Alec Baldwin Shooting on Film Set in USA.

[TIGHTCHOKE]

5 minutes ago, mossy835 said:

in the states they were saying,that the crew were out target shooting with the prop gun.and live rounds were mixed in with blank rounds.

If that is the case, that is a remarkably STUPID approach to gun safety!  

[mossy835]

but then it is in the usa,we know what they are like,

[harkom]

A tragedy for certain. This highlights the fact.....    that Anybody & Everybody ....   who takes up a firearm ... of whatever sort ... has basic understanding of that "weapon", how it operates, .... and ascertain that it is NOT armed with live ammunition.  Given that this is a tinseltown background where some sucker has to be "gunned down" , should not the user of the gun check it ... and first of all, and definitely not last of all, fire the gun at an inanimate object before firing at the sucker?

[Stuarta]

I remember an incident in Thames Valley Police HQ, Kidlington when a police firearms instructor was demonstrating different handguns to a class and he loaded a live round along with blanks and pointed the gun at a person. He shot them in the stomach, a live round was in an old biscuit tin along with the blank he used in his classes. Even our “experts” get it wrong?
Im sure you can find the incident on google.

[Rewulf]

14 hours ago, Stuarta said:

I remember an incident in Thames Valley Police HQ, Kidlington when a police firearms instructor was demonstrating different handguns to a class and he loaded a live round along with blanks and pointed the gun at a person. He shot them in the stomach, a live round was in an old biscuit tin along with the blank he used in his classes. Even our “experts” get it wrong?
Im sure you can find the incident on google.

A Notts police firearms officer was demonstrating 'gun safety' to a group of school kids , when he discharged his G36 into the wooden floor at police HQ.

https://www.theguardian.com/uk-news/2014/nov/06/girl-injured-gun-school-trip-firearm-nottinghamshire-sherwood-lodge-police-headquarters

[Newbie to this]

https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-535071/Gun-injuries-soar-police-experts-blast-colleagues-mistake.html

[chrisjpainter]

As the wise and noble Philosopher once said, this really was a right royal cluster ****! More details are starting to come out and none of it sounds even in the same continent as responsible. This from The Times today:

'Members of the film crew working on the set where a cinematographer was shot dead by the actor Alec Baldwin are reported to have been using the gun involved for live target practice.

Sources involved in the production of Rust, a western set in the 19th century, told the celebrity website TMZ that the gun was used for recreational purposes off set, with real ammunition that may have accidentally been left in the weapon when it was handed to Baldwin, 63, as he rehearsed a scene in New Mexico.'

Staggering levels of incompetence and stupidity. Full article for those who can access:
Rust shooting: Film crew ‘used Alec Baldwin’s gun for live target practice’ | News | The Times

Edited October 25, 2021 by chrisjpainter

[TIGHTCHOKE]

From the CNN website;

The shot that killed a cinematographer on a New Mexico film set last week was fired as actor Alec Baldwin was practicing drawing his gun, according to the director who was injured in the shooting, an affidavit for a search warrant shows.

Joel Souza, director of the film "Rust," was shot in the shoulder and director of photography Halyna Hutchins, 42, was killed when the prop gun went off during a rehearsal at the Bonanza Creek Ranch in Santa Fe on Thursday.

Souza spoke to investigators Friday, according to the affidavit released by the Santa Fe County Sheriff's Office on Sunday.
Souza told them Baldwin was "sitting in a pew in a church building setting, and he was practicing a cross draw," the affidavit said. A cross draw is when a shooter pulls the weapon from a holster on the opposite side of the body from the draw hand.
Souza was looking over Hutchins' shoulder "when he heard what sounded like a whip and then loud pop," according to the affidavit.
Souza recalled Hutchins "complaining about her stomach and grabbing her midsection" after the shot was fired, the document said.
Investigators also talked with camera operator Reid Russell, who was standing next to Souza and Hutchins at the time of the incident, the affidavit said.
Russell recalled Hutchins "saying she couldn't feel her legs" and medics treating her as she was bleeding on the floor, investigators said.
Both Souza and Russell acknowledged difficulties on set that day because of a walkout of some members of the camera department over payment and housing. Due to the labor problems, Souza said, they had only one camera available to use that day, and it was not recording at the time of the incident.
Souza also confirmed to an investigator that he heard the term "cold gun" on set, meaning the firearm should have been empty.
According to the warrant, Souza said three people had been handling the firearms for scenes -- they were checked by the armorer and first assistant director and then given to the actor using them.
The investigator said Souza was unaware of anyone on set being checked to see whether they had live ammunition on them before or after the scenes were filmed.
"The only thing checked are the firearms to avoid live ammunition being in them. Joel (Souza) stated there should never be live rounds whatsoever near or around the scene," the affidavit said.
Souza's representatives have not returned CNN's requests for comment.

