Rewulf Posted June 2, 2020 Report Share Posted June 2, 2020 1 minute ago, Raja Clavata said: Parse error in question. So youre dodging the question ? OK. 2 minutes ago, Raja Clavata said: I will not reply in kind. So, profitable for who - funeral directors in the region? I thought we were talking about American profit ? Whilst we can talk about the 'cost' of war , both in human and economic terms, my point is , the US has earned out of ME conflict, and will lose out of domestic conflict, on top of covid bashing it, and everyone elses economy. So the original analogy is a bit rubbish isnt it ? Destroying your own neighbourhood because a black man is injured or killed by the police, seems to be a favourite hobby in some areas. By that I am in no way saying that each death is not a tragedy in itself, but what about the multiple tragedies that come in its wake , as rage and revenge are taken out on innocents, often other black people ? Who will the blame get levelled at this time, the individual actions of 1 or 4 police officers, who may or may not be driven by racist ideologies ? The state police department as a whole for employing them ? Trump, cos we all know hes 'racist' dont we ? Or just the US as a whole, because thats whos paying for it now. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Raja Clavata Posted June 2, 2020 Report Share Posted June 2, 2020 1 minute ago, Rewulf said: So youre dodging the question ? OK. I am not dodging the question. This is what I call a Charles Babbage moment, meaning I don't understand how such a question even arises. I thought we were talking about American profit ? Whilst we can talk about the 'cost' of war , both in human and economic terms, my point is , the US has earned out of ME conflict, and will lose out of domestic conflict, on top of covid bashing it, and everyone elses economy. So the original analogy is a bit rubbish isnt it ? Destroying your own neighbourhood because a black man is injured or killed by the police, seems to be a favourite hobby in some areas. By that I am in no way saying that each death is not a tragedy in itself, but what about the multiple tragedies that come in its wake , as rage and revenge are taken out on innocents, often other black people ? Who will the blame get levelled at this time, the individual actions of 1 or 4 police officers, who may or may not be driven by racist ideologies ? The state police department as a whole for employing them ? Trump, cos we all know hes 'racist' dont we ? Or just the US as a whole, because thats whos paying for it now. I wasn't aware we were talking about profit but I don't see where profit in real terms comes from in war. Imagine just how great America could be if they'd spent the money used leveling the Middle East in building up their own country. I've driven through parts of the Mid-West in the relatively recent past and have seen the decimation caused by industry closing down and production being moved to the Far East. There are some glimpses of hope but on the whole it's a pretty depressing and sorry state of affairs. And no, I don't think the original analogy was rubbish at all, but it does seem to have got you going off on a bit of a tangent? I am aligned with the majority of the views you have expressed on this subject. My own belief is that the moment a person becomes a looter they should forego their normal basic rights in just the same way that a person wielding a knife on London Bridge, a nail bomb in Manchester or a suicide vest in a packed market in Kabul should. The purpose of the tweets I shared was not to justify the burning of America with what America has done in the Middle East, I would like to think that was obvious. I have spent enough time in Africa, both for leisure and business, as well as other parts of the world where the privilege afforded to me by my skin colour is abundantly clear to me at every step. I can "stand" with people in the face of injustice regardless of their skin colour, religion or any other distinguishing characteristic. And I know enough highly educated and thoroughly decent Black people who have shown me that regardless of my empathy with the challenges they face, I will never fully understand, quite simply because I am not one of them. Anyway, I've digressed nearly as far as you did. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
