So, I had another complaint about shooting today.

[Shadowchaser]

This follows on from a single complaint I received in March 2019 (which I did start a topic on). 

Myself and three friends had a clay shoot on my land this morning, it's a single trap setup. 

About half an hour into the shoot my phone rings and it's the police. The operator simply asked me if it was a clay shoot and I said yes. I asked him if the person who called them was complaining or concerned about someone shooting. He said it was a complaint and that it was the same person who called in 2019. He wouldn't tell me who it was. I asked him if he would be getting back in touch with the person and he said yes and everything's above board. 

From the sound of his tone I think he thought it was a nonsense complaint, which of course it is. 

After the shoot I decided to phone my two neighbours whose properties lie in line with where we were first shooting towards. I asked them very nicely if it was they who called the police. Both of them said no. But one or two things nagged me. 

Neighbour A who is closer said that they don't mind me having a clay shoot but went on to say that I have one nearly every week. I was taken aback by this as it's usually about ten times a year or less, spread out. (This was my second one of 2022). I did correct them on this point. Neighbour A told me that neighbour B phoned them this morning to talk about the shooting.  

Neighbour B also denied calling the police but said that the noise of the shooting scared them and they told me it was unacceptable on a Sunday morning. They also said that last year during one of my shoots they were walking their dog in a nearby wood when a man asked them about the shooting. They told him who it was/where it was coming from and he said he was going to complain about it. 

I told neighbour B that I would refrain from shooting in their direction from now on. There were also a number of walkers out and about further down the valley this morning. I noticed them stop for a while when we commenced shooting. The trouble is there is a new housing estate nearby and this has increased footfall into the area. 

I don't think Neighbour A complained but have reservations about Neighbour B. 

One final thing that annoys me, is why call the police? The complainer knows what's going on and who is shooting. Are the expecting the police to shut the shoot down, or is it just to cause me aggro? I'd have thought that it's not really a police matter as such, more of a civil/council matter.  

[Scully]

I’m not really sure they can do anything to prevent you shooting if it’s on a non commercial footing. 
We do this too, not as regular as you admittedly, but that may change as the weather improves and especially when the schools break up. Again admittedly we are very rural, but we shoot less than a mile away from the village, and so far we’ve had no complaints. 

Annoying as it is to receive complaints via the police, if the police aren’t bothered then I’d just crack on. 

[ninjaferret]

Be careful. When it comes to renewal time it will be logged.

[Shadowchaser]

Thanks Scully. 

The thing that annoys me the most is I'd much rather the complainer called me or came to see me. I'm happy to work with neighbours and maintain the peace. I've no problem for example shooting away from the properties I mentioned if the noise is bothering them. But if it was bothering them I'd prefer them to just tell me. 

ninjaferret - I renewed in 2020 no problem and this was a year after the first complaint. 

[oowee]

I am sure it's all above board and no issue but, I would not want to fall out with my neighbors.

[Shadowchaser]

3 minutes ago, oowee said:

I am sure it's all above board and no issue but, I would not want to fall out with my neighbors.

Could you elaborate on that last point please? 

[oowee]

3 minutes ago, Shadowchaser said:

Could you elaborate on that last point please? 

Simply what I said. You will appreciate that sometimes people will be reluctant to say what they really feel. I would not be happy having a clay shoot spoiling my early morning peace and quiet. If on the other hand a neighbor dropped by to say they were planning a shoot and would i mind?  Then there would be no problem. 

[Shadowchaser]

1 minute ago, oowee said:

Simply what I said. You will appreciate that sometimes people will be reluctant to say what they really feel. I would not be happy having a clay shoot spoiling my early morning peace and quiet. If on the other hand a neighbor dropped by to say they were planning a shoot and would i mind?  Then there would be no problem. 

This is where things get tricky. I'm not going to go around to all of my neighbours to inform them I'm having a shoot. It would set a dangerous precedent. 

[Yellow Bear]

3 minutes ago, oowee said:

Simply what I said. You will appreciate that sometimes people will be reluctant to say what they really feel. I would not be happy having a clay shoot spoiling my early morning peace and quiet. If on the other hand a neighbor dropped by to say they were planning a shoot and would i mind?  Then there would be no problem. 

Or they may simply belong to the "I don't agree with it so it should be banned" brigade but know they are on a sticky wicket.

[holloway]

If it was me I would tell both of the neighbours when I am going to hold my shoots out of courtesy to them, then if the police contact me I can tell them that the complainant had been informed what is going on and they can treat it as a  nuisance call.

12 minutes ago, Shadowchaser said:

This is where things get tricky. I'm not going to go around to all of my neighbours to inform them I'm having a shoot. It would set a dangerous precedent. 

Why would it be a dangerous precedent?

[CaptC]

Perhaps send both the neighbours a letter giving the proposed dates of your shooting to include times and duration. Explain the legality of your clay shoot and that you are fully insured etc etc 

[Ultrastu]

Why not invite neighbours  a +b to your next shoot  let them know when it is and what to expect .let them have a few shots if they want to .

Get them on board . If they politely decline then thats fine they will certainly  see you and your activities  in a bit better light and be less inclined to complain. Make friends  not enemies  where you can .

[CaptC]

6 minutes ago, Ultrastu said:

Why not invite neighbours  a +b to your next shoot  let them know when it is and what to expect .let them have a few shots if they want to .

