf said:

Course he is , bring em all over , another 5 - 10 mil ,  theres plenty of room in Somerset , them apples need picking 🤣

Maybe he could put a few up, whilst they settle in?

1 hour ago, Rewulf said:

Interesting take on it..'for now' so we are 'running with it' you make it sound like the whole 2016 Ref was a waste of time, a non event ?

And Im pretty sure parliament voted to trigger article 50 (by a huge majority) the fact that they got a vote on it was (courtesy of Gina soros) an attempt to destroy the Ref result and stop it dead.
Which gave parliament a vote on the final deal, with a recognised default position of WTO terms if the vote didnt pass.

Now we are saying , if parliament cant agree a deal, we need to have a general election to again pick a party that might deliver Brexit, the Brexit the MAJORITY voted for 2 and a half years ago !
So according to your wisdom we had a vote in June 2016, but we are just 'running' with that, in other words , we shall ignore it for now.

The government got taken to court by a foreign billionaire to get a vote on enabling the Ref result (A 50)
Which they voted to do en masse, but thats immaterial , so ignore that too eh ?

Then we have to go back to court to let parliament vote on any deal, again ignoring the Ref vote (At this point a referendum on whether this would be OK with the plebs could have saved mucho heartache)

May comes out with a deal that is designed to please both sides of the camp, its a rubbish deal that costs the country billions , and leaves us heavily attached to Brussels, with a proviso that, if we cant satisfy the EU on the NI border issue, we effectively leave NI in the EU.
The EU says its to protect the peace in Ireland, however, even my cat knows that splitting NI off from the UK is GUARANTEED to do exactly the opposite..
In the end Mays deal is resoundly clobbered in the house, any attempt to ask the plebs if they liked Mays deal, or would prefer WTO ? No, ignored again.

At what point did the decision about the future relationship with Europe get taken away from the people ?
Are we not intelligent enough to make that decision ? I suppose it depends which way you voted ?

Some people still vote labour and lib dems, despite the obvious mental deficiency in that action, do we tell them we have to go back to the polls if labour get in (and hell freezes over)
Why are we still letting our elected trough munchers keep trying to derail Brexit ? Dont we care enough ?
Democracy has been taken away from you, you voted, Brexit won, what is complicated about that, the default position is WTO in 7 weeks.

Ms Miller claimed after her first court victory 'Government forgot, Parliament is sovereign'
In fact , she forgot, the PEOPLE are sovereign, we elect them democratically, and we can boot them out democratically if they dont do their job.
And its time they either backed Mays deal, backed WTO or resigned, if their 'conscience' will let them do neither.
To make it fair , any MP who doesnt get behind Brexit, should face a by election, AFTER Brexit is delivered.

Excellent post!

[pinfireman]

2 hours ago, pinfireman said:

Gavin Barwell was spotted in St Pancras this morning getting off the 8.52am Eurostar from Brussels – complete with overnight bag and accompanied by an unidentified aide. A co-conspirator says Barwell was looking very pleased…

The PM’s Chief of Staff hasn’t been a regular visitor to Brussels during the negotiations so far and his visit wasn’t briefed out to the media. What could he have been up to?

Barwell is an arch Remainer! Thought to be behind the advice to the PM to hold the disastrous 2017 Election! He,s up to no good.................

Investor confidence has plummeted to a four-year low in the Eurozone, with a sixth consecutive monthly fall in the Sentix index taking it to its lowest level since November 2014. Sentix said Eurozone growth was “weaking dangerously quickly and strongly.” Meanwhile Germany’s investor morale dropped to its lowest level since August 2012 in a separate index as it teeters on the brink of recession…

Naturally Brexit is being blamed, despite the UK currently having higher investor confidence and the fastest growing European economy in the G7. It’s one thing for underperforming companies to use Brexit as an excuse for their poor results. It’s quite another for underperforming EU countries to use it as an excuse for why they’re doing worse than the UK…

Naturally, oowee and Retsdon will have a different take on this, with their "special" inside knowledge....

Where have they gone?

[toxo]

1 hour ago, Rewulf said:

To make it fair , any MP who doesnt get behind Brexit, should face a by election, AFTER Brexit is delivered.

If they did this and took "remain" categorically off the table every MP would be clamouring to sign up. They're all mouth when they're not accountable.

