Car performance

[oowee]

When I started with cars the dolomite sprint was held up as something of a god when we were talking about performance. Growing up in Coventry i longed to own an XJ6 or to even see the likes of a Talbot Sunbeam Lotus on the road.

Now I come to renew my wife's car and I cannot believe the power and performance of some of the everyday cars. A small and pretty innocuous 4x4 putting out 250hp. I cannot believe that the average motorists needs or wants such power levels in ordinary cars. 

[JKD]

You were so wrapped up in your disbelief, you posted in the wrong section 🙄 😆🤣

[oowee]

🤣 ooops hopefully those that can will relocate.

[Gordon R]

My eldest has a few cars, but his Mercedes EQC400 knocks out 400bhp at the wheels, which my friends in the trade tell me equates to 500bhp under the bonnet.

[oowee]

4 minutes ago, Gordon R said:

My eldest has a few cars, but his Mercedes EQC400 knocks out 400bhp at the wheels, which my friends in the trade tell me equates to 500bhp under the bonnet.

Its simply unreal. A friend of mine just bought a range rover and she tells me its good for 60 in under 6 seconds!!!!! It must weigh 2.5 tons. Why it makes no sense. 

 

[Gordon R]

The biggest problem is that few people can handle the power of the cars they buy. A relative worked at Mercedes and went on one of their racing days. They got to drive quick AMG models. The instructors said that Mercedes offered driving lessons to those who bought top performing cars. Very, very few accepted the offer, but large chunk of the cars were back at Mercedes within a couple of weeks, having been crashed.

[JTaylor91]

BMW M2 Competition here. Fettled with a little bit and runs around 530 BHP. It’s way more than is needed on the road and with power like that the speeds if it all goes wrong tend to be a lot higher. Pre Covid there were relatively “cheap” pcp deals flying around on fast hatchbacks Golf r (310 BHP) BMW M140i (340BHP). Many fell into the hands of late teens early 20s that a high percentage of lack driving experience and still have the “I can’t be killed mentality”. Typing M140i vs/race/drift/street into YouTube brings up many videos of mostly young lads racing around the streets.

[London Best]

All the stupid bhp and “ mine does 0-60 in under…..” is just Willy waving.

[bruno22rf]

10 minutes ago, London Best said:

All the stupid bhp and “ mine does 0-60 in under…..” is just Willy waving.

Agree, but sometimes it's fun. SIL had a M4? M Sport and it would burble along nicely at UK speed limits but hit the fun pedal and all hell would break loose, cheap thrill till you get the bill for servicing and tyres.

[TOPGUN749]

There is a constant market for more power and speed,and while some can afford it manufacturers will keep producing.

Edited December 9 by TOPGUN749

[Poor Shot]

The argument proposed by a few on the thread is equal to a motorist with a passing interest in shooting asking why one would ever bother to own anything other than a £50 70's era Spanish SxS given they all do the same thing and having anything more is just posturing. 

Some things are just nice to own and having a car with more of anything than you may otherwise need can be exactly that to some. Similarly owning an expensive, hand engraved pair of old english guns with a £100k price tag can also be a nice thing to own. 

Do I need a near 3 ton land rover with a big diesel engine? I don't have any kids and seldom use the spare front seat never mind the 6 others that are available but I get enjoyment from using it and it is useful when it's my turn to drive to shoots and we're 4 up with guns, kit and dogs. I could put that all into a 90's transit van and drive around with a huge chip on my shoulder at all those 'wasting' money on nice cars but I don't have to and don't want to. I could also trade in the diesel land rover for a 5 litre supercharged range rover and get similar enjoyment from its use but I won't because I like the land rover. It's a good balance between running costs and practicality. 

Folks would do well to enjoy what they have rather than having an opinion on what others have and enjoy. 

Edited December 9 by Poor Shot

[jall25]

7 hours ago, bruno22rf said:

Agree, but sometimes it's fun. SIL had a M4? M Sport and it would burble along nicely at UK speed limits but hit the fun pedal and all hell would break loose, cheap thrill till you get the bill for servicing and tyres.

 

Had many M4 s - loved them too !

[JohnfromUK]

On 08/12/2024 at 22:14, oowee said:

When I started with cars the dolomite sprint was held up as something of a god when we were talking about performance. Growing up in Coventry i longed to own an XJ6 or to even see the likes of a Talbot Sunbeam Lotus on the road.

Now I come to renew my wife's car and I cannot believe the power and performance of some of the everyday cars. A small and pretty innocuous 4x4 putting out 250hp. I cannot believe that the average motorists needs or wants such power levels in ordinary cars. 

A I had a Dolomite Sprint in around 1980 and an XJ (Daimler Double Six) around 1984 and kept for about 12 years.  Both were good cars in the time, the Double Six/XJ12 being exceptionally so if you got a reliable one, which luckily I did.  I have had a small selection of other 'sporty' cars from BMW and Mercedes since.  I tend to keep cars that 'tick the box' for me a long time, the Daimler being with me for around 12 years and the recent BMW 335D estate for 16 years.

Now I'm nearer 70 than 65 - I drive a Toyota (and of course my old 30 year old Defender).

[Gordon R]

Poor Shot - a decent summary. 

[Wylye]

When I used to work for a living I was given a 2.0 Sierra GLS for a company car. It produced 125bhp and was as quick as anything else on the road. My current Mercedes C Class diesel has a 2 litre engine and produces about 200 bhp and would leave the Sierra standing. I had a petrol/hybrid C Class courtesy car last week and it produced 300 bhp! I really don't see the point but its not going to change anytime soon I'm afraid while we still enjoy the thrill of driving fast cars.