According to the affidavit, Russell told investigators Baldwin was "trying to explain how he was going to draw out the firearm and where his arm would be at when the firearm was pulled from the holster."
Russell "was not sure why the firearm was discharged and just remembered the loud bang from the firearm," the affidavit says.
When asked how Baldwin handled the firearm, Russell told investigators the actor "had been very careful" and recalled an earlier instance when Baldwin "made sure it was safe and that a child wasn't near him when they were discharging a firearm during that scene."
The search warrant sought to recover any footage, video cameras, computer equipment and memory cards used by cameras on the set.
No charges have been filed. The Santa Fe County Sheriff's Office says it will discuss the case further in a news conference Wednesday.
Assistant director was subject of complaints
According to an earlier search warrant affidavit, the film's assistant director, David Halls, handed the prop gun to Baldwin before the shooting and yelled "cold gun."
Baldwin was handed one of three prop guns that were set up in a cart by an armorer for the movie and Halls did not know there were live rounds in the gun, the affidavit said.
Halls had been the subject of complaints over safety and his behavior on set during two productions in 2019, two people who worked closely with him told CNN.
Assistant director on 'Rust' was subject of complaints dating back to 2019
Assistant director on 'Rust' was subject of complaints dating back to 2019
The complaints against Halls include a disregard for safety protocols for weapons and pyrotechnics use, blocked fire lanes and exits, and instances of inappropriately sexual behavior in the workplace.
Maggie Goll, an IATSE Local 44 prop maker and licensed pyrotechnician, said in a statement to CNN that while working on Hulu's "Into the Dark" Anthology Series in February and May of 2019, Halls neglected to hold safety meetings and consistently failed to announce the presence of a firearm on set to the crew, as is protocol.
Halls did not respond to CNN's request for comment about Goll's allegations against him.
On the set of the film "Freedom's Path," also in 2019, Halls was serving as assistant director, when a gun "unexpectedly discharged" on set, causing a sound crew member to recoil from the blast and halting production, the production company Rocket Soul Studios told CNN on Monday.
The sound crew member was evacuated by an on-set medic and advised to seek medical treatment. The crew member returned to the production a few days later, Rocket Soul Studios said.
Following the incident, Halls was removed from the set and fired from the production, the company said.
"Dave was very remorseful for the events, and understood the reasons he was being terminated," Rocket Soul Studios said. "A new assistant director as well as a new armorer were hired for the duration of principal photography."
Halls could not be reached for comment on the incident.
Three crew members, who did not wish to be identified for fear of industry reprisal, said they were concerned for the safety of crew and cast members on set even before the incident.
One crew member said in the moments before the accidental discharge, the gun was announced as a "no fire" or "cold weapon" for the scene. A second crew member said they asked multiple times whether the gun was cleared for use in the shot and didn't receive a clear answer.
All three said the production did not hold regular safety meetings.
"He was a person with enough red flags that his career should have been done with already. Yet he was still out there putting crew into outrageous situations. It's tough to think that Halyna could have just as well been one of our crews," one of them said.
Gun safety on the set of 'Rust'
The armorer who prepared the prop gun used by Baldwin on Thursday was identified in the search warrant documents as Hannah Gutierrez. She had recently finished work on her first project as head armorer, she said in a September podcast interview.
"I was really nervous about it at first," Gutierrez said of working as head armorer on the set of the movie "The Old Way," starring Nicolas Cage.
"I almost didn't take the job because I wasn't sure if I was ready, but doing it, like it went really smoothly," she said in an interview on the "Voices of the West" podcast, which is dedicated to the Old West.
Her work as armorer ranges from teaching actors how to wear a gun belt to aiming and shooting, she said.
There were at least two accidental prop gun discharges on the set in the days before the fatal shooting, according to multiple news reports.
The discharges occurred on October 16, when crew members accidentally fired two rounds after being told the gun was "cold," the Los Angeles Times reported, citing two crew members who reportedly witnessed the incident. It was not known whether the discharges included live rounds. No one was injured in the accidental discharges, The Wall Street Journal reported.
The movie's producers said in a statement Friday they was not aware of prop safety issues before the fatal shooting.
"The safety of our cast and crew is the top priority of Rust Productions and everyone associated with the company. Though we were not made aware of any official complaints concerning weapon or prop safety on set, we will be conducting an internal review of our procedures while production is shut down. We will continue to cooperate with the Santa Fe authorities in their investigation and offer mental health services to the cast and crew during this tragic time," Rust Movie Productions LLC said.
CNN's Julia Jones, Gregory Lemos, Mayumi Maruyama, Karen Smith and Lucy Kafanov contributed to this report.

