Forewarned is to be Forearmed

[old'un]

I am sure Packham and Avery visit this and other sites for info which helps them plan their next attack on us, with this in mind I have bookmarked these websites and will check them on a regular bases, its something I have never felt the need to-do before, but as we and our org’s where caught with our trousers down,  better to see what the enemy is up to rather than just hope they will go away.

Forewarned is to be forearmed

.

 

Wild Justice..https://www.chrispackham.co.uk/news/wild-justice

 

Mark Avery blog..https://markavery.info/blog/

[scolopax]

I have been following Avery for a few years, full of his own self importance but also clever, persistant and most of all dangerous. 

One thing he has not given away is what their next target will be, it might be bird orientated but that is not guaranteed, hare coursing was mentioned yesterday.

One thing for certain we have not heard the last of them, we really need to be thinking about where 'we' are most vulnerable. They will go for easy wins first.

[JDog]

Many shooting people denigrate Packham but he along with Avery has outwitted the pro shooting lobby on the matter of the general licence. There will be more to come. Will it be easier for instance to defend the shooting of Carrion crows and other corvids than to defend the rearing of pheasants for sport?

[TIGHTCHOKE]

3 minutes ago, JDog said:

Many shooting people denigrate Packham but he along with Avery has outwitted the pro shooting lobby on the matter of the general licence. There will be more to come. Will it be easier for instance to defend the shooting of Carrion crows and other corvids than to defend the rearing of pheasants for sport?

I turned up at our friendly little 50 bird clay shoot this morning and was a solitary calm voice amongst a rising angry mob baying for Packhams head on a plate.

They did not like me telling them that it has been coming for a while and that an awful lot of pigeon shooters were not even aware there were any General Licences, let alone complying with them.

Once the assembled mass had calmed down I pointed out that nothing Wild Justice had done was illegal and that we as shooters need to get our act together and stop feeling hard done by.

[old'un]

11 minutes ago, JDog said:

Many shooting people denigrate Packham but he along with Avery has outwitted the pro shooting lobby on the matter of the general licence. There will be more to come. Will it be easier for instance to defend the shooting of Carrion crows and other corvids than to defend the rearing of pheasants for sport?

You are of course correct and with the help of other celebs who are sympathetic to Packham/Avery fight, plus social media, we will over the next few months/years see a lot more attacks on all forms of shooting.

[Walker570]

20 minutes ago, TIGHTCHOKE said:

I turned up at our friendly little 50 bird clay shoot this morning and was a solitary calm voice amongst a rising angry mob baying for Packhams head on a plate.

They did not like me telling them that it has been coming for a while and that an awful lot of pigeon shooters were not even aware there were any General Licences, let alone complying with them.

Once the assembled mass had calmed down I pointed out that nothing Wild Justice had done was illegal and that we as shooters need to get our act together and stop feeling hard done by.

Exactly.  I also think , certainly with commercial pigeon shooting they have been bending the rules but we must be seen as squeaky clean and the 'paper hats'  who hung those crows where way out of line, it did us no good at all.  Remember Joe Public is totally gullible and believe everything they see on the screen. 

[The gouse]

Well old’en he’s got nothing in there premonting is zoo in the Isle of Wight. 

The zoo’s tripadvisor reviews are not the best with ripoff prices animal welfare how animals are kept.

But one thing that gets me is what dose he feed them all on. Loads of big cats, birds of prey, snakes, he must have them on a veggie diet. 

[old'un]

30 minutes ago, TIGHTCHOKE said:

I turned up at our friendly little 50 bird clay shoot this morning and was a solitary calm voice amongst a rising angry mob baying for Packhams head on a plate.

They did not like me telling them that it has been coming for a while and that an awful lot of pigeon shooters were not even aware there were any General Licences, let alone complying with them.

Once the assembled mass had calmed down I pointed out that nothing Wild Justice had done was illegal and that we as shooters need to get our act together and stop feeling hard done by.

Even with what as happened over the last few days I cannot see that happening….can you?, we are to fragmented and no one voice with any clout.

[Walker570]

On a slightly lighter note, the crows in Texas are protected but the wording in the regulations says they can be shot if they are predating or about to predate and as my friend over there said, "Have y'alll ever known a crow not about to predate?"   Sensible law that.

