Asking for shooting on first post

[marsh man]

1 hour ago, 7daysinaweek said:

Spot on advice with the beating MM

I have picked up a good few bits of shooting over the years from beating and it has many times opened doors both short and long term. Myself and another PW contributor regularly travel to a shoot to beat and it is a 140 mile round trip approx for the both of us but we come from different directions and can sometimes take up to four hours travel a day. I can get beating closer to home but it gets you a odd day pigeon shooting and is great company and wonderful just getting out. 

If my days off allow around my hectic shift work I will get out and travel.

atb

7diaw

 

The beaters around are way are very well after on most of the well known shoots , the days pay is from £25 up to £40 with drinks and food at mid morning and at dinner time , most of them have a least one beaters day and many will have two , you would be expected to turn up on at least half of the shoots to be invited on a beaters day , some of the bigger shoots like the one I help on will also have four Saturdays in February to go roost shooting , there is a small charge for your permit and the money will go to a charity or somebody who is falling on hard times through illness or a member of there family is ill .

While I was at work I would enquire from the keeper to give me the shoot dates as soon as they have sorted the dates out , I would then put them on the calender and inform my boss for a days holiday on each shoot that was during a working day , this worked well as I worked on the estate but I would still need to take a days holiday unless it was on a Saturday.

This is one of the best ways to get your first foot on the ladder but even so , you would still need to make a long term commitment and not let to many things get in the way like family , work and the distance to and from the shoot , 

[The gouse]

10 minutes ago, marsh man said:

The beaters around are way are very well after on most of the well known shoots , the days pay is from £25 up to £40 with drinks and food at mid morning and at dinner time , most of them have a least one beaters day and many will have two , you would be expected to turn up on at least half of the shoots to be invited on a beaters day , some of the bigger shoots like the one I help on will also have four Saturdays in February to go roost shooting , there is a small charge for your permit and the money will go to a charity or somebody who is falling on hard times through illness or a member of there family is ill .

While I was at work I would enquire from the keeper to give me the shoot dates as soon as they have sorted the dates out , I would then put them on the calender and inform my boss for a days holiday on each shoot that was during a working day , this worked well as I worked on the estate but I would still need to take a days holiday unless it was on a Saturday.

This is one of the best ways to get your first foot on the ladder but even so , you would still need to make a long term commitment and not let to many things get in the way like family , work and the distance to and from the shoot , 

MM

Are shoot could never afford £40 a day for beaters. With the beaters and pickers up that would be £800 a shoot. 

We just can  offer good food drink pigeon shooting and a good beaters day.  

But also this season one of are guns gave 3 beaters a days dear shooting they shot 15 yes 15 between them. 

 

[Walker570]

2 hours ago, Zapp said:

It might be a bit clumsy to go straight in with an ask but like a lot of mildly annoying things in life it can be ignored easily enough.

We used to have a minimum post count but then all we got was people with nothing better to do questioning the validity of those posts.  We also had a period with a little clique who would try to shove new members around whatever they posted, leading to a lot not coming back, so we just did away with it and instead ask everyone to just act like grown ups.

 

 

Spot on.  I just ignore such and move on. IF the new poster is genuinley interested in joining in the forum activities he/she will come up again, if not in my view they are just using the site for their own ends. I am a moderator on another forum and we occasionally get one shot wonders trying to sell goods, services and hunting. Very easy to spot and they disappear very quickly.

 

[7daysinaweek]

30 minutes ago, marsh man said:

The beaters around are way are very well after on most of the well known shoots , the days pay is from £25 up to £40 with drinks and food at mid morning and at dinner time , most of them have a least one beaters day and many will have two , you would be expected to turn up on at least half of the shoots to be invited on a beaters day , some of the bigger shoots like the one I help on will also have four Saturdays in February to go roost shooting , there is a small charge for your permit and the money will go to a charity or somebody who is falling on hard times through illness or a member of there family is ill .

While I was at work I would enquire from the keeper to give me the shoot dates as soon as they have sorted the dates out , I would then put them on the calender and inform my boss for a days holiday on each shoot that was during a working day , this worked well as I worked on the estate but I would still need to take a days holiday unless it was on a Saturday.

This is one of the best ways to get your first foot on the ladder but even so , you would still need to make a long term commitment and not let to many things get in the way like family , work and the distance to and from the shoot , 

The permit scheme sounds like a grand thing with the monies going for good use, I really do like that! Due of greater commitments in the last 15 months, some out of my immediate control I have not been able to get out as much as I once used too in many areas. At present and in the the coming year I am making plans to change some of these commitments  so giving me a little more time.