clangerman Posted June 2, 2020 Report Share Posted June 2, 2020 5 hours ago, Rewulf said: Of course they dont, and those cops will get whatever is coming to them, using the JUSTICE system. But lets not let common sense and legalities get in the way of a good virtue signal, and a steady descent into rage and anarchy, its not like theres a disease thats killed 100.000 Americans out there is it? the JUSTICE system that lets this happen time and time again how many people have to die before it’s made clear shooting unarmed suspects in the back is unacceptable kneeling on suspects throats is unacceptable and nobody deserves to DIE because some clowns think a badge makes them untouchable Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scully Posted June 2, 2020 Report Share Posted June 2, 2020 16 minutes ago, clangerman said: the JUSTICE system that lets this happen time and time again how many people have to die before it’s made clear shooting unarmed suspects in the back is unacceptable kneeling on suspects throats is unacceptable and nobody deserves to DIE because some clowns think a badge makes them untouchable The justice system doesn’t ‘let it happen’, it just happens. The justice system, governments, legislation, morals etc etc cannot cater for the acts of individuals. If it could then the bloke in question wouldn’t be a career criminal and as a result may be alive today. I have absolutely no sympathy for either of them, nor do I care what colour they were. As a result I’ve been busy posting all over social media in response to all the virtue signalling of ‘blackout ( oh the irony ) Tuesday’. If the bloke hadn’t been in the process of committing a crime ( no matter how trivial in comparison to his other crimes ) and high on drugs ( yet another criminal activity ) then he probably wouldn’t have put himself in the position of being pinned to the floor by another bloke who couldn’t give a stuff about his welfare. I can’t say he deserved to die, but the consequences of a criminal life are many and varied, and not many end well, thankfully, no matter what colour your skin. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TIGHTCHOKE Posted June 2, 2020 Report Share Posted June 2, 2020 Amen to that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
clangerman Posted June 2, 2020 Report Share Posted June 2, 2020 17 minutes ago, Scully said: The justice system doesn’t ‘let it happen’, it just happens. The justice system, governments, legislation, morals etc etc cannot cater for the acts of individuals. If it could then the bloke in question wouldn’t be a career criminal and as a result may be alive today. I have absolutely no sympathy for either of them, nor do I care what colour they were. As a result I’ve been busy posting all over social media in response to all the virtue signalling of ‘blackout ( oh the irony ) Tuesday’. If the bloke hadn’t been in the process of committing a crime ( no matter how trivial in comparison to his other crimes ) and high on drugs ( yet another criminal activity ) then he probably wouldn’t have put himself in the position of being pinned to the floor by another bloke who couldn’t give a stuff about his welfare. I can’t say he deserved to die, but the consequences of a criminal life are many and varied, and not many end well, thankfully, no matter what colour your skin. i’m surprised your one of the few people who don’t seem afraid to admit the truth this is solely the fault of the justice system because it allows it to happen let’s hope nobody chokes you to death if your ever a suspect always the same old story with this sort of thing first cry is looters second cry is rioters then we have pulling the rap sheet he’s a criminal ploy anything but admit the man was murdered Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scully Posted June 2, 2020 Report Share Posted June 2, 2020 9 minutes ago, clangerman said: i’m surprised your one of the few people who don’t seem afraid to admit the truth this is solely the fault of the justice system because it allows it to happen let’s hope nobody chokes you to death if your ever a suspect always the same old story with this sort of thing first cry is looters second cry is rioters then we have pulling the rap sheet he’s a criminal ploy anything but admit the man was murdered You don’t half post some tripe! Go on then, tell me how ‘the justice system allows this to happen‘. And then when you’ve done that perhaps you could explain how the justice system is supposed to prevent it. I’m all ears. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Newbie to this Posted June 2, 2020 Report Share Posted June 2, 2020 14 minutes ago, clangerman said: i’m surprised your one of the few people who don’t seem afraid to admit the truth this is solely the fault of the justice system because it allows it to happen let’s hope nobody chokes you to death if your ever a suspect always the same old story with this sort of thing first cry is looters second cry is rioters then we have pulling the rap sheet he’s a criminal ploy anything but admit the man was murdered I'd dare to say nobody gets choked to death if they cooperate. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
