country file / medical reports and linconshire

[Brad93]

3 minutes ago, Penelope said:

I don't dispute that they tried to charge you, but did Essex Police send you a letter requesting a medical report from your GP?

Oh sorry. No no request from Essex police for a medical report. 

Quote

Hi Brad,

Thanks for scanned documents.

Regarding the fee from the GP, what was it they want you to pay £50 for? From what I can see, my colleague dealing with your renewal hasn’t asked for a medical report from them, just for them to add a marker to your patient records to say that you are the holder of a license. I find it hard to understand the need to charge anybody £50 for something like that?

Kind regards,

FEO

 

[harkom]

43 minutes ago, Salopian said:

Anyone could be interviewed by their GP and in his opinion (he's not a psychiatrist) be a fit and reasonable person , but a few days later said person could have life changing circumstances such as divorce , redundancy , illness which would greatly effect their mental health , making any prior assessment irrelevant.

This is, IMO, an erudite statement which highlights the necessity for  periodic renewal of a SGC/FAC - e.g along the lines of 3-5 year period. However the idiots at BASC have been canvassing and promulgating a much, much longer certificate longevity. huh...??

Another point which I have not seen mentioned on the "requirement" for GP endorsement of a certificate renewal/application - ( and the demand for payment in lieu ) - It is only a couple of years ago that medical practices were requesting patients approval to release the individuals medical files, en masse I presume, to third parties - on the premise that this would optimise patient health care (and no doubt there would have been cash incentives involved !!??  and no mention  of this information being gathered and used by Insurance companies etc)......so the question remains - "If the NHS medical practices can do this, why cannot the individual applicants file/records be made available for access by qualified FEO scrutineers - at little/no cost ??

yours, etc

Disgruntled 

[TIGHTCHOKE]

I thought the reason that BASC and others have suggested the lengthening of the renewal interval was to ease the pressure on the licensing departments and to offer better values

[Penelope]

My wife has applied for her SGC grant, had the interview, all good and no concerns. Had a request for a medical report (anxiety medication following separation 5 years ago) from Essex Police and her GP is refusing to write a report on the grounds that it's not NHS work.

Spoken to BASC who say Essex retain a GP for instances like this and to get a letter from the GP stating that they are not prepared to write the report and her medical records (£40) and send them to Essex Firearms. Spoken to our FEO, who has said send an email with the details and he'll sort it (decent chap).

[wymberley]

1 hour ago, David BASC said:

BASC were delighted to see BBC Countryfile covering firearms licensing in last night’s programme.

 

BASC supported the BBC heavily in their research for this episode and provided contact with members who have been struggling with the issues. We also put the BBC in contact with the national police lead on firearms licensing.

 

While BASC were not mentioned directly last night, the important thing is that the issue has now received national exposure.

Have to agree, David. It was a particularly well balanced piece. The only entity which came out of it badly was the published guidelines. This needs binning immediately and replacing by a revised definitive procedure with no loopholes, which allows no deviation, is fair, meets the only sensible objective (as far as any legislation can) and which is acceptable to all rational stakeholders.

[panoma1]

9 minutes ago, wymberley said:

Have to agree, David. It was a particularly well balanced piece. The only entity which came out of it badly was the published guidelines. This needs binning immediately and replacing by a revised definitive procedure with no loopholes, which allows no deviation, is fair, meets the only sensible objective (as far as any legislation can) and which is acceptable to all rational stakeholders.

And as agreed, there is no charge from the GP to the applicant, for the initial police enquiry!

After all, out of all their patients, how many sgc/fac holders are on a given surgeries books? Not many I'll be bound? Shared between all the GP's practicing at the surgery/health centre!........So where does all this bull **** about extra work load come in? All the grabbing quack has to do (once an initial marker is placed on a certificate holders record) is inform Lilly if a certificate holder has currently or has developed a reportable illness!......

The measures (no fee for initial marker/enquiry, fee payable to GP if a further report is requested by the police!) were agreed in the interests of public safety.....not to give greedy GP's a new income stream!

Bloody shambles!......Cops doing what they like! GP's doing what they like.....shooting community forced to swallow it!....disgusting!

[deershooter]

Can some one tell me what "act and section of the firearms act" allows the police to do this ,because I think they are operating outside the law and making it up themselves 

[panoma1]

31 minutes ago, deershooter said:

Can some one tell me what "act and section of the firearms act" allows the police to do this ,because I think they are operating outside the law and making it up themselves 

It is not law.........it is, agreed by all stakeholders home office guidance! So they are ignoring guidance not breaking the law!.......the police and the GP's are obviously happy the break agreements when it suits them!.....not something the shooting community can do!

[old man]

Not read this yet but my first thought is of the missed opportunity for all of the organisations to come together as a cohesive front.

Not holding my breath either.

[Brodie]

Lincs police reasons for requesting GPs reports could equally apply to applicants requiring a new driving license. In the wrong hands a vehicle can be as lethal as a firearm.

Why did BBC interviewer not ask the Detective Inspected, who strangely appeared in uniform clutching his cap, what evidence they have of shooters with medical conditions being involved in incidents.

[wymberley]

27 minutes ago, panoma1 said:

It is not law.........it is, agreed by all stakeholders home office guidance! So they are ignoring guidance not breaking the law!.......the police and the GP's are obviously happy the break agreements when it suits them!.....not something the shooting community can do!

