UK REACH – Restriction Proposals 004 - Lead shot in ammunition

[chesterse]

This is interesting:-

 

 

5a-Larsen.pdf

[8 shot]

Excellent post. It does make you wonder. It's not that long ago either.

[Smokersmith]

1 hour ago, 8 shot said:

I will be joining the CPSA in September when my BASC membership dies of self inflicted injuries, I did speak to a NGO rep and i had to put the phone down on him, his views were anti tradition, almost anti shooting. The buy back/ compensation thing will be very interesting, lets see how that pans out. 

The CPSA haven’t been visible in fighting this at all … interesting choice!

[Scully]

9 minutes ago, Smokersmith said:

The CPSA haven’t been visible in fighting this at all … interesting choice!

My thoughts too! 🤔

 

[222mark]

On 06/05/2022 at 19:14, mossy835 said:

glad i left BASC.

I left BASC 20 odd years ago for exactly the same reason . Lead shot ban on duck. Pity every one else wasn't in the same opinion or didn't listen. Things may be much different now.

[Stonepark]

As part of any response we need to be clear the various shooting organisations are not truly representing their membership.

 

Given we have 6 months response time, time for an emergency AGM at the organisations?

 

[enfieldspares]

There are to my knowledge still commercial bullet casting businesses in the UK such as the excellent G M Bullets. For pistol calibre cartridges loaded with lead bullets are used in Winchester. Rossi, Marlin lever action carbines. I don't know of any non-lead (that is ALL non-lead) flat point factory loaded rounds in .38 or .44 or .45 and of no bullets sold separately that are all non-lead that have that flat point needed in carbines with tubular magazines.

 

Edited May 8, 2022 by enfieldspares

[Sweet11-87]

the knee jerk  "blame BASC" is easy to jump to when frustrated and were all a bit guilty of it but its not very constructive.

This isnt basc, this is another EU proposal that we didnt manage to outrun with brexit.  we were given the heads up that this proposal was coming down the line when we voted out and then again just after we got out. Same as the ban on lead for meat heading to the food chain. its resourse managment, realistic goals and planning.

The more people leave basc the less effective they will become. and as far as i can see every other representing body have completly gone dark on the subject.  I dont see an alternative.  If basc were just blanket refusing to negotionate on the subjects people bash basc about for meeting half way like the  5 year volentary transition, we would probably see very short term wins for shooters and very catastrophic long term loses.

its a tough gig as bad news and pressure is all coming thick and fast for shooters atm but if we pull ourselves to bits were doomed.

[PeterHenry]

20 minutes ago, Sweet11-87 said:

the knee jerk  "blame BASC" is easy to jump to when frustrated and were all a bit guilty of it but its not very constructive.

This isnt basc, this is another EU proposal that we didnt manage to outrun with brexit.  we were given the heads up that this proposal was coming down the line when we voted out and then again just after we got out. Same as the ban on lead for meat heading to the food chain. its resourse managment, realistic goals and planning.

The more people leave basc the less effective they will become. and as far as i can see every other representing body have completly gone dark on the subject.  I dont see an alternative.  If basc were just blanket refusing to negotionate on the subjects people bash basc about for meeting half way like the  5 year volentary transition, we would probably see very short term wins for shooters and very catastrophic long term loses.

its a tough gig as bad news and pressure is all coming thick and fast for shooters atm but if we pull ourselves to bits were doomed.

👍

[Vince Green]

On 06/05/2022 at 17:57, enfieldspares said:

As I have said here and/or elsewhere there must be no derogation for "licensed athletes" (that is Commonwealth and Olympic Games shooters) the ban if it is to come must be for everybody. For else wise those who could and would make a difference (that is Commonwealth and Olympic Games shooters) will have not interest in fighting a ban. Just as they had no interest in 1996 in fighting the Tory fullbore pistol and subsequent Labour small bore pistol bans. There must be no "I'm alright Jack" escape from any ban for a self-appointed coterie of "licensed athletes".

How will these elite shooters become elite shooters? they have to evolve through the various levels of the sport to get to be olympic standard. 