You cannot beat a bit of roost shooting, I have removed more branches than birds in my case but great being out. I live in the hope that I may one day retire and have the health to pursue such days with a lot more impetus. For the present I am fortunate to get what I can but as you say you need to put the work in.

 

atb

7diaw

 

[storm in a teacup]

I beat regularly on both syndicate days and let days on a good local shoot, I have done for the last 5 years. None of the beaters get any pay or a beaters day. I also help the keeper looking after the birds and a bit of trapping throughout the year. I really enjoy it but it hasn't led me or any of the other beaters to firing a single shot on the shoot or any other permissions. 

[JDog]

5 minutes ago, storm in a teacup said:

I beat regularly on both syndicate days and let days on a good local shoot, I have done for the last 5 years. None of the beaters get any pay or a beaters day. I also help the keeper looking after the birds and a bit of trapping throughout the year. I really enjoy it but it hasn't led me or any of the other beaters to firing a single shot on the shoot or any other permissions. 

So what do you get out of it then?

[storm in a teacup]

Day out beating, helping out with the birds a good laugh with the other beaters. Better than sitting at home

[old'un]

26 minutes ago, storm in a teacup said:

I beat regularly on both syndicate days and let days on a good local shoot, I have done for the last 5 years. None of the beaters get any pay or a beaters day. I also help the keeper looking after the birds and a bit of trapping throughout the year. I really enjoy it but it hasn't led me or any of the other beaters to firing a single shot on the shoot or any other permissions. 

When I was younger I did a far bit of beating on small and large estates, I got paid and got beaters days on most, seems a bit mean to not offer a beaters day or at least some shooting, and to top it all you don’t get paid, you may well enjoy what you do but I would be asking the keeper for some shooting or looking for another shoot.   

[Blackpowder]

1 hour ago, storm in a teacup said:

I beat regularly on both syndicate days and let days on a good local shoot, I have done for the last 5 years. None of the beaters get any pay or a beaters day. I also help the keeper looking after the birds and a bit of trapping throughout the year. I really enjoy it but it hasn't led me or any of the other beaters to firing a single shot on the shoot or any other permissions. 

Good that you enjoy helping but I feel the Shoot owner is taking a liberty in neither paying beaters nor giving any shooting in return for hard work.

 

Blackpowder

[Walker570]

Yep, agree with above comments. Think it is very mean not to give some return for your efforts BUT if your happy and enjoying life so be it.

 

[marsh man]

2 hours ago, The gouse said:

MM

Are shoot could never afford £40 a day for beaters. With the beaters and pickers up that would be £800 a shoot. 

We just can  offer good food drink pigeon shooting and a good beaters day.  

But also this season one of are guns gave 3 beaters a days dear shooting they shot 15 yes 15 between them. 

 

On most days at this time of the year there are more shoots than beaters available and good beaters are well sought after , at the end of the day you go where you are looked after and the shoots like to maintain the same people , if they are long standing they know all the drives , the flanks know what to do and when to do it and you can rely on the older ones who are detailed to be stops, this all help to run a well maintained and friendly shoot 

The average pay is £25 / £30 in your pocket , drivers get a bit more and the chaps who pick up are the top payers , the shoot that pay there beaters £40 pay it to cover any tax issues , although I know one or two of them and they have never heard from the tax man .

All our beaters / drivers and the picker ups have to sign for there pay but as far as I know it don't go any further than the office.

 

[The gouse]

5 minutes ago, marsh man said:

On most days at this time of the year there are more shoots than beaters available and good beaters are well sought after , at the end of the day you go where you are looked after and the shoots like to maintain the same people , if they are long standing they know all the drives , the flanks know what to do and when to do it and you can rely on the older ones who are detailed to be stops, this all help to run a well maintained and friendly shoot 

The average pay is £25 / £30 in your pocket , drivers get a bit more and the chaps who pick up are the top payers , the shoot that pay there beaters £40 pay it to cover any tax issues , although I know one or two of them and they have never heard from the tax man .

All our beaters / drivers and the picker ups have to sign for there pay but as far as I know it don't go any further than the office.

 

MM,

you are spot on with what you say the good beaters know the drives and how it works. These are the one’s that do all the vermin control. I’ve give them all two days on a peg. But we just can’t pay £30/£40 for each beater. We are not a  commercial  shoot like you beat on. But we still put 80/100 days on.

you tell me when your beaters have been invited to a cull deer and get 15 in one day.

 

[Tford]

5 hours ago, Zapp said:

It might be a bit clumsy to go straight in with an ask but like a lot of mildly annoying things in life it can be ignored easily enough.

