Any landlords on here?

[eddoakley]

Ever ask yourself why you bother?

Doesn't it just seem like everything is against you?

Bit of a rant....

Don't own loads of houses, just a few that I've managed to buy over the last 20 years. Often things just plod along and I collect the rent and do what I need.

Recently I had cause to review several rents. I was way below market value so they had to go up.

Some understood and took it ok when they checked and realised that they would still be on a good deal.

Then the fun starts. 2 sets of tenants decide they can't afford the increase so we're given notice.

6 months notice!! That's now the law here in Wales. Originally changed to 6 months from 2 "due to covid" but now it's permanent.

Both sets of tenants were claiming housing benefit (or whatever it's called now) and both applied to council for housing. Both decided to stop paying rent or at least not pay properly. Both told me that they were advised by council to do that and to stay where they were, even though one hadn't lived at the property for 4 years, only visiting every few weeks.

6 months after the notice was given I get council harassing me to allow further time as they didn't have anything suitable for them and if I went to court it would just cost me more. Eventually got both sets out with promises of some reimbursement from council.

They have now refused.

Couple of weeks ago had to give notice to another tenant. Also claiming. She's already decided that she now doesn't have to pay any rent and is actually going on holiday next week using my rent money.

Nothing at all can be done. Council will back her right up until 6 months and then threaten me over how much court will cost if I don't give her more free time.

 

I despair. I feel like throwing the towel in and and selling up.

Try to build something and continual new rules, regulations and costs just break it down constantly.

Sorry. Just a rant.

 

Edd

[Lloyd90]

I would take them to court / bailiffs for the owed back rent. 
 

Even if they can’t pay it all, a CCJ against them would knacker future applications / credit checks etc. 

 

It’s not like they couldn’t afford to keep paying the rent during the notice period, if it is as you describe then they have just decided to pocket the money themselves instead of paying. 

[ditchman]

5 minutes ago, eddoakley said:

Ever ask yourself why you bother?

Doesn't it just seem like everything is against you?

Bit of a rant....

Don't own loads of houses, just a few that I've managed to buy over the last 20 years. Often things just plod along and I collect the rent and do what I need.

Recently I had cause to review several rents. I was way below market value so they had to go up.

Some understood and took it ok when they checked and realised that they would still be on a good deal.

Then the fun starts. 2 sets of tenants decide they can't afford the increase so we're given notice.

6 months notice!! That's now the law here in Wales. Originally changed to 6 months from 2 "due to covid" but now it's permanent.

Both sets of tenants were claiming housing benefit (or whatever it's called now) and both applied to council for housing. Both decided to stop paying rent or at least not pay properly. Both told me that they were advised by council to do that and to stay where they were, even though one hadn't lived at the property for 4 years, only visiting every few weeks.

6 months after the notice was given I get council harassing me to allow further time as they didn't have anything suitable for them and if I went to court it would just cost me more. Eventually got both sets out with promises of some reimbursement from council.

They have now refused.

Couple of weeks ago had to give notice to another tenant. Also claiming. She's already decided that she now doesn't have to pay any rent and is actually going on holiday next week using my rent money.

Nothing at all can be done. Council will back her right up until 6 months and then threaten me over how much court will cost if I don't give her more free time.

 

I despair. I feel like throwing the towel in and and selling up.

Try to build something and continual new rules, regulations and costs just break it down constantly.

Sorry. Just a rant.

 

Edd

i was refused two tenancies..........because i had no credit history...(got no credit card)    and wouldnt accept years in advance rent with a cheque........

i cant tell you how difficult it has been to rent somewhere..and offering to pay a year in advance.....

 

figure that one out

 

[Lloyd90]

3 minutes ago, ditchman said:

i was refused two tenancies..........because i had no credit history...(got no credit card)    and wouldnt accept years in advance rent with a cheque........

i cant tell you how difficult it has been to rent somewhere..and offering to pay a year in advance.....

 

figure that one out

 

It seems a lot of estate agents take the fees but don’t seem to do proper back ground / credit checks despite charging the landlord for this service. 
 

Then when the person doesn’t pay they say it’s not their fault. 

[WalkedUp]

You are too nice for that game sadly. An old pal who was (presumably still is) a slum lord has his mean men to help with evictions, very much not kosher. One guy who trashed the pace had his belongings dropped off at Arrowe Park hospital in bin bags. 

[Sweet11-87]

just to play devils advocate, when you inform them of rent increase  what % are we talking and is their a time frame or is it like from next month from 6 months time from 12 months time or whatever?

