jonny thomas Posted November 19, 2016 Report Share Posted November 19, 2016 (edited) An elderly couple in Bristol have had their front door kicked in they've been mugged the old gent was bashed on the head with a cleaver and had boiling water poured on him What on gods green earth is wrong with these people Edited November 19, 2016 by jonny thomas Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Luckyshot Posted November 19, 2016 Report Share Posted November 19, 2016 Unfortunately its the world we live in now. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bluesj Posted November 19, 2016 Report Share Posted November 19, 2016 Just scum that never got taught right from wrong and I can only see it getting worse. Every body knows their rights but not many seam to know their responsibilities Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
matone Posted November 19, 2016 Report Share Posted November 19, 2016 Total lack of discipline from birth and no respect for anyone or thing . Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
remmy1100 Posted November 19, 2016 Report Share Posted November 19, 2016 yeah like to see them try it in america they would get blown back through door or be doing 20 yrs ,soft justice system in this county is no deterent for such scum Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mel b3 Posted November 19, 2016 Report Share Posted November 19, 2016 a better than average chance that it was some young junkie doing it for drug money. the whole world is just turning to crud. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
12gauge82 Posted November 19, 2016 Report Share Posted November 19, 2016 The way we deal with serious offenders needs dealing with. Hopefully with our exit from the EU something can be done, rewrite the human rights Act for a start so that some of it doesn't apply to convicted prisoners Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lloyd90 Posted November 20, 2016 Report Share Posted November 20, 2016 The way we deal with serious offenders needs dealing with. Hopefully with our exit from the EU something can be done, rewrite the human rights Act for a start so that some of it doesn't apply to convicted prisoners You don't understand how all that complicated legal stuff works do you ? Just admit it. People come on spouting out rubbish about how to "re-write" different acts so it doesn't apply to any group they don't like any different times! EVERYBODY has human rights! If one day the government turns around and says "all shooting is banned hand over your guns" and there was such a massive outrage that the government then decide all ex-legal firearms holders were now terrorists, criminals or whatever other group you want to "write out" of human rights legislation, then you as a person would have no human rights, no rights to a fair trial, no rights to not be tortured or treated unhamenely, no rights to see youany family! Everyone cries about the tiny minority's of people who use human rights legislation to be a knob, spare a thought for the MILLIONS of people who are protected by them, rightfully so, every single day. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
12gauge82 Posted November 20, 2016 Report Share Posted November 20, 2016 (edited) You don't understand how all that complicated legal stuff works do you ? Just admit it. People come on spouting out rubbish about how to "re-write" different acts so it doesn't apply to any group they don't like any different times! EVERYBODY has human rights! If one day the government turns around and says "all shooting is banned hand over your guns" and there was such a massive outrage that the government then decide all ex-legal firearms holders were now terrorists, criminals or whatever other group you want to "write out" of human rights legislation, then you as a person would have no human rights, no rights to a fair trial, no rights to not be tortured or treated unhamenely, no rights to see youany family! Everyone cries about the tiny minority's of people who use human rights legislation to be a knob, spare a thought for the MILLIONS of people who are protected by them, rightfully so, every single day. I understand it perfectly, maybe you should relook at your statement? I haven't said get rid of the human rights Act I said rewrite it, so that certain parts no longer apply to convicted offenders. I don't remember advocating torture etc. What you fail to understand is the effect some of these rights then give to dangours and evil people, above and beyond their victims. For instance a right to private and family life, this protects prisoners in that other prisoners can be classed as their 'family' and their cell as their 'home' this has far reaching implications and prevents them being dealt with effectively. How about the Bulger murderers and their right to anonymity, at least one of which continued his offending after release, how would you feel if you and your children were living next door to one of them (or any predatory paedophile) without your knowledge due to his human rights being protected? As for governments retrospectively branding us all terrorists, for a start if that happened you'd still go to jail anyway which would be a gross injustice and I'm not worried about that, the UK has many safety's built into its system and has lead the way in human rights long before we joined the EU. The human rights Act has only really been in its current form since 1998 and I don't remember being tortured by our government before that. Magna carta was first agreed in 1215, do some research. Edited November 20, 2016 by 12gauge82 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
