Debbie BASC Posted April 27, 2019 Report Share Posted April 27, 2019 New general licence “not fit for purpose”, BASC tells NE Apr 27, 2019 BASC chairman Peter Glenser QC has said the drafting of the new general licence issued by Natural England has been “shoddy and hurried” and the document is “not fit for purpose”. BASC’s experts have been analysing the 11-page document and its supporting information since it was released by Natural England on Friday night. BASC chief executive Ian Bell outlined his concerns around the failings in the new licence in a phone call to Natural England on Saturday afternoon. Mr Glenser said: “We have been in contact with other leading rural organisations during Saturday and all our experts have been working very quickly to analyse the licence so that we could give some reassurances to the rural community. “Having done that work, we are not able to give those assurances and we have told Natural England exactly that. We have to say that the shambles is continuing in the aftermath of Natural England’s appalling decision to withdraw the three original general licences without warning or consultation on Tuesday. “Some of the content of the new licence for controlling carrion crows is, quite frankly, bizarre and we believe the licence in its current form is unworkable. We have real fears for the other licences which have yet to be released.” Mr Bell said: “When I spoke to Natural England directly today I demanded they reintroduce the 2019 general licences that they took away without consultation. There is no time to delay in this, the rural community is desperate for answers and reassurance.” Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PPP Posted April 27, 2019 Report Share Posted April 27, 2019 And the response from NE is/was? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pigeon Shredder. Posted April 27, 2019 Report Share Posted April 27, 2019 Ahh their reply will be published on a spreadsheet that can’t be opened by 99.9% of those wishing to read it, seem familiar 🤔 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AYA117 Posted April 27, 2019 Report Share Posted April 27, 2019 Thank you Debbie for posting that, 7 pm on a Saturday evening and still working. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mossy835 Posted April 27, 2019 Report Share Posted April 27, 2019 (edited) good for all BASC to work late, and get this balls up working. Edited April 27, 2019 by mossy835 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mudpatten Posted April 27, 2019 Report Share Posted April 27, 2019 The chief exec was still hard at it at 8.30 pm on Friday. And ,yes, thank you Debbie. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
panoma1 Posted April 27, 2019 Report Share Posted April 27, 2019 Yep credit where it's due! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
silver fox 1 Posted April 27, 2019 Report Share Posted April 27, 2019 (edited) 17 minutes ago, panoma1 said: Yep credit where it's due! I’ll second that thanks for the update much appreciated Edited April 27, 2019 by silver fox 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Konnie Posted April 27, 2019 Report Share Posted April 27, 2019 Excellent hopefully something some clarity to come next week. Credit where it's due BASC Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dodgy dave Posted April 28, 2019 Report Share Posted April 28, 2019 13 hours ago, Konnie said: Excellent hopefully something some clarity to come next week. Credit where it's due BASC we have all at to work overtime to get the job done on time . once or twice in our lives it comes with the job Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
8 shot Posted April 28, 2019 Report Share Posted April 28, 2019 Natural England are not fit for purpose, this nonsense and various things in farming that just contradict each other,and now i read in the paper there new boss has had close dealings with Packham and Avery in the not so distant past. I smell a rat me thinks Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mossy835 Posted April 28, 2019 Report Share Posted April 28, 2019 nothing will work unless, we go back to the old way. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
oldypigeonpopper Posted April 28, 2019 Report Share Posted April 28, 2019 hello, is it time for another Liberty and Livelihood MARCH ? rename it to The Decline of our Song Birds, including the Livelihood of Farming and rural way of life to protect crops. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bluesj Posted April 28, 2019 Report Share Posted April 28, 2019 I hope no one was expecting something that would be both legal and workable, how would that be any good in helping juniper's mates Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scully Posted April 28, 2019 Report Share Posted April 28, 2019 (edited) In this case I think BASC may have a point. I'm still waiting for someone who can tell me the difference between the old GL and the new one ( in the paragraph in the link ) as regarding how NE can prove either the landowner or the shooter has complied with the terms of it, which as far as I'm aware is the entire reason for updating the old version! https://ibb.co/QY2skg9 Edited April 28, 2019 by Scully Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