Get them on board . If they politely decline then thats fine they will certainly  see you and your activities  in a bit better light and be less inclined to complain. Make friends  not enemies  where you can .

👍

[ninjaferret]

1 hour ago, Shadowchaser said:

Thanks Scully. 

The thing that annoys me the most is I'd much rather the complainer called me or came to see me. I'm happy to work with neighbours and maintain the peace. I've no problem for example shooting away from the properties I mentioned if the noise is bothering them. But if it was bothering them I'd prefer them to just tell me. 

ninjaferret - I renewed in 2020 no problem and this was a year after the first complaint. 

Well don't say i didn't tell you.

[Old farrier]

32 minutes ago, Ultrastu said:

Why not invite neighbours  a +b to your next shoot  let them know when it is and what to expect .let them have a few shots if they want to .

Get them on board . If they politely decline then thats fine they will certainly  see you and your activities  in a bit better light and be less inclined to complain. Make friends  not enemies  where you can .

This 

id go round and invite them to come and have a go 

this also let’s them know it’s happening 

what would it cost if they did a few clays and a box of cartridges 

set up some easy stuff for them and the kids if they have some 

there’s a good chance they will say no but you’re the better person for inviting them 

[clangerman]

knowing your the one shooting logical step is contact yourself yet B rings A think I would let B know anymore complaints you will start dusting a few daily! 

[Shadowchaser]

34 minutes ago, clangerman said:

knowing your the one shooting logical step is contact yourself yet B rings A think I would let B know anymore complaints you will start dusting a few daily! 

This is one of the things that annoyed me. Why ring another neighbour and not me? 

1 hour ago, holloway said:

If it was me I would tell both of the neighbours when I am going to hold my shoots out of courtesy to them, then if the police contact me I can tell them that the complainant had been informed what is going on and they can treat it as a  nuisance call.

Why would it be a dangerous precedent?

I just feel it would be.  I want to be able to go about my hobby (which I practice a handful of times of year here) without having to inform others.  Do I need to start sending letters to my other neighbours or to anyone within earshot of the shooting location? Where does it end?

I'm also not sure if either of them were the complainant. They both said it wasn't them.  

[Scully]

I wouldn’t inform either. There is no obligation to do so and you’re doing nothing wrong. 
Would they inform you if they were going to have a razz about on their trail bike, cut their lawn or fire up the chainsaw or strimmer? Of course they wouldn’t, there is no need. 
It’s funny how some folk will tolerate most noises, because they use those tools too, but gunfire is special. 🙂

Like you say, once you’ve done it you’ve set a precedent. 

[AULD YIN]

17 minutes ago, Scully said:

I wouldn’t inform either. There is no obligation to do so and you’re doing nothing wrong. 
Would they inform you if they were going to have a razz about on their trail bike, cut their lawn or fire up the chainsaw or strimmer? Of course they wouldn’t, there is no need. 
It’s funny how some folk will tolerate most noises, because they use those tools too, but gunfire is special. 🙂

Like you say, once you’ve done it you’ve set a precedent. 

Exactly my thoughts

[bruno22rf]

Honestly, move your trap closer to neighbour number 2, explain that if he didn't complain then it must be somebody the other side of your land and, knowing that he is not the complaining type, you know he wont mind.

[jall25]

4 hours ago, Shadowchaser said:

This is where things get tricky. I'm not going to go around to all of my neighbours to inform them I'm having a shoot. It would set a dangerous precedent. 

I think this is exactly what i would do

 

I think if people know about things they are less likely to create a fuss

When im out shooting foxes i always advise the neighbours 

[Houseplant]

It's a difficult situation even if you have done nothing wrong, which you haven't. Would subsonic loads be an option?

As a point of interest and nothing more as obviously not relevant to you, in New Zealand, if firearm usage endangers, annoys, or frightens any person, it is an offence. Luckily, most rural people are sensible and it's not an issue. However, as the suburbs sprawl in to rural areas and city dwellers decide to pursue the country living dream, things are changing fast. I've stopped rabbit shooting in a couple of locations for this reason.

[rbrowning2]

Just remember if you clay shoot more than I think 12 days a year or 24 half days? Then you will need planning permission as it is change of use of the land, that and the noise could result in a complaint to the council rather than the police. Plenty of clubs and commercial grounds have had issue with noise in the past.

can you not shoot on a Saturday instead if they don’t like the noise on a Sunday?

For advice may be speak to the CPSA.

 

[WalkedUp]

https://www.legislation.gov.uk/uksi/2015/596/schedule/2/part/4/crossheading/class-b-temporary-use-of-land/made

https://www.cieh.org/media/1236/clay-target-shooting-guidance-on-the-control-of-noise.pdf

It appears that clay pigeon shooting was added to the minuscule list of prohibited activities between the 1995 GDPO and the 2015 GDPO if it is in SSI. 

https://www.planningresource.co.uk/article/730945/clay-pigeon-trap-objection-overruled

Certainly past 2007. 

Edited April 11, 2022 by WalkedUp

[WalkedUp]

This one is interesting; just before the 2015 GDPO. The author will know the answer to the question relative to current legislation, I know enough to know that I do not. 

https://shoothub.gunsonpegs.com/articles/shoot-owners/shooting-noise-neighbours

Whilst it is only tangentially linked to clay shooting, focusing on game instead, the non planning aspects of Environmental Health should be interesting to consider.