12gauge82 Posted November 20, 2016 Report Share Posted November 20, 2016 Everyone cries about the tiny minority's of people who use human rights legislation to be a knob, spare a thought for the MILLIONS of people who are protected by them, rightfully so, every single day. As for this part of your quote why don't you try telling that to the victims family's of some of these serial killers who's kids are missing and they don't know where they are and what's happened to them, I'm sure they'll be really annoyed about the killers hiding behind human rights legislation to be a 'knob' and are bound to see the errors of their thinking. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dr D Posted November 20, 2016 Report Share Posted November 20, 2016 (edited) Lloyd90 is spot on some people just come on and spout rubbish about human rights law. Misconstruing Article 8. Talking nonsense about Article 3 not having been violated prior to 1998. And reflecting on the golden age of the 13th Century!!!! For god sake. Edited November 20, 2016 by Dr D Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chris1961 Posted November 20, 2016 Report Share Posted November 20, 2016 I myself put the blame solely on the parents of the scrum who did this if they brought up there children with any sort of morals of right and wrong then it would not have happend full stop .I for one am sick of do gooders and there well they have had a bad start to life havnt most of us respect is what is lacking rant over Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ollieollie Posted November 20, 2016 Report Share Posted November 20, 2016 Events like this don't surprise me anymore which is a barometer in itself! this country is getting further down the pan every day. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
team tractor Posted November 20, 2016 Report Share Posted November 20, 2016 I have a little rule I keep to. Everyday I let someone out on my drive home or help someone carry/move something during the day. It's my way of doing my bit to make the world a better place. It might seem silly but it's what I do These idiots are no better than vermin. They need a right pasting but someone a lot bigger when they break in. I know a guy who was robbed at the traffic lights in his van, he's a boxer and it didn't end well lol. He drove of leaving the theives unconscious . Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Twistedsanity Posted November 20, 2016 Report Share Posted November 20, 2016 Whatever way you perceive it they are all products of "society" which has clearly failed them. If you truly believe we live in a democratic society(seems a popular idea on this forum) then you are all equally responsible for their behaviour as you personally chose to vote in the people or governments that played a huge part in shaping their environment and therefore their futures. This country is riddled with poverty and unemployment whilst the people who are responsible for it sit in their ivory towers sneering at us and stealing all the money you pay in taxes to give to foreign countries, do up one of the richest women in the world second home or build a billion pound train set we don't really want or need Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mattyg1086 Posted November 20, 2016 Report Share Posted November 20, 2016 I'm afraid these people needs educating with a hammer and also thier parents I'm 30 years old and it wouldn't even enter my head to do something like that and I've been in trouble with the police when I was younger. The reason is my parents taught me limits my mum taught me through smacking the **** out of us and my dad through sitting you down and telling me and my brother off in a way that made us feel really bad without ever hitting us. Both ways of discipline work its just that people in my generation and below were not given boundaries, and as children you test the boundaries but if you are not given any to start with this is how far people think it's acceptable to go. Just my thoughts Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lloyd90 Posted November 20, 2016 Report Share Posted November 20, 2016 As for this part of your quote why don't you try telling that to the victims family's of some of these serial killers who's kids are missing and they don't know where they are and what's happened to them, I'm sure they'll be really annoyed about the killers hiding behind human rights legislation to be a 'knob' and are bound to see the errors of their thinking. So if they didn't have human rights we could torture the where abouts out of them ? Or do you mean something else ? You are a bit vague with what that actually means. If your referring to the Moors killers they were medically diagnosed as 'criminally insane'. As for article 8, if you even read the first paragraph you would see the exact words " There shall be no interference by a public authority with the exercise of this right except such as is in accordance with the law and is necessary in a democratic society in the interests of national security, public safety or the economic well-being of the country, for the prevention of disorder or crime, for the protection of health or morals, or for the protection of the rights and freedoms of others. As for the claim that prisoners say their cell mates are "their family" and this stops them being dealt with - do you have a source for this please ? I find it highly unbelievable sorry, the LEGAL definition is a group living together with ties by blood, marriage or adoption. I would be interested to hear actual sources of what you claim, maybe you are right and I wouldn't be rude and say you are wrong but I don't believe at present ... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Yellow Bear Posted November 20, 2016 Report Share Posted November 20, 2016 You don't understand how all that complicated legal stuff works do you ? Just admit it. People come on spouting out rubbish about how to "re-write" different acts so it doesn't apply to any group they don't like any different times! EVERYBODY has human rights! If one day the government turns around and says "all shooting is banned hand over your guns" and there was such a massive outrage that the government then decide all ex-legal firearms holders were now terrorists, criminals or whatever other group you want to "write out" of human rights legislation, then you as a person would have no human rights, no rights to a fair trial, no rights to not be tortured or treated unhamenely, no rights to see youany family! Everyone cries about the tiny minority's of people who use human rights legislation to be a knob, spare a thought for the MILLIONS of people who are protected by them, rightfully so, every single day. So one for you to answer - whose "human rights take presidency - the victim (in this case has been battered) who has the right to live in safety and has had this right curtailed, or the perpetrators who seems to have the "right" not to be harshly punished or have their "rights" curtailed. My personal view is that anyone who has curtailed the "Reasonable human rights" of another should be in no way allowed to hide behind the same "Reasonable human rights" with respect to their punishment. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TIGHTCHOKE Posted November 20, 2016 Report Share Posted November 20, 2016 Don't cross the line! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lloyd90 Posted November 20, 2016 Report Share Posted November 20, 2016 So one for you to answer - whose "human rights take presidency - the victim (in this case has been battered) who has the right to live in safety and has had this right curtailed, or the perpetrators who seems to have the "right" not to be harshly punished or have their "rights" curtailed. My personal view is that anyone who has curtailed the "Reasonable human rights" of another should be in no way allowed to hide behind the same "Reasonable human rights" with respect to their punishment. I could probably put the exact same answer as above. Nobody's rights take presidency - everyone has the same rights - hence my words "EVERYONE HAS HUMAN RIGHTS" You claim the perpetrator has the right " not to be harshly punished or have their "rights" curtailed " - except the exact above paragraph directly from Article 8 very clearly states that right does not apply to protect this person from punishment, I will quote it again if you like... "except such as is in accordance with the law and is necessary in a democratic society in the interests of national security, public safety or the economic well-being of the country, for the prevention of disorder or crime" Therefore this man, men, or whoever committed this crime could not claim a right to a family life as an excuse not to go to prison! Prison is how we deal with our criminals. Whether you deem this punishment "harsh" enough or not I don't know but claiming human rights protects these people from punishment is a total lie as its got a direct exemption for someone criminally convicted in a democratic society! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
old man Posted November 20, 2016 Report Share Posted November 20, 2016 You don't understand how all that complicated legal stuff works do you ? Just admit it. People come on spouting out rubbish about how to "re-write" different acts so it doesn't apply to any group they don't like any different times! EVERYBODY has human rights! If one day the government turns around and says "all shooting is banned hand over your guns" and there was such a massive outrage that the government then decide all ex-legal firearms holders were now terrorists, criminals or whatever other group you want to "write out" of human rights legislation, then you as a person would have no human rights, no rights to a fair trial, no rights to not be tortured or treated unhamenely, no rights to see youany family! Everyone cries about the tiny minority's of people who use human rights legislation to be a knob, spare a thought for the MILLIONS of people who are protected by them, rightfully so, every single day. Come on Lloyd, the human rights act does not give anyone the right to have guns for sporting purposes unless my understanding is wrong? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lloyd90 Posted November 20, 2016 Report Share Posted November 20, 2016 Come on Lloyd, the human rights act does not give anyone the right to have guns for sporting purposes unless my understanding is wrong? No mate it does not, I was just using an example. Essentially the government decides who is a criminal and who is not, they decide who is a terrorist and who is not. The point I was making is that one day the government may be very different from today. Somebody in power could decide that anybody who breaks any law (Speeding, Not paying council tax, or tv licence etc) is a criminal. Above some members believe some criminals should have their human rights removed. Look at South Africa, Look at The Republic of Ireland - so called terrorists went on to become key members of government. I believe the saying "One man's terrorist is another mans freedom fighter" holds true. If we give the government the power to repeal the human rights of anyone they currently don't like, what's to stop them targeting individual groups (So my example of shooters, but could also be applied to other groups - Muslims ? Arabs ? Irish ? JEWS ?!) Whether the HRA should be re-written to with UK Bill of Rights is an option, until we know the proposal it is hard to say whether good or bad. To say we should be able to repeal Human Rights from certain people is a dangerous slope is you actually understand the concept. I hope I've explained that a bit better mate. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
walshie Posted November 20, 2016 Report Share Posted November 20, 2016 Blimey. You lot could argue about anything. Whatever the laws are, they obviously aren't harsh enough to deter scum from doing this. I don't care if the perpetrator was mentally ill or a drug addict. The fact he went to the effort of boiling some water to pour on an old man means he wasn't there purely for the money. If he's caught, I'd like to see his punishment as having boiling water poured on him throughout his prison sentence, but unfortunately some do-gooder will make out this excuse for a human is somehow the victim and needs to be handled with kid gloves on his community service. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lloyd90 Posted November 20, 2016 Report Share Posted November 20, 2016 Blimey. You lot could argue about anything. Whatever the laws are, they obviously aren't harsh enough to deter scum from doing this. I don't care if the perpetrator was mentally ill or a drug addict. The fact he went to the effort of boiling some water to pour on an old man means he wasn't there purely for the money. If he's caught, I'd like to see his punishment as having boiling water poured on him throughout his prison sentence, but unfortunately some do-gooder will make out this excuse for a human is somehow the victim and needs to be handled with kid gloves on his community service. :lol: You should work for the Government Walshie! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
old man Posted November 20, 2016 Report Share Posted November 20, 2016 Bringing up kids is no different to dog training? The ones that misbehave have to be corrected and that doesn't mean beating the **** out of it? Animals have rights too except in various forms of religious slaughter? Excessive drinking and drug abuse will kill the NHS in one way or another? Excessive drinking having been promoted by Government. IMHO, Sadly the legal system is not fit for purpose due to constant lobbying from behind the scenes probably? If this is not corrected soon, It will not end well for anyone? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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