[oowee]

2 hours ago, motty said:

Come again? You are saying that less immigration is a bad thing?

Classic words in mouth.. 

Who said that? I said that immigration will come down (in my prediction). I did not say it was either a good or bad outcome.

I think the reason it will fall is because initially we will struggle with the terms of entry. The new policy is skills based and some services (care for example) will require softer skills less easy to quantify. It will only be recognised and addressed when we have major systems failure. 

It will also be less as the the local supply from the EU is deterred by an apparent anti immigration image coupled with a reduced need for labour as the economy slows. Unless of course the EU economy slows faster. 

The shift in migration is likely to be towards third world countries as we give equal weight to applications and the associated easy visa that might be offered with a trade deal. Numbers may fall less than expected as the associated family movement will be greater and home returns are likely to be less. 

 

[Mice!]

8 hours ago, oowee said:

We have a vote that we are running with for now. If for whatever reason we cannot get a deal and we go for a general election. It may be (and any guess is as good as the next) that the parties offer different options. No vote, in or out, customs union. Whichever party won would provide the question. 

 

I think there will be big differences.

Day to day life. Reduction in wage rate increases as we seek to be more competitive. A fundamental change in farming and food prices (up and down) as we do the trade deal with US and prices increase for EU produce. More UK grown fruit and veg. Inflation and currency devaluation following less efficient trade deal with EU. An increase in retirement age and an increase in taxation, reduction in spending. Less immigration. 

Day to day life the complete opposite of the above.

my phone isn't letting me quote sections? I don't see any problem with more home grown foods.

As for reduction in wages most companies try that anyway, my employer changed shifts reducing wages, and lost a third of the staff and counting, so leaving the EU isn't likely to have as much impact as that did.

retirement age has only ever gone up and less immigration is actually a good thing as far as most people are concerned.

So as i said, i just don't see most people will notice anything different.

And you said something in an earlier post about sorting other things once this fiasco is sorted out, your right there its as if the country has stopped for two years.

[pinfireman]

4 hours ago, oowee said:

Classic words in mouth.. 

Who said that? I said that immigration will come down (in my prediction). I did not say it was either a good or bad outcome.

I think the reason it will fall is because initially we will struggle with the terms of entry. The new policy is skills based and some services (care for example) will require softer skills less easy to quantify. It will only be recognised and addressed when we have major systems failure. 

It will also be less as the the local supply from the EU is deterred by an apparent anti immigration image coupled with a reduced need for labour as the economy slows. Unless of course the EU economy slows faster. 

The shift in migration is likely to be towards third world countries as we give equal weight to applications and the associated easy visa that might be offered with a trade deal. Numbers may fall less than expected as the associated family movement will be greater and home returns are likely to be less. 

 

The EU is already falling faster!

At 11-00 p.m. on the 29th March, God willing, we are OUT!  Many of the people around here are already buying fireworks and rockets, to ignite at that moment............I hope this is carried out acreoss the country, and really rubs the Remoaners noses in it!

[Vince Green]

1 hour ago, pinfireman said:

The EU is already falling faster!

 

Yes that's the thing that seems to be the elephant in the room, forget us, forget Brexit, that's a distraction. The smart money is not talking about Brexit they are talking only about the Italian banks. The French banks are far too exposed to Italian debt, if Italy goes tits up, sorry, when Italy goes tits up France will follow. Brexit is pushed back to page 4.

However, despite not being in the Euro, British institutions are in way too deep with the French, utilities, Eurostar etc plus we "own" a lot of French debt. In or out we are exposed but out would be better. Either way its going to cost us a fortune. Moron remainers are going to blame all this on Brexit but in truth, Brexit is our salvation if it means that the  EU cannot hang a "bailout" on us as it has in the past.  

Its not our problem and its not our debt, that what has to become our mantra, the eu will try to hang it on us. that's for sure.

The imminent collapse of the Euro is all the money markets are concerned about. I've got a meeting with my IFA on Friday, he has called it, so it will be interesting to see what he has planned 

Edited February 5, 2019 by Vince Green

[12gauge82]

https://www.express.co.uk/news/uk/1082829/Brexit-news-UK-EU-Ireland-border-backstop-Leo-Varadkar-Theresa-May

 

This is hilarious, that'll be Ireland out next if they're not very careful, who the hell do they think they are! I predict the EU is going to sink like the titanic and sooner than I first thought if they don't reform radically, the further we are away from them when the giant house of cards fall the better. 