Edited October 26, 2021 by TIGHTCHOKE
SYNTAX!

[chrisjpainter]

It's all getting ludicrous, isn't it? The blame game war of words being fought in the media's hotting up. It turns out Dave Halls, the AD, had been sacked on a previous venture - for gun safety violations!
Rust: Assistant director had been sacked before over gun safety - BBC News

If a young woman hadn't lost her life, it'd be like something out of Coen Bros movie. A bad mix of tragic and idiotic

Edited October 26, 2021 by chrisjpainter

[ditchman]

Moral of the story.......

dont let any arty luvies who live in the pretend world...anywhere near real world objects......

[WalkedUp]

 

[chrisjpainter]

Aaaand we're back to this again. The armourer's lawyer has suggested it could have been sabotage.

He also said that Hannah Gutierrez handed the weapon to the AD and had spun the chamber to show there were only dummy bullets in the gun. Somewhat different to Halls 'grabbing the gun' from a table. Apparently,

'Gutierrez took her job seriously, had given Baldwin and other actors on the film firearms training, and “did everything in her power to ensure a safe set” '

Apart from the litany of errors that have already come to light, obviously...

Sabotage could be behind tragedy on Baldwin film set: Lawyer | Entertainment News | Al Jazeera

[ehb102]

My money is on the director being the kind of person who thinks rules don't apply to him. 

[amateur]

2 hours ago, ehb102 said:

My money is on the director being the kind of person who thinks rules don't apply to him. 

Don't most directors, and not just of the film persuasion, seem to think that.

[TIGHTCHOKE]

Alec Baldwin latest;

 

He knows someone was responsible, but he can't say who that person is.

But he knows it was not him.

 

Unbelievable!

[Newbie to this]

42 minutes ago, TIGHTCHOKE said:

Alec Baldwin latest;

 

He knows someone was responsible, but he can't say who that person is.

But he knows it was not him.

 

Unbelievable!

You forgot, "I didn't pull the trigger"

[TIGHTCHOKE]

Oh I missed that one. Was extremely busy at work when that surfaced!

From CNN;

Alec Baldwin told ABC News he never pulled the trigger of the gun that shot director of photography Halyna Hutchins on the set of "Rust."

"The trigger wasn't pulled. I didn't pull the trigger," Baldwin said in an excerpt released Wednesday from the sit-down interview -- his first since the October shooting.
When asked why he pointed the gun at Hutchins and pulled the trigger when that wasn't in the script, Baldwin said, "I would never point a gun at anyone and then pull the trigger, never."
Baldwin also said he has no idea how a live bullet got in the Colt .45 revolver he used in the scene. "Someone put a live bullet in the gun, a bullet that wasn't even supposed to be on the property," he said.
An emotional Baldwin visibly fights back tears when talking about Hutchins.
"She was someone who was loved by everyone who worked with her, liked by everyone who worked with her -- and admired," Baldwin said, adding, "it doesn't seem real to me."
When asked by George Stephanopoulos if the shooting was the worst thing that had ever happened to him, Baldwin said yes, "because I think back and I think, what could I have done?"
ABC is set to air the interview Thursday night.
Hutchins was killed and director Joel Souza injured in October after Baldwin discharged a weapon during a rehearsal that contained what authorities suspect was a live round.
The incident, which remains under investigation, has renewed calls for better safety practices on sets with regards to the use of weapons.
Baldwin has said he believes police officers should be present on "every film/TV set that uses guns, fake or otherwise" to monitor weapons safety.