[Rewulf]

3 hours ago, Wylye said:

When I used to work for a living I was given a 2.0 Sierra GLS for a company car. It produced 125bhp and was as quick as anything else on the road. My current Mercedes C Class diesel has a 2 litre engine and produces about 200 bhp and would leave the Sierra standing. I had a petrol/hybrid C Class courtesy car last week and it produced 300 bhp! I really don't see the point but its not going to change anytime soon I'm afraid while we still enjoy the thrill of driving fast cars.

Im not disputing what youre saying, but we do need to factor in another aspect of modern cars, weight.

Your Sierra likely weighed in at a tonne, the C class Merc can be from 1.5  to 2 tonnes, a modern 4x4 like the Amarok, 3 tonnes.
Even modern small cars like a Peugeot 208 exceed a tonne, there just so much more metal and gadgetry.

[Gordon R]

My youngest lad used to have a Escort Turbo in the mid 1990s and it felt rapid, compared to my wife's Cosworth. Then again, it weighed next to nothing and was unpleasantly fast in the wet.

Rewulf's point about weight is very valid. Loads of electric motors for four windows, side impact bars, far more sturdy seats, bigger wheels and wider tyres etc - all adding to overall weight.

[oowee]

48 minutes ago, Gordon R said:

My youngest lad used to have a Escort Turbo in the mid 1990s and it felt rapid, compared to my wife's Cosworth. Then again, it weighed next to nothing and was unpleasantly fast in the wet.

Rewulf's point about weight is very valid. Loads of electric motors for four windows, side impact bars, far more sturdy seats, bigger wheels and wider tyres etc - all adding to overall weight.

I remember my first drive of an ordinary escort 1300 after my toledo thinking it was fast. 🙂 

As you say weight is the killer I think my mg maestro 2.0l was quick (back then) at 110hp but it likely weighed a lot less. Its also expectation of speed. A doli sprint was 60 in 8.6 seconds and was at the time pretty awesome but now such performance would be average / ordinary not worthy of mention. Having driven a hilux pickup for years I can honestly say I had no need of even that level of performance. Now some of the cars come with power that, in my wifes case, will never be used. 

 

[Northerner]

As has been said the modern cars are lot heavier due to the extra comfort and safety features. So they need the extra power otherwise you will see them struggle to get up a decent hill. Me well i've just had my golf remapped to get it to 224bhp with an extra ~40nm of torque. Why? well the extra mpg on a long drive plus, safety. It allows me to get around all the slow dodderers on the roads in cornwall. It does also put more of a smile on my face 🤣 It has totally changed the feel of the car

I suppose you've got to be a car person to understand. Years ago I had a mate out in oz LS swap his 80 series for a lot of money. I really couldn't understand why right until i drove it. Then i wanted it 😎

[amateur]

If you want to look at the effect of power/weight ratio, when I was a youngster, I bought an engineless B65 Berkeley, its lightweight body made of glass fibre and aluminium, and which normally had a 328cc Excelsior two-stroke engine.

Having read that Berkeley also built a B105 model, which had a 700cc Royal Enfield engine, and having a spare RE 700 engine in the garage, being young and stupid, and believing that this would be a surefire way to attract impressionable young ladies, I decided to stuff the 700 motor into the B65, not realising that the Berkeley model that legitimately had the 700 motor was built substantially stronger.

The power to weight ratio was excellent and it worked, but imagine driving a cornflake packet with a socking great twin-cylinder engine up front. The acceleration was phenomenal, and even the braking OK.

It did lack the most important characteristic, however.

My future wife refused to go anywhere near it. 🤣

 

 

[oldypigeonpopper]

Hello, All this talk on super cars, before i passed my car test i had a Del and Rodney super sprinter well not quite 🤔😄

[oowee]

1 hour ago, amateur said:

If you want to look at the effect of power/weight ratio, when I was a youngster, I bought an engineless B65 Berkeley, its lightweight body made of glass fibre and aluminium, and which normally had a 328cc Excelsior two-stroke engine.

Having read that Berkeley also built a B105 model, which had a 700cc Royal Enfield engine, and having a spare RE 700 engine in the garage, being young and stupid, and believing that this would be a surefire way to attract impressionable young ladies, I decided to stuff the 700 motor into the B65, not realising that the Berkeley model that legitimately had the 700 motor was built substantially stronger.

The power to weight ratio was excellent and it worked, but imagine driving a cornflake packet with a socking great twin-cylinder engine up front. The acceleration was phenomenal, and even the braking OK.

It did lack the most important characteristic, however.

My future wife refused to go anywhere near it. 🤣

 

 

🤣 

 

1 hour ago, oldypigeonpopper said:

Hello, All this talk on super cars, before i passed my car test i had a Del and Rodney super sprinter well not quite 🤔😄

What was that? The only person I knew to have a 3 wheeler was my uncle. He always had bikes but a horse jumped on top of him when he was riding. After that a three wheeler was the only way forward. 

[oldypigeonpopper]

1 hour ago, oowee said:

🤣

 

What was that? The only person I knew to have a 3 wheeler was my uncle. He always had bikes but a horse jumped on top of him when he was riding. After that a three wheeler was the only way forward. 

Hello, Reliant Robin 🤔😄

[Dave-G]

Father bought a 3 wheel Heinkle bubble car for my older brother to use which could be used on a motorcycle learner licence to go out on minor electrical installation work on farms. The front of the car opened forwards which also moved the steering column to one side to aid entry.

[shaun4860]

All those saying the power is too much should be careful what they wish for.

It’s a slippery slope to whoever is in power to take heed and restrict everyone to 100hp.

I then await the complaints.

If your car has too much power then simply buy a less powerful one rather than complain about the power 🤷🏻‍♂️