Air travel - so unrealistic

[The Heron]

What is so great about going abroad? Its hot and full of foreign people that's it give me the UK any time rain or not. 

[JohnfromUK]

7 minutes ago, The Heron said:

What is so great about going abroad? Its hot and full of foreign people that's it give me the UK any time rain or not. 

+1

[Vince Green]

Its not so much about the safety of travelling on the plane, from what i saw on the TV the bars and restaurants in the resorts weren't paying much attention to social distancing. The holiday makers they interviewed in the resorts were all pretty much saying they wouldn't or couldn't be self isolating when they got back. One person said they (the Govt) couldn't change the rules half way through his holiday. Another person said he had to back at work on Monday and that wasn't negotiable. 

[JohnfromUK]

12 minutes ago, Vince Green said:

Its not so much about the safety of travelling on the plane, from what i saw on the TV the bars and restaurants in the resorts weren't paying much attention to social distancing.

I guess it is up to everyone how much 'risk' they want to accept.  It is low for the young and healthy - but less so for the older and those in the heavy side etc.

13 minutes ago, Vince Green said:

all pretty much saying they wouldn't or couldn't be self isolating when they got back.

However - coming back and not following the rules is putting innocent other people at risk ........... and that isn't good.  I don't think there is any practical way it can be enforced though?

Edited July 27, 2020 by JohnfromUK

[bavarianbrit]

Refuse any contact at work for 2 week minimum with anyone who has had a holiday abroad could be a way forward. All of GB had a stay at home policy during WW2 and there was pretty well no way around it unless you wanted to get shot at. Why now is it so hard to get the threat risk?

[Dave-G]

24 minutes ago, bavarianbrit said:

Refuse any contact at work for 2 week minimum with anyone who has had a holiday abroad could be a way forward. All of GB had a stay at home policy during WW2 and there was pretty well no way around it unless you wanted to get shot at. Why now is it so hard to get the threat risk?

The general public are special exceptions these days, rules only apply to the old and home grown.

[das]

On 26/07/2020 at 11:16, AVB said:

I’ll be on a plane to Portugal as soon as it comes off the FCO ‘essential travel only’ list.
 

This virus is nowhere near as dangerous as it is made out to be if you are under 60 (probably 70) and in good health. 

Why stay in the UK when you don’t know if it is going to **** down with rain one day to the next. 

Good luck. Virus nowhere near as dangerous? It kills young and old alike if you get the infection.
Why stay in the UK? If you act like a **** you are more likely to catch a dose on a aircraft or terminal than a few days at Butlins.
Anyway, everyone to their own.

[oowee]

It's not just air travel that's a nonsense its the whole set up, system and process of virus management (or lack of it). Where is the world beating track and trace system? Open pubs before schools? Masks in a shop but not in a pub? Management lost the plot they never had. 

Edited July 27, 2020 by oowee

[Vince Green]

There is talk now of other countries being put back on the need to quarantine list. Travellers are being warned they travel at their own risk.

[TIGHTCHOKE]

3 minutes ago, Vince Green said:

There is talk now of other countries being put back on the need to quarantine list. Travellers are being warned they travel at their own risk.

Without the friendly hand to hold and always some body else's fault!

[JohnfromUK]

2 minutes ago, Vince Green said:

There is talk now of other countries being put back on the need to quarantine list. Travellers are being warned they travel at their own risk.

It was always the case that various travel restrictions would potentially be imposed if the rates of infection increased - and that would probably be applied on a 'by destination country' basis.  Travel has always been at the travellers risk - although FCO issues advice on 'risks' whether terrorism, unrest, or health related.  Take out insurance - or if you can't get insurance - the clear message is that the risk is too high!

[markm]

1 hour ago, oowee said:

It's not just air travel that's a nonsense its the whole set up, system and process of virus management (or lack of it). Where is the world beating track and trace system? Open pubs before schools? Masks in a shop but not in a pub? Management lost the plot they never had. 

You CHOOSE to go into a pub. Kids HAVE to attend school. 
 

I bet 99.9% of pubs in the UK this afternoon have more than adequate area to social distance. Schools, come sept will not and the attendance / contact will be pretty constant. 
 

Not an argumentative reply, just an observation. 
 

ps - schools never actually closed. 

[Scully]

2 hours ago, oowee said:

It's not just air travel that's a nonsense its the whole set up, system and process of virus management (or lack of it). Where is the world beating track and trace system? Open pubs before schools? Masks in a shop but not in a pub? Management lost the plot they never had. 