[Rim Fire]

On SKY news this morning Baldwin says he didn't pull the Triger he was  dropping the hammer with his thumb 

[JohnfromUK]

In an interview (R4 Today, this morning) he said he drew the hammer back rehearsing a scene and asked (the director?) if that was OK?  On being told yes, he released the hammer - and 'bang' the gun went off.

It was a Colt 45, but I don't know enough to comment on whether this 'can happen', or should be prevented in some 'mechanical was such as half cock sear, or safety sear etc.  On a rather basic item, I suspect there aren't any such fitted.

How the gun came to be pointing in the direction of any person can ONLY be the holder's responsibility.

[JohnfromUK]

3 minutes ago, JohnfromUK said:

In an interview (R4 Today, this morning) he said he drew the hammer back rehearsing a scene and asked (the director?) if that was OK?  On being told yes, he released the hammer - and 'bang' the gun went off.

It was a Colt 45, but I don't know enough to comment on whether this 'can happen', or should be prevented in some 'mechanical was such as half cock sear, or safety sear etc.  On a rather basic item, I suspect there aren't any such fitted.

How the gun came to be pointing in the direction of any person can ONLY be the holder's responsibility.

Post crossed with Rim Fire's above - apologies.

Key questions (for me) are;

1. Why was the gun loaded?
2. Why had he taken it/received it from someone without personally ensuring himself of its loaded/unloaded status?
3. Why was it pointed at someone?

This last point might have been required by the script - but surely than (a) it would have been another actor - not a member of the crew, and IF that was required, the gun should have been independently verified as empty and safe (as a coach would when looking at gun fit for example).

[Stonepark]

Single action Colt Army\Peacemaker revolvers cannot fire under half cock as they rest on the last fired or empty chamber, on hammer pull back past half cock and indexing the cylinder they then require the trigger pulled to allow the hammer to strike the firing pin.

 

 

Edited December 3, 2021 by Stonepark

[udderlyoffroad]

Good post @Stonepark

Why is this (alleged) piece of work even at liberty and not in jail* much less giving interviews?

One suspects his lawyer and his publicist are having frank discussions.

*I’m using the US term here, which means where you go awaiting trial, prison is where you go once found guilty. What we would call on remand in the UK.

[chrisjpainter]

1 hour ago, Stonepark said:

Single action Colt Army\Peacemaker revolvers cannot fire under half cock as they rest on the last fired or empty chamber, on hammer pull back past half cock and indexing the cylinder they then require the trigger pulled to allow the hammer to strike the firing pin.

 

 

This seems at odds with the testimonies that there had already been incidents of the gun going off without the trigger being pulled earlier on in filming. 

I guess we'll have to wait and see - if that's even provable. Baldwin might be relying on precedent having been set with the gun firing without the trigger being pulled to at least muddy the waters with blame, or he may genuinely have not pulled it and there's a fault with the gun or ammunition. 

Given how poor the safety record and behaviour of the gun team and crew had been on this film set, anything's possible. It sounds like a right cowboy enterprise...only appropriate when filming a Western, I guess!

[ShootingEgg]

2 hours ago, JohnfromUK said:

Key questions (for me) are;

1. Why was the gun loaded?
2. Why had he taken it/received it from someone without personally ensuring himself of its loaded/unloaded status?
3. Why was it pointed at someone

There really is only one question to be asked.. why was there a live firing REAL handgun on set.

All should have been prop guns that at most would be blank firing.

At no point should a live firearm be on set.

3 hours ago, Rim Fire said:

On SKY news this morning Baldwin says he didn't pull the Triger he was  dropping the hammer with his thumb 

Which mimics the trigger being pulled, slip and release fast you get a bang. 

[JohnfromUK]

7 minutes ago, ShootingEgg said:

At no point should a live firearm be on set.

I don't disagree, but it does seem 'normal practice' as 'they' (the crew?) had been using guns from the armourer for recreational target practice according to early reports.

https://www.lbc.co.uk/news/halyna-hutchins-gun-rust-set-fatal-shooting-target-practice/

https://nypost.com/2021/10/26/rust-crew-used-alec-baldwins-prop-gun-for-plinking/