The problem is is that what the doctor interviewed said will gain empathy with the general public. Similarly, the police inspector said what everyone would wish to hear. In short, a level of PR skills possessed by both. Yes, the guidelines are being breached but are the general public aware of what these are or even that they exist?

We've had a heads up that there's a Panorama programme in the offing. Before we start criticising others about breaching guidelines which in themselves make it possible to be done, we would need to hope that we're not going to get severely tarred - and feathered - with the same brush. Under the circumstances, there's more to be gained and it makes more sense to me to correct a situation rather than criticise those who have taken advantage of it.

[Davyo]

Im looking at it from a different prespective.Imagine if a doctor complied,then a year or two down the line the cert holder developed a serious condition.Lets say the doctor forgets to flag this up in his hectic day to day working life.Cert holder then does an Atherton ! Who is the polices scape goat? If i where a doctor i wouldnt be putting my head on the block.

[bluesj]

One bit of advise I was given by someone in the trade if you have to get a report from your doctor, get them to send a copy to you as well.

Its not unknown for records to be wrong, its not going to help you if a couple of pages from Mad Dog McGregor's notes have ended up in your file!

[greylag]

BASC should have had representation on the program as the biggest shooting organisation in the country.Please stop standing in the background,put members concerns to the police on camera.Countryside Alliance did manage to speak on our behalf but surely it should have been BASC. I am not a BASC knocker having been a member to 40 plus years.

[wymberley]

1 hour ago, Davyo said:

Im looking at it from a different prespective.Imagine if a doctor complied,then a year or two down the line the cert holder developed a serious condition.Lets say the doctor forgets to flag this up in his hectic day to day working life.Cert holder then does an Atherton ! Who is the polices scape goat? If i where a doctor i wouldnt be putting my head on the block.

Unless of course you (they) got paid it would seem.

[Scully]

1 hour ago, Davyo said:

Im looking at it from a different prespective.Imagine if a doctor complied,then a year or two down the line the cert holder developed a serious condition.Lets say the doctor forgets to flag this up in his hectic day to day working life.Cert holder then does an Atherton ! Who is the polices scape goat? If i where a doctor i wouldnt be putting my head on the block.

During talks between all parties involved it has already been established that no GP can be held responsible. They are not expected to be used as ‘scapegoats’. 

[FX90]

23 hours ago, shaun4860 said:

Apparently in Lincolnshire if you don’t get a letter from your doc then you won’t get a licence or renewal, 

Thats from their head of firearms department who strangely  is a detective, not uniformed

 

My FAC  renewall,  Lincolnshire £62, my FAC medical records etc £65 or NO renewall . 

[AYA117]

If a lawful gun owner becomes afraid of seeing his doctor if they are 'depressed' or 'stressed' for whatever reason ! Just so that it does not mean he may lose their gun licence, only to add to their anguish, then surely this is counter productive !

Just a thought !

 

Sorry !  I know a bit (well a lot really ) off topic, but is that not what is very likely.

Edited January 8, 2018 by AYA117

[panoma1]

14 minutes ago, FX90 said:

My FAC  renewall,  Lincolnshire £62, my FAC medical records etc £65 or NO renewall . 

Speak to BASC!

[old'un]

It saddens me to see all this, its almost like they don’t want anyone to own guns.

Edited January 8, 2018 by old'un

[mossy835]

they dont want us to have guns,scotland have it bad up there with there police.basc have done nothing two help them if the police want to do some thing they will do it.what can the orgs do.

[old'un]

6 minutes ago, mossy835 said:

they dont want us to have guns,scotland have it bad up there with there police.basc have done nothing two help them if the police want to do some thing they will do it.what can the orgs do.

Its almost like someone as been put in a backroom somewhere and told, find ways of making it more difficult, more expensive etc, so people either give up their guns on renewal or don’t bother applying for a grant.

[panoma1]

23 minutes ago, old'un said:

Its almost like someone as been put in a backroom somewhere and told, find ways of making it more difficult, more expensive etc, so people either give up their guns on renewal or don’t bother applying for a grant.

Same applies to why it takes 5/6 months for the police to renew a SGC?.....Nobody can justify that! When In reality It probably only takes a few minutes paperwork and often just a phone call to do!...........I'm of the opinion that it is just another obstacle chucked in the way with the intention of making life difficult for gun owners!

[drut]

Presently I am awaiting visit for my FAC/SGC renewal,I am fortunate in that Northumbria seem thorough but sensible/professional but am saddened by the"postcode lottery" that others face.Home Office guidance not being followed by Durham  led to a coroner criticising them re:Atherton,they then introduced a "pilot" need for a medical opinion  http://www.shootinguk.co.uk/news/durham-firearms-licence-applicants-to-pay-for-medical-checks-20584

This to my mind was no more than a mechanism to deflect attention from their failings to adhere to Home Office guidance in the first place,then BASC seemed to pursue the myth that medical monitoring/involvement would lead to the holy grail of 10yr certificates: dream on! The resultant debacle we are now left with needs sorting out forthwith in everyones interest.

 

 

 

[rbrowning2]

You need to look back and remember the shooting organisations went  long with the medical side of the process in the stupid belief that we would in return get a ten year certificate but that never happened it was always going to end like this doctors working for free on work outside their NHS contract was never going to happen. They charge for pilots medicals etc. Why did those involved conclude that the doctors would work for free? And why was who to pay and how much not agreed upon.

Then do they really believe involving the doctors could ever stop another mass shooting? Whilst me might like to think it might in practice the possibility must be very small.