mel b3 Posted March 17, 2022 Report Share Posted March 17, 2022 As have most people, I've been following events in the Ukraine. I've seen the odd bits and bobs about the financial damage that's been done to Russia, and the Russian people, but , just how badly has the country been damaged ?. Is this a " well be back to normal in five years " thing , or a , " well be back to normal in a generation" thing , or , " Russia is ruined , and will be a third world country forever " thing ?. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Smokersmith Posted March 17, 2022 Report Share Posted March 17, 2022 A lot will depend on who’s leading the country. I fear they’re lost under the current leadership. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
holloway Posted March 17, 2022 Report Share Posted March 17, 2022 26 minutes ago, mel b3 said: As have most people, I've been following events in the Ukraine. I've seen the odd bits and bobs about the financial damage that's been done to Russia, and the Russian people, but , just how badly has the country been damaged ?. Is this a " well be back to normal in five years " thing , or a , " well be back to normal in a generation" thing , or , " Russia is ruined , and will be a third world country forever " thing ?. Good question interested to know. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mel b3 Posted March 17, 2022 Author Report Share Posted March 17, 2022 At the moment, it appears that the Russian people are suffering ( mainly) from financial damage , but how long might it take before they run out of food and start rioting , and putin is turning his troops on his own people?. He can't put all of them in prison . Most of the poor xxxx don't even know what's going on . Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JohnfromUK Posted March 17, 2022 Report Share Posted March 17, 2022 (edited) Interesting contribution from Arnold Swartzenegger (link to video in Evening Standard article) https://www.standard.co.uk/news/world/arnold-schwarzenegger-russia-ukraine-war-appeal-b988850.html Edited March 17, 2022 by JohnfromUK Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dave-G Posted March 17, 2022 Report Share Posted March 17, 2022 I think they'll still have Chinese and other buyers for their gas, oil and wheat etc so they'll get by but I also think the military capability has lost a lot of cred and won't be seen as such a formidable foe in future. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Smokersmith Posted March 17, 2022 Report Share Posted March 17, 2022 They’ll be fine as long as they want to live an Eastern Block style of life … Russia has a huge amount of resources and won’t run out soon. It’s those exposed to a Western culture who will feel it most … that pipeline is well and truly off for the foreseeable future. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rewulf Posted March 17, 2022 Report Share Posted March 17, 2022 Its not like they havent been in the wilderness before, in soviet times they still managed to exist , and grow , population wise. The financial hit isnt quite the permanent devastating blow its made out to be . 1 minute ago, Smokersmith said: It’s those exposed to a Western culture who will feel it most … that pipeline is well and truly off for the foreseeable future. Nordstream 1 is still pumping that gas , and Northern Europe is still buying it, pipe 2 will be finished and start pumping too, the greed of the oil companies will see to that. Theres also the pipes that come across Ukraine, a prime target that no one seems to want to go for ? Money speaks a lot louder than you think , and whatever Russia has done , or will do , will soon be forgotten about when those revenue streams need reopening. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
oowee Posted March 17, 2022 Report Share Posted March 17, 2022 38 minutes ago, Rewulf said: I Money speaks a lot louder than you think , and whatever Russia has done , or will do , will soon be forgotten about when those revenue streams need reopening. I did think that at the outset but I am seeing some very valuable (tax) assets disappearing from Russia for at least ten years with structures being physically removed. This is hurting be in no doubt. That said I am sure our resolve will not endure. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Smokersmith Posted March 17, 2022 Report Share Posted March 17, 2022 @Rewulf I was referring to the pipeline of Western culture .. not gas! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ditchman Posted March 17, 2022 Report Share Posted March 17, 2022 i think this "war" has been instructional ........... Tank is no longer king..at best it is a mobile gun now...ie target practice for drones....i would not want to be joining a tank regiment knowing what i know now drones are the way forward....targeting remote controlled assets.... im surprised at the Russian army....it is so last season now Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NoBodyImportant Posted March 17, 2022 Report Share Posted March 17, 2022 6 hours ago, mel b3 said: As have most people, I've been following events in the Ukraine. I've seen the odd bits and bobs about the financial damage that's been done to Russia, and the Russian people, but , just how badly has the country been damaged ?. Is this a " well be back to normal in five years " thing , or a , " well be back to normal in a generation" thing , or , " Russia is ruined , and will be a third world country forever " thing ?. Russia has vast resources, it exports everything and imports very little from the west. Most everything imported comes from China and India. Europe needs Russian much more then Russia needs Europe. Russia has millions of acres of farmland and the fuel to harvest, they are the largest producers of fertilizer in the world. They can trade with China next door. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