clangerman Posted June 2, 2020 Report Share Posted June 2, 2020 Just now, Scully said: You don’t half post some tripe! Go on then, tell me how ‘the justice system allows this to happen‘. And then when you’ve done that perhaps you could explain how the justice system is supposed to prevent it. I’m all ears. by clamping down on it a local landlord was arrested for murder turned out the neighbour killed her what if the landlord kicked up when arrested and died from his neck being knelt on sorry would not bring him back it needs to be made clear excessive force is unacceptable in making arrests and the justice system will also rail road the officer in this he’s got no chance of a fair trail but at least he’s not dead Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AVB Posted June 2, 2020 Report Share Posted June 2, 2020 I can’t believe what I am reading on other social media channels. People I know who I thought were sane, reasonable blokes have now starting ‘wringing their hands’ over this. Next there will be mass wailing like you get at Middle Eastern funerals. It’s pathetic. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bluesj Posted June 2, 2020 Report Share Posted June 2, 2020 (edited) I don't know what happened I wasn't there but my guess is no one is blameless and I can imagine what may have gone on and how this all happened. But I can't think of any reason why the police would start shooting (ok just paint balls) at people standing in the doorway of their own home watching the police march down the road! https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Qq3j1Sp4O48 Edited June 2, 2020 by bluesj Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
clangerman Posted June 2, 2020 Report Share Posted June 2, 2020 9 minutes ago, bluesj said: I don't know what happened I wasn't there but my guess is no one is blameless and I can imagine what may have gone on and how this all happened. But I can't think of any reason why the police would start shooting (ok just paint balls) at people standing in the doorway of their own home watching the police march down the road! https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Qq3j1Sp4O48 tells you everything you need to know (light them up bang bang bang!) sickening abuse of both position and power no wonder we have riots when your under fire for standing on your own porch Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scully Posted June 2, 2020 Report Share Posted June 2, 2020 24 minutes ago, clangerman said: by clamping down on it a local landlord was arrested for murder turned out the neighbour killed her what if the landlord kicked up when arrested and died from his neck being knelt on sorry would not bring him back it needs to be made clear excessive force is unacceptable in making arrests and the justice system will also rail road the officer in this he’s got no chance of a fair trail but at least he’s not dead By ‘clamping down’ on what? Excessive force? Isn’t it already illegal to the extent that if it’s alleged someone ( in this case a copper ) has used excessive force they will face prosecution? Isn’t this exactly what is happening? Isn’t the copper in question going to face prosecution? There isn’t a law in existence which can cater for the actions of anyone who doesn’t want to abide by it or acts outside it, because like I said, if all it took was legislation then there wouldn’t be any crime. Did your local landlord kick off? Was his neck knelt on? Perhaps the fact he knew he wasn’t guilty of anything was the reason he didn’t kick off, and as a result didn’t have his neck knelt on? Spot the difference? 14 minutes ago, bluesj said: I don't know what happened I wasn't there but my guess is no one is blameless and I can imagine what may have gone on and how this all happened. But I can't think of any reason why the police would start shooting (ok just paint balls) at people standing in the doorway of their own home watching the police march down the road! I get the impression that paranoia rules in America , and over reaction to any given situation seems to often be the default setting. Did you see the riot cop charge the news cameraman? 😂 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bluesj Posted June 2, 2020 Report Share Posted June 2, 2020 6 minutes ago, Scully said: I get the impression that paranoia rules in America , and over reaction to any given situation seems to often be the default setting. Did you see the riot cop charge the news cameraman? 😂 Think you may be on to something there 👍 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
clangerman Posted June 2, 2020 Report Share Posted June 2, 2020 10 minutes ago, Scully said: By ‘clamping down’ on what? Excessive force? Isn’t it already illegal to the extent that if it’s alleged someone ( in this case a copper ) has used excessive force they will face prosecution? Isn’t this exactly what is happening? Isn’t the copper in question going to face prosecution? There isn’t a law in existence which can cater for the actions of anyone who doesn’t want to abide by it or acts outside it, because like I said, if all it took was legislation then there wouldn’t be any crime. Did your local landlord kick off? Was his neck knelt on? Perhaps the fact he knew he wasn’t guilty of anything was the reason he didn’t kick off, and as a result didn’t have his neck knelt on? Spot the difference? I get the impression that paranoia rules in America , and over reaction to any given situation seems to often be the default setting. Did you see the riot cop charge the news cameraman? 😂 but what if he did kick of there is no come back from dead no missed it i was to busy watching the cop smash the woman reporter across the back of her head with a baton to catch that one hope the reporter pepper sprayed in his face for complying is ok clearly the police are now out to enflame the situation Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
