Lead ban & BASC

[wymberley]

11 hours ago, rbrowning2 said:

Let’s hope so, I have no issue with using steel shot, however I cannot afford bismuth. 
shall we have a small bet if B&P or Gaulandi (other than their photo degradable wad) offer a biodegradable wad in 28ga by the start of the 2020 season I will donate £20.00 to a charity of your choice if they don’t you donate £20.00 to the charity of my choice.

 

 

Just in case you missed it, Lancer, the gauntlet is down.

[Old farrier]

44 minutes ago, ClemFandango said:

CCI and Winchester both produce non lead .22lr ammunition. 

That’s handy I can start practicing pity they don’t make 2.1/2 inch steel cartridges with a degradable wad 

[Dibble]

9 hours ago, McSpredder said:

If you kill a bird using steel shot, it might already be carrying one or more lead pellets that have caused no obvious injury.  

Are there any metal detector experts on the forum?   Is there any reasonably priced equipment that can identify lead (whole pellets and/or smaller fragments) in a carcase?  

Has anyone ever checked that the oft quoted x% of wildfowl that contain lead shot don’t contain steel as well. A bird could easily get a minor wound from lead abroad 

[Old farrier]

Wednesday morning still no email from BASC informing me as a member of the new proposed agreement On banning lead shot 

pretty poor well actually worse than appalling 

I have however had 2 emails from my gunmakers on the subject 

[Walker570]

The lead shot in food is just a blind.  I am fast approaching 80yrs of age and have eaten game meat shot with lead shot almost since the first day I went onto solid food. Back in the war years rabbit pies where staple Sunday lunches along with woodpigeon, hares, snipe, and even house sparrows(shot in there hundreds with #9 dust shot). As of today game appears on our weekly meal at least once a week and surprise surprise, I am still alive and pleased to say pretty fit for my age. 

These days I do shoot non lead rifle bullets in my centre fires but not because of lead poisoning.  The all copper Barnes TSX and TTSX do the job in spades in my rifles and shoot accurately.

The Chinese did grasp the nettle once and restricted birth rates. The rest of the world should do the same. THAT would reduce pollution quicker than anything

[JohnfromUK]

1 minute ago, Walker570 said:

The Chinese did grasp the nettle once and restricted birth rates. The rest of the world should do the same. THAT would reduce pollution quicker than anything

+1;

Overpopulation is putting pressure on the planet in SO MANY ways.  Off topic for here, but gradually reducing population would ease a lot of pressures

[Smokersmith]

1 hour ago, wymberley said:

Just in case you missed it, Lancer, the gauntlet is down.

Grow up  … the deadline is 5 years away …. why can't folks get this

[Farmboy91]

28 minutes ago, Dibble said:

Has anyone ever checked that the oft quoted x% of wildfowl that contain lead shot don’t contain steel as well. A bird could easily get a minor wound from lead abroad 

That has always been my opinion too.

I can't believe that many guns over here are still using lead on waterfowl. Yes there maybe a small % no where near as many as has been suggested. 

6 minutes ago, Smokersmith said:

Grow up  … the deadline is 5 years away …. why can't folks get this

Think he may have been joking... 

[wymberley]

14 minutes ago, Farmboy91 said:

That has always been my opinion too.

I can't believe that many guns over here are still using lead on waterfowl. Yes there maybe a small % no where near as many as has been suggested. 

Think he may have been joking... 

Think someone had a bad night and got out of the bed on the wrong side.

[Penelope]

2 hours ago, Old farrier said:

That’s handy I can start practicing pity they don’t make 2.1/2 inch steel cartridges with a degradable wad 

From what I have read on the press release from BASC, the voluntary 'ban' only effects shotgun ammunition.

[grahamch]

52 minutes ago, wymberley said:

Think someone had a bad night and got out of the bed on the wrong side.

Sadly most duck shot inland on driven days etc. are still shot with lead by irresponsible estates who dont care. These then end up at dealers and are checked and found to contain lead shot so we all end up tarred with the same brush

[wymberley]

37 minutes ago, grahamch said:

Sadly most duck shot inland on driven days etc. are still shot with lead by irresponsible estates who dont care. These then end up at dealers and are checked and found to contain lead shot so we all end up tarred with the same brush

Don't know what that has to do with my post, but that certainly is adamning indictment

[lancer425]

2 hours ago, wymberley said:

Just in case you missed it, Lancer, the gauntlet is down.

I never take wagers which is a shame in a way because i an Quietly"i emphasise the word quietly " confident, the cartridge firms here and abroad will be coming up with loads and wads to comply with the voluntary lead/ plaswad ban.

I tend to post here straight off a phone i got brightness right down and outside glare off screen etc, i just about get by. But looking on other sites i just about manage ti youtube and link videos.   BUT "My point beinghere"  If anybody on thir family himac / Lap top, would be so kind as to email the likes of those scandi, wad makers ( sorry but can not remember their names nowformerly HELARCO ETC ) from scandinavia few of them i think, and of course B&P Galandi etc , and kindly ask them if they have any bio /steel non tox wads in the pipeline, i am sure we would be great full.

 If not i will contact them at a latter date off pc.

 

[wymberley]

3 minutes ago, lancer425 said:

I never take wagers which is a shame in a way because i an Quietly"i emphasise the word quietly " confident, the cartridge firms here and abroad will be coming up with loads and wads to comply with the voluntary lead/ plaswad ban.