We used to have a minimum post count but then all we got was people with nothing better to do questioning the validity of those posts.  We also had a period with a little clique who would try to shove new members around whatever they posted, leading to a lot not coming back, so we just did away with it and instead ask everyone to just act like grown ups.

 

 

Grown ups?! There's hopeful thinking 😁

[Zapp]

59 minutes ago, Tford said:

Grown ups?! There's hopeful thinking 😁

I'm testing my theory that the power of positive thinking is a myth.  So far so good.

[marsh man]

36 minutes ago, The gouse said:

MM,

you are spot on with what you say the good beaters know the drives and how it works. These are the one’s that do all the vermin control. I’ve give them all two days on a peg. But we just can’t pay £30/£40 for each beater. We are not a  commercial  shoot like you beat on. But we still put 80/100 days on.

you tell me when your beaters have been invited to a cull deer and get 15 in one day.

 

Another shoot I go the guns have the option of supplying there own beater , if they cant then they pay the going rate for a beater . this make the cost of there full gun a bit cheaper , I used to be a half gun and my mate was my other half gun , when it was his day then I beat and vise a versa .

As for deer , I am not into deer and I wouldn't had took part , but that was a very kind offer and one that the chaps who took part would remember it for a very long time to come ,

A few years back before Muntjak were put on the vermin list ,the estate was getting a lot of problems in the new plantations by the increasing numbers of deer , I don't know all the ins and outs but they applied for a licence to cull a certain amount , this they got and they followed all the rules concerning what cartridges to use , I might be wrong but I believe they were triple A , a day was arranged and all the regular beaters were asked , as I didn't want to go I lent two of the beaters my wild fowling guns which were heavy and tightly choked , the day went ahead and they did get just into double figures , these were sold to the dealers for £5 each , as there were still a lot left another day was arranged , just before the day arrived they were told what they were doing was illegal , apparently they were not allowed to drive the deer towards the waiting guns , that was then and today might be different but the day was cancelled and was never re organised .

Now all the deer culling is let to a stalker . 

[hambone]

7 hours ago, Zapp said:

It might be a bit clumsy to go straight in with an ask but like a lot of mildly annoying things in life it can be ignored easily enough.

We used to have a minimum post count but then all we got was people with nothing better to do questioning the validity of those posts.  We also had a period with a little clique who would try to shove new members around whatever they posted, leading to a lot not coming back, so we just did away with it and instead ask everyone to just act like grown ups.

 

 

****** in the wind then 😁

[bang bang birdy]

11 hours ago, Scully said:

I still say the best way to gain ground to shoot on is to get involved with beating. If you can be bothered to travel to shoot then surely you can be bothered to do the same to beat. 

Admittedly landowners I know do get approached now and then, and sometimes it works, but it isn’t common. 

100 % agree

you have to put the effort in and make yourself know to folk before they are going to let you wander round there back garden with your bang stick

[The gouse]

11 minutes ago, marsh man said:

Another shoot I go the guns have the option of supplying there own beater , if they cant then they pay the going rate for a beater . this make the cost of there full gun a bit cheaper , I used to be a half gun and my mate was my other half gun , when it was his day then I beat and vise a versa .

As for deer , I am not into deer and I wouldn't had took part , but that was a very kind offer and one that the chaps who took part would remember it for a very long time to come ,

A few years back before Muntjak were put on the vermin list ,the estate was getting a lot of problems in the new plantations by the increasing numbers of deer , I don't know all the ins and outs but they applied for a licence to cull a certain amount , this they got and they followed all the rules concerning what cartridges to use , I might be wrong but I believe they were triple A , a day was arranged and all the regular beaters were asked , as I didn't want to go I lent two of the beaters my wild fowling guns which were heavy and tightly choked , the day went ahead and they did get just into double figures , these were sold to the dealers for £5 each , as there were still a lot left another day was arranged , just before the day arrived they were told what they were doing was illegal , apparently they were not allowed to drive the deer towards the waiting guns , that was then and today might be different but the day was cancelled and was never re organised .

Now all the deer culling is let to a stalker . 

The deer shooting was an invite from a syndicated gun to cull some deer. These deer where stalked not shot with shot guns mate. What I’m saying we give for there work and have a good lough on the way.

like yourself I could put you on as many geese you could shoot. Not just Canada but grays and pinks. But not on the marsh has you call a marsh. This is wet land peat bogs. I know mate not your seen but if your down my way come have a go at them. They are testing birds that just lough at you. 

 

 

[motty]

11 hours ago, Scully said:

I still say the best way to gain ground to shoot on is to get involved with beating. If you can be bothered to travel to shoot then surely you can be bothered to do the same to beat. 

Admittedly landowners I know do get approached now and then, and sometimes it works, but it isn’t common. 

