12gauge82 Posted November 24, 2018 Report Share Posted November 24, 2018 Can't believe what May has done with Gibraltar, she's so desperate the EU must smell it a mile off, just what is she and her crowneys going to give up next. https://www.theguardian.com/politics/2018/nov/24/brexit-may-gives-way-over-gibraltar-after-spains-veto-threat Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gordon R Posted November 24, 2018 Report Share Posted November 24, 2018 Spain has no power of veto - a Spanish politician desperately trying to sound important - just like Wee Jimmy Krankie. "Strong for Spain". Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
12gauge82 Posted November 24, 2018 Report Share Posted November 24, 2018 Just now, Gordon R said: Spain has no power of veto - a Spanish politician desperately trying to sound important - just like Wee Jimmy Krankie. "Strong for Spain". Agreed, but May just appears weak to me and must be a laughing stock to the EU. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JRDS Posted November 24, 2018 Report Share Posted November 24, 2018 2 minutes ago, 12gauge82 said: Agreed, but May just appears weak to me and must be a laughing stock to the EU. She is not a laughing stock she is a traitor that needs a rope. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jaymo Posted November 24, 2018 Report Share Posted November 24, 2018 41 minutes ago, JRDS said: She is not a laughing stock she is a traitor that needs a rope. Blimey mate- u need to calm down before u get an ulcer..... Given the expanse of the task I don’t think any leader would have come out smelling of roses Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ordnance Posted November 24, 2018 Report Share Posted November 24, 2018 1 minute ago, Jaymo said: Blimey mate- u need to calm down before u get an ulcer..... Given the expanse of the task I don’t think any leader would have come out smelling of roses True, but they could have come out without surrendering to EU demands. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jaymo Posted November 24, 2018 Report Share Posted November 24, 2018 12 minutes ago, ordnance said: True, but they could have come out without surrendering to EU demands. Have they? Totally or compromised on issues- any divorce is going to be messy and you can’t both ‘keep the house and split the dog’ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gordon R Posted November 24, 2018 Report Share Posted November 24, 2018 I am curious as to who thinks someone could have got a better deal. It doesn't seem to suit anyone, but if it doesn't get through Parliament, we will leave with no deal. The very same people who said they could have got a better deal will start moaning again. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ordnance Posted November 24, 2018 Report Share Posted November 24, 2018 1 minute ago, Jaymo said: Have they? Totally or compromised on issues- any divorce is going to be messy and you can’t both ‘keep the house and split the dog’ I would like something in return for 40 billion. Her red lines have gone, she has excepted the EU red lines. 2 minutes ago, Gordon R said: I am curious as to who thinks someone could have got a better deal. It doesn't seem to suit anyone, but if it doesn't get through Parliament, we will leave with no deal. The very same people who said they could have got a better deal will start moaning again. Labour will not vote for it, not because they think its a good or bad deal but hoping there will be a election if it fails. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
yod dropper Posted November 24, 2018 Report Share Posted November 24, 2018 A while back before things got silly it was said the EU wanted us for 3 things. Our money, our defence (security) and our fishing grounds. They've got our money including not just future spending but proposed future spending. In the same legally binding document they've got our defence and security. Now I suspect that the fishing grounds will be traded away in return for trade access (despite the fact they run a massive deficit) so they'll get what they wanted from us. The irony is that at the end of the transition period we still might end up on WTO terms, which is where we could be March but without having given away that stupid amount of money and we'd still have had defence and security in the bag to trade with. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JRDS Posted November 24, 2018 Report Share Posted November 24, 2018 12 minutes ago, Gordon R said: I am curious as to who thinks someone could have got a better deal. It doesn't seem to suit anyone, but if it doesn't get through Parliament, we will leave with no deal. The very same people who said they could have got a better deal will start moaning again. A deal is an invention to keep us tied to the EU, never got a mention during the Referendum. The only way to leave is with no deal which is what the traitorous scum in Parliament should have been preparing for from the start, Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jaymo Posted November 24, 2018 Report Share Posted November 24, 2018 17 minutes ago, JRDS said: A deal is an invention to keep us tied to the EU, never got a mention during the Referendum. The only way to leave is with no deal which is what the traitorous scum in Parliament should have been preparing for from the start, You didn’t have a part in the movie ‘braveheart’ by any chance or was it the gunpowder plot? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
12gauge82 Posted November 24, 2018 Report Share Posted November 24, 2018 It should have been a free trade deal or no deal, what we have proposed at the moment is EU membership by another name, it stinks. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bostonmick Posted November 24, 2018 Report Share Posted November 24, 2018 I voted leave but will say I was never deluded enough to think we would ever really leave in the true sense. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dave-G Posted November 25, 2018 Report Share Posted November 25, 2018 (edited) 9 hours ago, silver pigeon69 said: Is this the Deal?? If so, isn't this what we Leavers wanted?? Am i missing something?? That covers the issues I had for leaving if its true: We decide who we let into our country - and hopefully who we can deport, that UK gets tarriff free trade, no surrender to European Court diktats so we buy and sell goods from and to where we want, we'll be free to rebuild our manufacturing base, and get to decide who takes our fish. But I'm slightly dyslexic and accept that we will have had to give a little in return, but nothing major I hope? Its certainly got us a lot further than 'call me Dave' got. Edited November 25, 2018 by Dave-G Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