team tractor Posted March 17, 2022 Report Share Posted March 17, 2022 The uk is running out of birch ply and 30% of its softwood is from Russia . It’s going to destroy the building industry here. remember how much wood is in the roof rafters and lathe , walls , joists , doors etc . It’s going to kill us too . Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mice! Posted March 17, 2022 Report Share Posted March 17, 2022 22 minutes ago, team tractor said: The uk is running out of birch ply and 30% of its softwood is from Russia . It’s going to destroy the building industry here. remember how much wood is in the roof rafters and lathe , walls , joists , doors etc . It’s going to kill us too . Prices will rise even more until the stock runs out. 1 hour ago, NoBodyImportant said: Russia has vast resources, it exports everything and imports very little from the west. Most everything imported comes from China and India. Europe needs Russian much more then Russia needs Europe. Russia has millions of acres of farmland and the fuel to harvest, they are the largest producers of fertilizer in the world. They can trade with China next door. This is it, everyone talks about sanctions, but what effect will they have?? Europe will be hit harder by not buying from Russia. And threatening China? Imagine if China decided not to sell to Europe or the States just for a month, it would be panic Stations. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NoBodyImportant Posted March 18, 2022 Report Share Posted March 18, 2022 2 hours ago, Mice! said: Prices will rise even more until the stock runs out. This is it, everyone talks about sanctions, but what effect will they have?? Europe will be hit harder by not buying from Russia. And threatening China? Imagine if China decided not to sell to Europe or the States just for a month, it would be panic Stations. Exactly, when Biden canceled the Canadian oil pipeline. The Canadian government shut down logging on federal land. Basically because if the USA didn’t want Canadian oil then we didn’t want Canadian timber. Wood is stupid expensive now. Plywood went from $6 dollars a sheet to $87. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Robden Posted March 18, 2022 Report Share Posted March 18, 2022 13 hours ago, Dave-G said: I think they'll still have Chinese and other buyers for their gas, oil and wheat etc so they'll get by but I also think the military capability has lost a lot of cred and won't be seen as such a formidable foe in future. I think their HUGE nuclear arsenal is enough to keep anyone on their toes. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
oldypigeonpopper Posted March 18, 2022 Report Share Posted March 18, 2022 15 hours ago, mel b3 said: At the moment, it appears that the Russian people are suffering ( mainly) from financial damage , but how long might it take before they run out of food and start rioting , and putin is turning his troops on his own people?. He can't put all of them in prison . Most of the poor xxxx don't even know what's going on . Hello, or they deny bombing the theatre as on a news report, saying it's fake news 8 hours ago, team tractor said: The uk is running out of birch ply and 30% of its softwood is from Russia . It’s going to destroy the building industry here. remember how much wood is in the roof rafters and lathe , walls , joists , doors etc . It’s going to kill us too . Hello, it's not only timber that's affecting the building industry, Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JohnfromUK Posted March 18, 2022 Report Share Posted March 18, 2022 2 minutes ago, oldypigeonpopper said: saying it's fake news It is a line they (and the rest of us) have been repeatedly fed - very notably by the Americans via Donald Trump. In many cases (i.e. American Presidential Election) - history has recorded that those calling fake - were in fact the fakers! Basically -'news' is not reliable - wherever it is peddled. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rewulf Posted March 18, 2022 Report Share Posted March 18, 2022 16 hours ago, Smokersmith said: I was referring to the pipeline of Western culture .. not gas! A re read made that clear Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Agriv8 Posted March 18, 2022 Report Share Posted March 18, 2022 Russia is a net exporter so it exports more than it imports so sanctions are only going to go so far. the lack of fertiliser and grains for Russia and Ukraine is going to make farming and food production in Europe Very hard costs are predicted to rise. stock markets are starting to predict doom and gloom as most of us tighten our belts due to food increases and fuel bills even Bank of England are ahead of the game increasing interest rates (usually after the horse has bolted ) All in all I think Putin does not give a damn the only way I can see putin starting to listen if they manage to devalue the Russian currency to be worthless but this would lead him to going cap in hand to china who would do a deal for there steel and fuel. No easy solution as far as I can see Agriv8 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Raja Clavata Posted March 18, 2022 Report Share Posted March 18, 2022 Not being helped by opportunism from the likes of India. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mice! Posted March 18, 2022 Report Share Posted March 18, 2022 52 minutes ago, Raja Clavata said: Not being helped by opportunism from the likes of India. If that's the case then they should be sanctioned as well, or stop sending them aid, they should tow the line. Not a lot of point in western countries trying to squeeze Putin if others are happy to help him out. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rewulf Posted March 18, 2022 Report Share Posted March 18, 2022 3 hours ago, Raja Clavata said: Not being helped by opportunism from the likes of India. 2 hours ago, Mice! said: If that's the case then they should be sanctioned as well, or stop sending them aid, they should tow the line. Best tell Europe that too then , as they are still pumping Russian gas in. And maybe India doesnt want to get involved in a conflict that it considers none of its business ? Its an interesting facet of this whole thing , that Ukraine stopped buying gas from Russia back in 2015, although they have some themselves, they instead top up from the EUs gas reserves, but where does the EU get these reserves ? Russia. Russian gas and oil travels through Ukraine in pipes, and it would be a major economic blow to Russia if something were to happen to those pipes..... Yet nothing so far has come near them. https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-60638255 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rewulf Posted March 18, 2022 Report Share Posted March 18, 2022 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NoBodyImportant Posted March 18, 2022 Report Share Posted March 18, 2022 7 hours ago, JohnfromUK said: It is a line they (and the rest of us) have been repeatedly fed - very notably by the Americans via Donald Trump. In many cases (i.e. American Presidential Election) - history has recorded that those calling fake - were in fact the fakers! Basically -'news' is not reliable - wherever it is peddled. Yep, the the common trend is for news outlets to repeatedly and loudly pander fake news for months then offer a correction on the back page year later. A good example is Hunter Biden’s laptop with all the photos of him with hookers and emails linking the Biden’s to the Ukrain scandals. They claimed it was fake and didn’t exist and then in the middle of a Ukrainian invasion the New York Times quietly admitted it was real. But of course the Biden’s can’t be investigated because the Ukrainian is a war zone. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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