I agree to a small extent, but around where I am, gamekeepers might only let you shoot on the ground for roost shooting or maize cover shooting. Some game keepers don't want anyone on the ground at all, and some farmers are fine with this. I have always knocked on doors or found farmers here and there.

[Jason_ox]

We have a syndicate run on our farm, all the beaters who shoot are allowed pigeon shooting after season, all they have to do is ring one of us up beforehand to get the go ahead. They also get a beaters day and a walked up day if they want to. A couple of guns and beaters have used our land to gain FAC. I’d be positive that in the 5 years of the shoot running  we have never had a phone call for pigeon shooting and the guys who got FAC grants have possibly showed up a handful of times and have never been out at night for fox. Needless to say that we probably won’t be signing anyone’s renewals! Goes to show that even when they get permissions some don’t put any effort in to keep it. 

[strimmer_13]

Beaters on my old shoot would get £20 a day, £25 if you were picking up, and a day walked up at the end of the season for cock/drake birds only. We had some hard working and bloody skilled beaters. Any that stayed on (as you could tell which ones were there to see if it was for them, and go home as soon as they got paid, nearly running to their cars!) if they gave me a hand racking and stacking the birds which used to take me a hour on my own, id chuck an extra £10-20 each depending how many stayed on. They got extra pest control and braces from me, and they took me out with them. Unfortunately the owner was a tit and knew how to lose good beaters every year. 

[oldypigeonpopper]

10 hours ago, Jason_ox said:

We have a syndicate run on our farm, all the beaters who shoot are allowed pigeon shooting after season, all they have to do is ring one of us up beforehand to get the go ahead. They also get a beaters day and a walked up day if they want to. A couple of guns and beaters have used our land to gain FAC. I’d be positive that in the 5 years of the shoot running  we have never had a phone call for pigeon shooting and the guys who got FAC grants have possibly showed up a handful of times and have never been out at night for fox. Needless to say that we probably won’t be signing anyone’s renewals! Goes to show that even when they get permissions some don’t put any effort in to keep it. 

hello, that is interesting Jason, if the 2 guns and beaters who gained their FAC  with your kind permission and references for vermin control  and then do not bother to go night foxing etc what was their purpose ? would the have gained an open ticket on first application? i gained my FAC with the help from a farming family i have known for years and a sheep farm and try and visit 2 nights a week through out the year or when they contact, more so in lambing season, i also check the fences around the fields so he knows to fix if required. i think it is the least i can do for letting me continue shooting with rifle and enjoy being out in the fields

[strimmer_13]

11 minutes ago, oldypigeonpopper said:

hello, that is interesting Jason, if the 2 guns and beaters who gained their FAC  with your kind permission and references for vermin control  and then do not bother to go night foxing etc what was their purpose ? would the have gained an open ticket on first application? i gained my FAC with the help from a farming family i have known for years and a sheep farm and try and visit 2 nights a week through out the year or when they contact, more so in lambing season, i also check the fences around the fields so he knows to fix if required. i think it is the least i can do for letting me continue shooting with rifle and enjoy being out in the fields

I doubt very much they gained an open licence straight off. I took years and that was under supervision. Different forces use different rules I suppose. Hell they weren't happy for me applying for .243 and made me have .223 (along with rimfires) Made no sense to me.

[oldypigeonpopper]

3 minutes ago, strimmer_13 said:

I doubt very much they gained an open licence straight off. I took years and that was under supervision. Different forces use different rules I suppose. Hell they weren't happy for me applying for .243 and made me have .223 (along with rimfires) Made no sense to me.

hello, that is what i was thinking, i gained my FAC with 2 farms yet only ever shoot rifle on 1 as i mentioned, on my licence it states i am allowed to shoot on land with permission and that has been checked out by TVP, not sure if mine is open but happy with using my 22 L/R on the small farm,  

[Scully]

13 hours ago, motty said:

I agree to a small extent, but around where I am, gamekeepers might only let you shoot on the ground for roost shooting or maize cover shooting. Some game keepers don't want anyone on the ground at all, and some farmers are fine with this. I have always knocked on doors or found farmers here and there.

I know what you’re saying, but rather than shooting on keepered land ( which we don’t do either unless asked as in the example I gave ) what I meant other than that, was the chance to meet other like minded people who form part of the beating and picking up teams. Most of them will shoot somewhere and getting to know them ( and they you ) has the potential to open up many doors. 

I get invites to shoot from other beaters , and two folk in the syndicate I’m in have come beating after keeper asked if I knew anyone else who would be interested, and as a result both have the opportunity for a fabulous keepers day they wouldn’t otherwise have had. Beating opens many doors in my experience.