[old'un]

20 minutes ago, Walker570 said:

Exactly.  I also think , certainly with commercial pigeon shooting they have been bending the rules but we must be seen as squeaky clean and the 'paper hats'  who hung those crows where way out of line, it did us no good at all.  Remember Joe Public is totally gullible and believe everything they see on the screen. 

Or people like this, the article is from the BBC but posted on Wild Justice by Packham on his Twitter account..https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-tyne-48051020

[Walker570]

Well done that Judge for putting him away, totally deserved.

[greylag]

I think it is about time that photographs of piles of dead crows and pigeons were not published.We are doing ourselves  no favours and giving our enemies fuel for their arguments.Packham,Avery,and the rest of the pack do not need any more ammunition.

[scutt]

36 minutes ago, greylag said:

I think it is about time that photographs of piles of dead crows and pigeons were not published.We are doing ourselves  no favours and giving our enemies fuel for their arguments.Packham,Avery,and the rest of the pack do not need any more ammunition.

But it shows the real world and tells the public the truth maybe the more they see the less of a shock they get.just a thought .

[robbiep]

2 hours ago, greylag said:

I think it is about time that photographs of piles of dead crows and pigeons were not published.We are doing ourselves  no favours and giving our enemies fuel for their arguments.Packham,Avery,and the rest of the pack do not need any more ammunition.

I disagree. If people don't see that the sheer numbers of pigeons, crows, rooks etc exist, then they think it's just the odd few that are being shot. 

Show them pictures of the bag (with the count), pictures of the bird's crop opened up, the amount of peas, etc that are in there. Even weigh the amount in the crop, do the maths for them as to how much in crops that number of birds will take - every single day.

 

[Scully]

1 hour ago, robbiep said:

I disagree. If people don't see that the sheer numbers of pigeons, crows, rooks etc exist, then they think it's just the odd few that are being shot. 

Show them pictures of the bag (with the count), pictures of the bird's crop opened up, the amount of peas, etc that are in there. Even weigh the amount in the crop, do the maths for them as to how much in crops that number of birds will take - every single day.

 

We were amazed at just how much a pigeon can stuff itself with when we used to open up the crops to see what they'd been eating. 

[kenholland]

19 minutes ago, Scully said:

We were amazed at just how much a pigeon can stuff itself with when we used to open up the crops to see what they'd been eating. 

so do all the farmers now , since Wednesday thanks to packman, stuff your selfs silly mr and  mrs pigeon it's your birthday.

[mick miller]

23 hours ago, The gouse said:

But one thing that gets me is what dose he feed them all on?

A possible angle for investigation? Imagine the outcry when the public realise that hundred of mammals are farmed and killed every week simply to keep these 'exhibits' alive? Is it really worth it? Shouldn't these animals be rewilded and released?

23 hours ago, The gouse said:

The zoo’s tripadvisor reviews are not the best... animal welfare how animals are kept. 

Imagine again the outcry when we see caged, wild animals kept unnaturally under the guise of 'conservation'? Surely, there should be centres of excellence for this instead, with standards that can be met and adhered to?

 

-- This is where shooting needs to go. Fight fire with fire and sling that mud right back.

[islandgun]

On 28/04/2019 at 12:08, scolopax said:

I have been following Avery for a few years, full of his own self importance but also clever, persistant and most of all dangerous. 

One thing he has not given away is what their next target will be, it might be bird orientated but that is not guaranteed, hare coursing was mentioned yesterday.

One thing for certain we have not heard the last of them, we really need to be thinking about where 'we' are most vulnerable. They will go for easy wins first.

driven grouse, driven pheasant, and blue hares ?  woodcock. golden plover

Edited April 29, 2019 by islandgun

[Teal]

I think he said he is going to try and stop gamebird chicks being imported from France to the UK, by going to the shipping/train providers.

He's a clever man, and does make compelling arguments by focusing on areas that he garners a lot of specific knowledge about. The truth is many sportsman will agree with some of the policies he is advocating. For example on caged hen pheasants as brood stock to supply eggs at or for the game-farms in the UK. Unfortunately some years ago, BASC made a horlicks of this by partnering up with Animal Aid, and following Shooting Mags whipping up criticism they backtracked and no longer advocated that laying cages be banned. 

As someone who believes in the ethos of free-range game, and who doesn't eat chicken because of the way that they are reared, kept and their lifespan. I personally would not want pheasants kept in this way, and if challenged I would find it very difficult to support it. It is a shame that the shooting organisations are not more proactive to address areas of bad practice, as they hold a position of considerable influence. They often seem to be more re-active, and respond to events once they have happened. 