I tend to post here straight off a phone i got brightness right down and outside glare off screen etc, i just about get by. But looking on other sites i just about manage ti youtube and link videos.   BUT "My point beinghere"  If anybody on thir family himac / Lap top, would be so kind as to email the likes of those scandi, wad makers ( sorry but can not remember their names nowformerly HELARCO ETC ) from scandinavia few of them i think, and of course B&P Galandi etc , and kindly ask them if they have any bio /steel non tox wads in the pipeline, i am sure we would be great full.

 If not i will contact them at a latter date off pc.

 

Yep, it is. With nothing had RB2 been correct, I was going to say that if you had taken the wager and had been proved right I would have stuffed £20 in the local RNLI kitty.

[lancer425]

3 minutes ago, wymberley said:

Yep, it is. With nothing had RB2 been correct, I was going to say that if you had taken the wager and had been proved right I would have stuffed £20 in the local RNLI kitty.

Tell you what, forget the wager, i will give you my word i will put £20 in the RNLI if you do. I am on it. its a awesome charity and i have not donated for at least two years. There is a box in the local, i might have a pint latter in the week. Thats that then, PS lets all put £20 in anyway. 

[lancer425]

56 minutes ago, grahamch said:

Sadly most duck shot inland on driven days etc. are still shot with lead by irresponsible estates who dont care. These then end up at dealers and are checked and found to contain lead shot so we all end up tarred with the same brush

Very true and i am of the opinion "rightly or wrongly may i add" that this had not helped the Keep lead case at all.

 AND! This is despite BASC doing a sterling job of fighting Leads corner against overwhelming odds at the time or around the time the lead in game shoot ducks came to light.

 Really not helpful at all.  I mean how irresponsible is that? what messages to non shooters could that send out i ask you.

 Here WE are "WILDFOWLERS"  in adverse conditions long range big genuinely tough birds exposed in high pattern effecting winds Knocking them down with steel etc NO problem.

  Yet! BACK at the ranch a bunch of law breakers are sat round a pond feeling they need break the law to be able to kill a few tame released ducks, Heck some of those game shoot ducks need literally rocketing off to get them on the wing never mind flying at any sort of challenging hight.

If your estate or syndicate has the beast Tame released ducks in western europe even digweed struggles on or not is irelivant. not interested. The thing is here. they BRoke the Law, and not just a few of them either. 

Im my opinion that was the worst type of betrayal. From within, and bassed around nothing more than " I will keep shooting lead"  No attempt to obey the rules of the land at all. At best a "oh lets try this oh i missed back to lead" That is about it, they simply did not care a hoot.

The lead inland in scotland clouded the waters a little too, good idea in principle, but fact is a get out of jail free card for a lot up there who do chose to carry lead and sneak the odd bird in here and there if they think they are on even a slight chance of claiming its not a land area.

NO! The scottish lead issue vis a moot point i acept that but relivant. But the Game shoot lead in ducks. ? Absolutely deplorable form. Disregarding the law. I genuinely believe it started them looking at lead in game more after that and we are where we are now.  So got that off my chest. Just saying!

[johnphilip]

13 hours ago, McSpredder said:

If you kill a bird using steel shot, it might already be carrying one or more lead pellets that have caused no obvious injury.  

Are there any metal detector experts on the forum?   Is there any reasonably priced equipment that can identify lead (whole pellets and/or smaller fragments) in a carcase?  

Yes you can get what is called a " Pin point probe "  Garrett  one is about the best , but around £100  . You could pick up a second hand , but be careful as there is some copies  about . It won't discriminate between ferrous  and none ferrous though .

[theshootist]

Just got an email from the BASC at last! 

[Teal]

15 minutes ago, theshootist said:

Just got an email from the BASC at last! 

You know the whole thing is a complete shambles. Presumably it wasn't an impulse decision to go with this statement out of the blue, so what on earth are all of the organisations thinking. Very strange.

[Smokersmith]

It's called a 'soft launch' ...

[grahamch]

15 minutes ago, Teal said:

You know the whole thing is a complete shambles. Presumably it wasn't an impulse decision to go with this statement out of the blue, so what on earth are all of the organisations thinking. Very strange.

Lucky you!!

[Stonepark]

Does the plastic in ITM/HW13/HW15 count as single use?

[Old farrier]

40 minutes ago, Teal said:

You know the whole thing is a complete shambles. Presumably it wasn't an impulse decision to go with this statement out of the blue, so what on earth are all of the organisations thinking. Very strange.

There’s a full (I’m assured) explanation in the next Basc magazine that’s just back from the printers 

got my email today 3 o’clock 

[Teal]

I hope your source is right OF, but I've got to be honest for 2020 that's fairly backwards if it is the case. If they wanted to communicate it could be done in a instant, with a few taps on a keyboard. So, I hope what is printed is not just be a rehash of what is already out there. 

I'm waiting to see what extra information is given. There were 9 organisations on the statement, they can't all be waiting on the Voice of Shooting magazine to be printed before the big reveal can they? I mean that might have worked for Paul Daniels... but when the average shooter gets treated like a mushroom it's not great!!

[wymberley]

50 minutes ago, Smokersmith said:

It's called a 'soft launch' ...

They often follow a hard lunch.