scutt Posted November 25, 2018 Report Share Posted November 25, 2018 12 hours ago, Gordon R said: I am curious as to who thinks someone could have got a better deal. It doesn't seem to suit anyone, but if it doesn't get through Parliament, we will leave with no deal. The very same people who said they could have got a better deal will start moaning again. I keep hearing a deal to suit everyone .Why is it not a deal to suit the winners of the vote.. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Newbie to this Posted November 25, 2018 Report Share Posted November 25, 2018 (edited) If ever you need proof that May's so called deal is bad for the UK and good for the EU, then 38 minutes is it. It only took 38 minutes for the EU elite to pass the deal. They still have to put it to a vote but I can't see it not getting passed. Let's just hope that She can't get it through our Parliament. Edited November 25, 2018 by Newbie to this Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TIGHTCHOKE Posted November 25, 2018 Report Share Posted November 25, 2018 (edited) 1 minute ago, Newbie to this said: If ever you need proof that May's so called deal is bad for the UK and good for the EU, then 38 minutes is it. It only took 38 minutes for the EU elite to pass the deal. They still have to put it to a vote but ai can't see it not getting passed. Let's just hope that She can't get it through our Parliament. A very valid point! Edited November 25, 2018 by TIGHTCHOKE Syntax Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jaymo Posted November 25, 2018 Report Share Posted November 25, 2018 Or maybe the reason it “only took 38 mins” is that it’s a motion tabled with all the elements already agreed and hence no last minute amendments required- as stated, they now have to put it to the other 27 nations. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
12gauge82 Posted November 25, 2018 Report Share Posted November 25, 2018 (edited) It's not so much for the temporary deal that's the problem (although even that's a disgrace, as we're giving them billions), the biggest issue is the backstop arrangement that comes in afterwards, it locks us in the single market, allows the EU to interfere with our laws, basically all the things we voted to leave, except with the added twist we could never leave unless the EU agrees, which they obviously never would, it's crazy and a blatant subversion of democracy, what ever happened to "no deal is better than a bad deal"? It's why I've been saying for months on here that I hope we get a hard brexit, I like most on here can see it's the only way we'll ever really leave the EU. Edited November 25, 2018 by 12gauge82 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
panoma1 Posted November 25, 2018 Report Share Posted November 25, 2018 12 hours ago, Gordon R said: I am curious as to who thinks someone could have got a better deal. It doesn't seem to suit anyone, but if it doesn't get through Parliament, we will leave with no deal. The very same people who said they could have got a better deal will start moaning again. You can't do a good deal when the other party don't want to do a deal! Same as you can't hold a strong position when people on your "team" (team U.K.) keep on undermining negotiations and weakening an already weak negotiating position! The EU want our money so don't really want to deal, unless it is as close as they can get to 100% to their advantage, the Labour Party want a general election, so are undermining (refusing to support) negotiations, the remoaners usually have a vested interest in remaining, do not want to leave the EU, so are also undermining negotiations..........everyone wants what they can get out of it! Bloody farce! The democratic vote was leave........the brexiteers just want to leave! should we should just leave and then pick up negotiations on the future relationship with the EU from a stronger position.............when all said and done the UK has things the EU want, just as the EU have things the UK want! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
oowee Posted November 25, 2018 Report Share Posted November 25, 2018 14 hours ago, Gordon R said: I am curious as to who thinks someone could have got a better deal. It doesn't seem to suit anyone, but if it doesn't get through Parliament, we will leave with no deal. The very same people who said they could have got a better deal will start moaning again. Exactly this ^^^ it's hard to think of a deal that works and will keep everyone or anyone happy. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JohnfromUK Posted November 25, 2018 Report Share Posted November 25, 2018 1 hour ago, Newbie to this said: It only took 38 minutes for the EU elite to pass the deal. That is unsurprising; the (free) bar was open. Seriously - it is 'pre-approved' by Angela Merkel and Emmanuel Macron - and everyone else does what Juncker, and Tusk tell them, on the basis that it has 'pre-approval' from the big players. NOTHING ever happens in the EU without Merkels approval .... which might not be so unreasonable as they are the biggest contributor to financing the whole set up ...... and have always been close to the French (who might quite reasonably be a bit be frightened of upsetting the Germans for historical reasons?) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Newbie to this Posted November 25, 2018 Report Share Posted November 25, 2018 1 hour ago, oowee said: Exactly this ^^^ it's hard to think of a deal that works and will keep everyone or anyone happy. But the deal doesn't have to keep everyone happy, just those who voted leave and won the democratic vote. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
oowee Posted November 25, 2018 Report Share Posted November 25, 2018 Just now, Newbie to this said: But the deal doesn't have to keep everyone happy, just those who voted leave and won the democratic vote. Why? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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