[old man]

23 hours ago, Walker570 said:

On a slightly lighter note, the crows in Texas are protected but the wording in the regulations says they can be shot if they are predating or about to predate and as my friend over there said, "Have y'alll ever known a crow not about to predate?"   Sensible law that.

And that maybe is the way to go, be specific in the statemented fact that lethal control is legal under certain circumstances? No different than the way people are liable to sanction where the law is broken?

[islandgun]

1 hour ago, Teal said:

I think he said he is going to try and stop gamebird chicks being imported from France to the UK, by going to the shipping/train providers.

He's a clever man, and does make compelling arguments by focusing on areas that he garners a lot of specific knowledge about. The truth is many sportsman will agree with some of the policies he is advocating. For example on caged hen pheasants as brood stock to supply eggs at or for the game-farms in the UK. Unfortunately some years ago, BASC made a horlicks of this by partnering up with Animal Aid, and following Shooting Mags whipping up criticism they backtracked and no longer advocated that laying cages be banned. 

As someone who believes in the ethos of free-range game, and who doesn't eat chicken because of the way that they are reared, kept and their lifespan. I personally would not want pheasants kept in this way, and if challenged I would find it very difficult to support it. It is a shame that the shooting organisations are not more proactive to address areas of bad practice, as they hold a position of considerable influence. They often seem to be more re-active, and respond to events once they have happened. 

Indeed.. An end to game rearing,  pheasants ducks etc, which would also see an end to Commercial shoots,  [Politicians are useless as they only add up votes]. increases in veganism will also add to the anti vote. No one seems able to point out that most of the antis are quite happy to tuck into a KFC or wear leather boots or that veganism will see the end of all farm animals, As you say and as i have been saying for a while. shooting needs to be pro-active and point the finger at some of the hypocritical miss-informed ideas that the antis etc have.this also includes aspects of land management that are to the detriment of all wildlife...theres a very long list

[scolopax]

6 hours ago, islandgun said:

driven grouse, driven pheasant, and blue hares ?  woodcock. golden plover

Avery has been relentless in pursuit of driven grouse but I think they may try something new, maybe in one of the devolved governments?  Blue hare maybe, the SNP will be a soft touch for them, lots of sympathetic ears in the Scottish parliament 

Edited April 29, 2019 by scolopax

[islandgun]

1 hour ago, scolopax said:

Avery has been relentless in pursuit of driven grouse but I think they may try something new, maybe in one of the devolved governments?  Blue hare maybe, the SNP will be a soft touch for them, lots of sympathetic ears in the Scottish parliament 

Theres a lot of [vote catching] sympathy from all the uk's politicians, who would mr average side with ? save the wild animals or shoot the wild animals , in the end it's which one wins the most votes..  no question that any party would ban country pursuits if it thought it might win another term

[Mice!]

https://m.facebook.com/groups/1646912792000861?view=permalink&id=3192938737398251&refid=18&notif_t=groups_preview_invite&_ft_=qid.6686155610509928058%3Amf_story_key.3192938737398251%3Agroup_id.1646912792000861%3Atop_level_post_id.3192938737398251%3Atl_objid.3192938737398251%3Acontent_owner_id_new.1636651937%3Aoriginal_content_id.2543650589013280%3Aoriginal_content_owner_id.100001050912700%3Asrc.22%3Aphoto_id.2543646625680343%3Astory_location.6%3Aattached_story_attachment_style.photo&__tn__=*W-R#footer_action_list

worth a look, sums Avery up.

[Newbie to this]

20 minutes ago, Mice! said:

https://m.facebook.com/groups/1646912792000861?view=permalink&id=3192938737398251&refid=18&notif_t=groups_preview_invite&_ft_=qid.6686155610509928058%3Amf_story_key.3192938737398251%3Agroup_id.1646912792000861%3Atop_level_post_id.3192938737398251%3Atl_objid.3192938737398251%3Acontent_owner_id_new.1636651937%3Aoriginal_content_id.2543650589013280%3Aoriginal_content_owner_id.100001050912700%3Asrc.22%3Aphoto_id.2543646625680343%3Astory_location.6%3Aattached_story_attachment_style.photo&__tn__=*W-R#footer_action_list

worth a look, sums Avery up.

Link doesn't work, I just get a message saying 'the link may be broken or the page removed'