[Vince Green]

12 hours ago, 12gauge82 said:

https://www.express.co.uk/news/uk/1082829/Brexit-news-UK-EU-Ireland-border-backstop-Leo-Varadkar-Theresa-May

 

This is hilarious, that'll be Ireland out next if they're not very careful, who the hell do they think they are! I predict the EU is going to sink like the titanic and sooner than I first thought if they don't reform radically, the further we are away from them when the giant house of cards fall the better. 

Ireland is certainly in a strange place, financially insolvent but hosting just about every multinational corporation that trades predominantly in the UK, to evade tax  Ireland. On the day we leave will all these cosy arrangements stop? if so Ireland is toast!

Edited February 6, 2019 by Vince Green

[TIGHTCHOKE]

7 hours ago, Vince Green said:

Ireland is certainly in a strange place, financially insolvent but hosting just about every multinational corporation that trades predominantly in the UK but not in Ireland. On the day we leave will all these cosy arrangements stop? if so Ireland is toast!

Once again the business interests of individuals has far more clout than the massed voters! 

[Deker]

10 hours ago, Vince Green said:

Ireland is certainly in a strange place, financially insolvent but hosting just about every multinational corporation that trades predominantly in the UK but not in Ireland. On the day we leave will all these cosy arrangements stop? if so Ireland is toast!

 

They're already starting to stop, taking Apple as the example they benefited from a sweetheart tax which the EU then decided they wanted 13bn in back tax (from Apple alone), this has already put a stop on the $1bn data center that was going to be built in Ireland. Once we leave the EU there's no reason at all that the UK can't offer the same deals to pull these companies from the EU into the UK.

https://www.theguardian.com/business/2016/aug/30/eu-apple-ireland-tax-ruling-q-and-a

https://www.businessinsider.com/apples-growing-irish-empire-in-pictures-2016-2?r=UK#this-map-shows-where-apples-european-headquarters-is-in-relation-to-its-proposed-data-centre-and-the-irish-outposts-of-other-silicon-valley-giants-1

https://www.theverge.com/2018/5/10/17338734/apple-data-center-ireland-scrapped-athenry

 

[pinfireman]

Here,s some news oowee overlooked when he made his comments on the news from Nissan last week................

 

Nissan’s decision not to begin production of a new model of car in Sunderland dominated the media at the start of the week, despite no jobs actually being lost. Brexit naturally got all the blame, despite a large number of other significant factors including falling demand for diesel cars and the EU’s stringent new emissions standards in the wake of Germany’s major diesel fraud scandal. If it was really a Brexit issue why didn’t Nissan just move production to one of their many manufacturing plants in Spain, or France where they have a strategic partnership with Renault?

Funny how quiet the media was when another Japanese car giant did start a major new production line – just last month Toyota commenced production of the new 2019 Corolla at its Burnaston plant in Derbyshire where over 3000 people are employed. The Corolla is not a niche SUV like the Nissan X-Trail, it is the best-selling car model in the world…

In fact the only mention of the new Corolla on BBC News was a single line in an article puffing up the latest round of no-deal bluster from the firm’s European boss and Greg Clark, which didn’t even mention the fact that new production had started. Not a word from Project Fear cheerleaders Sky News…

That should clarify what,s happening................

[Rewulf]

The mask slips, as even the BBC are now reporting that, horror of horrors 'migrants' which used to be known as refugees fleeing war and persecution, are largely responsible for the 10 % rise in German crime rates. 

Other European countries watch with interest, as they wonder when it will be OK to admit much of their own crime increases are down to third world immigration. 

https://www.bbc.com/news/amp/world-europe-42557828?__twitter_impression=true

[TIGHTCHOKE]

51 days to go...............................

[ShootingEgg]

Nice to see tusk saying there is a special place in hell for the people(mps) who backed Brexit... 

[Rewulf]

6 minutes ago, ShootingEgg said:

Nice to see tusk saying there is a special place in hell for the people(mps) who backed Brexit... 

Bit strong! 🤣

https://www.theguardian.com/politics/live/2019/feb/06/brexit-latest-news-developments-pmqs-theresa-may-faces-further-backlash-after-backstop-comments-in-belfast-speech-politics-live