[enfieldspares]

2 hours ago, Vince Green said:

How will these elite shooters become elite shooters? they have to evolve through the various levels of the sport to get to be olympic standard. 

Exactly. But from my knowledge of what happened in relation to pistol shooting after the 1996 handgun ban it will become a closed self-selected coterie of individuals. There will effectively be no new entrants that this clique does not itself see fit to appoint. No longer how well can you shoot but now how well do you know X, Y or Z.

Edited May 12, 2022 by enfieldspares

[Vince Green]

On 06/05/2022 at 13:47, mellors said:

As i said on another thread it's a done deal. 

Absolutely nothing we say or do will change it now. 

 

Thats always been the case in the past with consultation periods prior enforcement. The thing is, and we should remember this, no Act of Parliament has approved this. Its just Civil Servants making it up as they go along. 

[Whitester]

I regularly use shotgun, air rifle, Rimfire and centerfire. 
 

I don’t hunt with the shotgun, that’s just for clays and I don’t target shooting with any rifles, they are just for hunting.

I can’t think of a single discipline that I do that will be stopped by the lead ban.

it’s coming no matter who’s fault it is but we can get over it and move on, think positive and keep shooting.

[harkom]

On 06/05/2022 at 21:11, Old farrier said:

it is a done deal we have been sold down the river and it seems there’s a bunch of antis working in the organisation’s with a agenda

This has been obvious for many years but .....those bad apples in the BSAC executive were well aware of the widespread apathy amongst the flock  aka  members.

[grahamch]

On 08/05/2022 at 13:17, 8 shot said:

I will be joining the CPSA in September when my BASC membership dies of self inflicted injuries, I did speak to a NGO rep and i had to put the phone down on him, his views were anti tradition, almost anti shooting. The buy back/ compensation thing will be very interesting, lets see how that pans out. 

How were his views anti tradition? maybe thatse  by sticking with out dated traditions 

[Rewulf]

 

Taken from the JI report.

What we have learned

• The opponents use often figures and science based on what they would like to achieve

• Important to have good contacts within the authorities

• Important to have an active, independent and serious organization among hunters so the number of «votes» will be noticeable for the politicians at the next election

• Use correct figures and facts based on authorized sourced means we will be taken seriously

 

The difference with Norway, is their version of BASC actively fought for their members.
Our orgs have already voted to ban lead shot, and accepted that lead projectiles cause harm to the environment, despite previously saying it didnt , and little to no evidence it does ?
I am not optimistic of a good outcome.

[harkom]

On 27/05/2022 at 13:59, Rewulf said:

Important to have an active, independent and serious organization among hunters so the number of «votes» will be noticeable for the politicians at the next election

 

Very true. Without verifiable numbers to support the case for field sports it will be very difficult to convince officialdom of game shooter numbers.

I recall the Idiots at Marford Mill were very keen to abolish the old Game Licence.... just another example of unintended consequences attributableto "the voice of shooting".

Edited May 28, 2022 by harkom

[Old farrier]

24 minutes ago, harkom said:

Very true. Without verifiable numbers to support the case for field sports it will be very difficult to convince officialdom of game shooter numbers.

I recall the Idiots at Marford Mill were very keen to abolish the old Game Licence.... just another example of unintended consequences attributableto "the voice of shooting".

That’s a very thought provoking idea 

re introducing the game licence for anyone who wishes to shoot game for there own consumption with lead 

corporate shooting with sold game non lead shot mandatory 

leave pest and vermin control as it is along with the air rifle and rimfire 

deerstalking possibly similar non lead if your selling anything if it’s for your own consumption 

[TIGHTCHOKE]

But none of that would kill off the shooting, so it will not happen!

[Old farrier]

16 minutes ago, TIGHTCHOKE said:

But none of that would kill off the shooting, so it will not happen!

So do we just roll over and not offer any workable solution 

there supposed to look into this  and be seen to do it properly and be accountable 

[TIGHTCHOKE]

5 minutes ago, Old farrier said:

So do we just roll over and not offer any workable solution 

there supposed to look into this  and be seen to do it properly and be accountable 

Well you can try, but the deal is done!