old'un Posted June 2, 2020 Report Share Posted June 2, 2020 28 minutes ago, Scully said: I get the impression that paranoia rules in America , and over reaction to any given situation seems to often be the default setting. Did you see the riot cop charge the news cameraman? 😂 The fact that most Americans own handguns and as a police officer you could be looking down the barrel of any one of those guns….perhaps that explains some of the paranoia and over reaction. I would imagine policing in the US is very different from the UK. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Newbie to this Posted June 2, 2020 Report Share Posted June 2, 2020 (edited) I was too busy watching a woman being beaten by 'protesters', for trying to stop them 'protesting' The likes of the above 'protesters' are the ones to blame for the reactions of force. Edited June 2, 2020 by Newbie to this Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rewulf Posted June 2, 2020 Report Share Posted June 2, 2020 1 minute ago, Newbie to this said: I was too busy watching the elderly woman being beaten by 'protesters', for trying to stop them 'protesting' The likes of the above 'protesters' are the ones to blame for the reactions of force. You mean those brave young masked men fighting back against white privilege and tyranny. How dare she interfere with their looting and burning? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scully Posted June 2, 2020 Report Share Posted June 2, 2020 18 minutes ago, clangerman said: but what if he did kick of there is no come back from dead no missed it i was to busy watching the cop smash the woman reporter across the back of her head with a baton to catch that one hope the reporter pepper sprayed in his face for complying is ok clearly the police are now out to enflame the situation But he didn’t kick off! Even if he did it doesn’t necessarily follow that he’d wind up dead! You can’t base an argument on ‘what ifs’ for crying out loud! It‘s ridiculous! Nor can you base legislation on ‘what ifs‘.....if they did you and I wouldn’t have guns! Think it through. Tell me, how do you clamp down on something which is already catered for by legislation? You made the statement, explain how you ‘clamp down’ on it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fuddster Posted June 2, 2020 Report Share Posted June 2, 2020 these aren't protesters.they have resorted to being thugs and down right rioters. they've had a week to air their grievance,get the media time across the networks-now go in hard and get them dispersed. f. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
islandgun Posted June 2, 2020 Report Share Posted June 2, 2020 After watching trump on the news declaring war on rioters, its clear this will be red rag to the bull for many..😒 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
clangerman Posted June 2, 2020 Report Share Posted June 2, 2020 6 minutes ago, Scully said: But he didn’t kick off! Even if he did it doesn’t necessarily follow that he’d wind up dead! You can’t base an argument on ‘what ifs’ for crying out loud! It‘s ridiculous! Nor can you base legislation on ‘what ifs‘.....if they did you and I wouldn’t have guns! Think it through. Tell me, how do you clamp down on something which is already catered for by legislation? You made the statement, explain how you ‘clamp down’ on it. easily dealt with how hard is it to order officers not to kneel on suspects throats or don’t they follow orders anymore but probably past it now they are smashing women reporters across the head on camera and opening fire on people with pepper for standing on their own porch Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Newbie to this Posted June 2, 2020 Report Share Posted June 2, 2020 (edited) From a different angle. How about setting occupied buildings alight and then trying to stop the police and fire brigade getting to the building.... these scumbag violent 'protesters' are 100% to blame for the reactions of force. Edited June 2, 2020 by Newbie to this Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ordnance Posted June 2, 2020 Report Share Posted June 2, 2020 (edited) It doesn't help when they have a idiot for president, getting the police to use tear gas to break up a peaceful demonstration so he can have a photo op. Edited June 2, 2020 by ordnance Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
clangerman Posted June 2, 2020 Report Share Posted June 2, 2020 1 minute ago, ordnance said: It doesn't help when they have a idiot for president, getting the police to use tear gas to break up a peaceful demonstration so he can have a photo op. thank you trump the dunce has made it ten times worse all he comes out with is threats even the church has condemned him for the photo stunt Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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