old man Posted April 28, 2019 Report Share Posted April 28, 2019 What a continuing dogs breakfast, and we are classed as ill educated and inept? Just what are the conditions that we need to abide by to be legal? Or is it just me being myopic? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TIGHTCHOKE Posted April 28, 2019 Report Share Posted April 28, 2019 2 minutes ago, old man said: What a continuing dogs breakfast, and we are classed as ill educated and inept? Just what are the conditions that we need to abide by to be legal? Or is it just me being myopic? Go out to the fields, wear bright clothing, make lots of noise, if there are any pigeons left in your area try to miss when shooting in their general direction! Simples! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ditchman Posted April 28, 2019 Report Share Posted April 28, 2019 bring back "Farming diary" .......pleeeease Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
oldypigeonpopper Posted April 28, 2019 Report Share Posted April 28, 2019 1 minute ago, TIGHTCHOKE said: Go out to the fields, wear bright clothing, make lots of noise, if there are any pigeons left in your area try to miss when shooting in their general direction! Simples! hello, i just sent off for a scarecrow costume ha ha, Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TIGHTCHOKE Posted April 28, 2019 Report Share Posted April 28, 2019 1 minute ago, oldypigeonpopper said: hello, i just sent off for a scarecrow costume ha ha, Please post some photo's when you use it! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mossy835 Posted April 28, 2019 Report Share Posted April 28, 2019 the rooks and crows, will land on you and poo. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
old man Posted April 28, 2019 Report Share Posted April 28, 2019 (edited) IMHO, while NE mess about trying to be clever by being non specific with regard to the specific conditions required to be complied with, they only leave everyone open to a challenge of non compliance in the courts? This idea is maybe stupid and a two edged sword. If a specific condition of action required prior to shooting is given, then surely if that condition is carried out and recorded no one can be easily challenged? I just despair at their ineptitude, or is it just me? ISO 9001 does not apply? More like The Beano! Edited April 28, 2019 by old man Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wymberley Posted April 28, 2019 Report Share Posted April 28, 2019 And the NGO agrees: The National Gamekeepers’ Organisation (NGO) has condemned a new General Licence for controlling crows in England as “hurried, botched and completely unfit for purpose.” The new licence (GL 26, for killing crows to protect livestock including kept gamebirds), was issued by Natural England (NE) last night, just two days after they had revoked earlier General Licences, thereby temporarily making crows a fully protected species throughout England. Announcing the replacement licence, NE’s Interim Chief Executive, Marian Spain said it would bring “peace of mind” to those who needed to control crows. But urgent analysis by the NGO has found the new 11-page licence to be far more restrictive than the 5-page licence it replaces. The additional restrictions include: The new licence only allows crows to be killed “as a last resort.” It allows someone to kill crows only if they have previously tried non-lethal ways of solving the problems the crows are causing. It prevents someone from destroying a crow’s nest when it is not in use. It prevents the use of some types of cage traps. It restricts the control of crows during their breeding season. It is invalid in conservation areas such as SSSIs unless a further licence is obtained from NE. And it requests users to “exercise restraint” when shooting or scaring crows in periods of severe weather. It took the NGO just moments to spot many serious flaws in the new licence, which was rushed out without any consultation, with no chance given to suggest changes. Liam Bell, the NGO Chairman, said: “NE’s new crow licence is hurried, botched and completely unfit for purpose. NE must go back to the drawing board and we have offered our help in drafting a replacement licence that is workable and clear. That will take time, however, and vulnerable young gamebirds, lambs and other livestock cannot be left this spring without protection from crows. “In the meantime, therefore, the NGO has asked NE for the immediate re-introduction of the old General Licences that were revoked last Thursday, with additional legal safeguards to ensure that gamekeepers and others who control crows and other problem birds can do so without risk of prosecution.” Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TIGHTCHOKE Posted April 28, 2019 Report Share Posted April 28, 2019 Oh good grief! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
panoma1 Posted April 28, 2019 Report Share Posted April 28, 2019 These government quangos are completely useless unless someone who knows, tells em what to do, even then they won't listen because they want to continue to appear to be "in control" and continue to work to their own agenda! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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