I'm not too sure about the practicalities of wearing a mask in a pub! Are you suggesting the masks have a hole for a straw to be inserted? 😀

[Dave-G]

Its going to be quite difficult eating or drinking while wearing a mask. :-)

[oowee]

1 minute ago, Scully said:

I'm not too sure about the practicalities of wearing a mask in a pub! Are you suggesting the masks have a hole for a straw to be inserted? 😀

 

[Gordon R]

Quote

Where is the world beating track and trace system? 

Doesn't exist on this planet.

[Cosmicblue]

48 minutes ago, Dave-G said:

Its going to be quite difficult eating or drinking while wearing a mask. 🙂

One will be fed via a tube in ITU...could be looked upon as practice?

[Vince Green]

8 hours ago, The Heron said:

What is so great about going abroad? Its hot and full of foreign people that's it give me the UK any time rain or not. 

I agree, vey few places have much appeal to me these days.

[Mice!]

39 minutes ago, Gordon R said:

Doesn't exist on this planet.

It does, just not being used in this country,  South Korea were all over it, Germany were on it early doors,  no idea what's being used here??

It can't be effective when half the people can't be contacted. 

1 hour ago, markm said:

You CHOOSE to go into a pub

I choose to not go the pub, I can't stop work colleagues going.

[JohnfromUK]

23 minutes ago, Mice! said:

It does, just not being used in this country,  South Korea were all over it, Germany were on it early doors,  no idea what's being used here??

It can't be effective when half the people can't be contacted.

The south Korea system would not be 'tolerated' here because it does effectively track everyone using;

• Credit and debit card transactions - they can show where someone has shopped or eaten, and how they have travelled across a transport network
• Phone location logs obtained from mobile operators giving a rough idea of which neighbourhood someone is in as they connect to different phone masts
• Details captured by South Korea's extensive network of surveillance cameras

It was apparently thought to be incompatible with our laws and also unlikely to be 'acceptable' due to being a very high degree of surveillance.  Bearing in mind some here consider having to wear a mask "severe invasion of civil liberties" - we have little chance of getting that past.  In south Korea there are cameras in most restaurants and coffee shops, and also on street corners and things like this to that are normally used to catch parking violations.  This information is used to track people who have been infected but also to trace their movements in the days before they tested positive so people who may have been in close contact with them can be alerted.  More details here https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/technology-52681464

Germany and other countries who rely (in part anyway) on app based track and trace have struggled to get more than a 20% uptake - which doesn't do the job needed.

Part of the troubles in the UK in following up contacts seem to be

1. People don't use it and don't wont give their contacts
2. Many of the 'hotspot' areas (Leicester, Blackburn, Hereford and Evesham farm pickers/packers camps) apparently have problems in that the track and trace phone service seems to struggle where people don't speak good English - hence getting information on contacts doesn't work.

 

 

[TIGHTCHOKE]

1 hour ago, Cosmicblue said:

One will be fed via a tube in ITU...could be looked upon as practice?

Marvellous response!

[grrclark]

1 hour ago, JohnfromUK said:

The south Korea system would not be 'tolerated' here because it does effectively track everyone using;

• Credit and debit card transactions - they can show where someone has shopped or eaten, and how they have travelled across a transport network
• Phone location logs obtained from mobile operators giving a rough idea of which neighbourhood someone is in as they connect to different phone masts
• Details captured by South Korea's extensive network of surveillance cameras

It was apparently thought to be incompatible with our laws and also unlikely to be 'acceptable' due to being a very high degree of surveillance.  Bearing in mind some here consider having to wear a mask "severe invasion of civil liberties" - we have little chance of getting that past.  In south Korea there are cameras in most restaurants and coffee shops, and also on street corners and things like this to that are normally used to catch parking violations.  This information is used to track people who have been infected but also to trace their movements in the days before they tested positive so people who may have been in close contact with them can be alerted.  More details here https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/technology-52681464

Germany and other countries who rely (in part anyway) on app based track and trace have struggled to get more than a 20% uptake - which doesn't do the job needed.

Part of the troubles in the UK in following up contacts seem to be

1. People don't use it and don't wont give their contacts
2. Many of the 'hotspot' areas (Leicester, Blackburn, Hereford and Evesham farm pickers/packers camps) apparently have problems in that the track and trace phone service seems to struggle where people don't speak good English - hence getting information on contacts doesn't work.

 

 

And long may we rebel against excessive state intrusion too.

[JohnfromUK]

1 minute ago, grrclark said:

And long may we rebel against excessive state intrusion too.

It is hard to see how what is for many an effective track and trace - is not "excessive state intrusion" for others.

[wascal]

4 hours ago, Dave-G said:

Its going to be quite difficult eating or drinking while wearing a mask. 🙂

not really I've done it loads of times

[billytheghillie]

11 hours ago, The Heron said:

What is so great about going abroad? Its hot and full of foreign people that's it give me the UK any time rain or not. 

yes your right, when i go its full of foreign people, The English!