[ShootingEgg]

I am lucky to have good tenants but I really should up the rent, but then I feel like why rock the boat when they pay on time, they don't cause me any issues and the rent covers all my costs on the property.. it isn't easy being a landlord but you have to play the numbers game. You upping rent has caused you the issues, did you really need to up the rent for the properties. Or was it just a way of maximising the income you currently get?

[Poor Shot]

The promise of a good reference to their future (unlucky) landlord if they leave when agreed usually does the trick.

I would also refuse any further tenants that are claiming housing benefits, it's really not worth the hastle and cost to put right the state they will leave your property in.

Alternatively let the properties long term to the housing associations. They'll have responsibility for the maintenance, rent, etc and repair any damage at their cost at the end of the contract. At least thats how it was when I looked into it.

[mel b3]

19 minutes ago, ditchman said:

i was refused two tenancies..........because i had no credit history...(got no credit card)    and wouldnt accept years in advance rent with a cheque........

i cant tell you how difficult it has been to rent somewhere..and offering to pay a year in advance.....

 

figure that one out

 

I had the same situation about thirty years ago . I tried to get a mortgage,  but as I'd never been in debt , or borrowed any money , the bank didn't know if I'd be likely to pay my mortgage or not .

7 minutes ago, WalkedUp said:

You are too nice for that game sadly. An old pal who was (presumably still is) a slum lord has his mean men to help with evictions, very much not kosher. One guy who trashed the pace had his belongings dropped off at Arrowe Park hospital in bin bags. 

I did that on several occasions years ago , for a mate that was a landlord . Doing it these days would most likely get you a generous amount of jail time. I'm aware that it still happens , but I think it's mainly between Eastern Europeans.

 

It's disgraceful what some tenants do , but it's equally as bad what some landlords do .

[Jim Neal]

Edd I feel for you mate, it is very frustrating to be in that position.  Have you got your lost rent covered on a landlord insurance policy?  I'd strongly suspect going down the courts route will get you nowhere.  Furthermore, it will get dragged on forever and eat you up from the inside out, you'll suffer mentally from it and still be no better off financially at the end.  Cut and run, write it off, your mental health is worth more.

Now, I don't want this next thing to come across as supercilious or condescending, I don't mean it in that way.... I'm trying to make you think deeply about it... I hope you can see where the fundamental problem lies in your business model: you're renting out low grade housing to benefit claimers who don't give two poops about you.  They'll always do this eventually because they know how to work the system.

Get yourself into a different sector of the market, go up a level or two and do the houses up to a really nice standard so they're the amongst the best-looking ones for that type of property.  Even if you have to sell 4 houses and only buy 2 you'll still be better off than dealing with the sort of rubbish you're going through.  They'll rent out quick as a flash as well, loads of void time between tenants is excruciatingly expensive if your mortgage is a fair whack, even if it's not you've still got council tax & rates ticking away.

Use a local agent with a really good quality reputation to find and vet your tenants.  I think legally you can't specify "No benefits" any more but naturally the higher rent a decent house commands filters them out.

There are two absolute laws of the universe which apply to everything, including letting property:

1. You get out what you put in
2. If you keep doing the same thing you'll keep getting the same results.

Be bold.

Good luck

[eddoakley]

33 minutes ago, Sweet11-87 said:

just to play devils advocate, when you inform them of rent increase  what % are we talking and is their a time frame or is it like from next month from 6 months time from 12 months time or whatever?

1st one hadn't had a rent increase in 6 years despite huge rise in local rental values. She really annoyed me as she said straight away that she would be out within a month. Council told her to withdraw that notice and it took 8 months, 2 months with no rent at all plus about £3k to clear the mess.

2nd one hadn't had a rent increase in 8 years. They took 9 months to get out and missing 1 months rent.

They were both offered increased rent still well below what I could get.

The most recent hasn't had an increase in 2 years that she's been there. Agents offered me guaranteed rent 30% more than she was paying. I offered her a deal well below what the agents offered me.

So no, not maximising potential profits.

Edd

[eddoakley]

10 minutes ago, Jim Neal said:

Edd I feel for you mate, it is very frustrating to be in that position.  Have you got your lost rent covered on a landlord insurance policy?  I'd strongly suspect going down the courts route will get you nowhere.  Furthermore, it will get dragged on forever and eat you up from the inside out, you'll suffer mentally from it and still be no better off financially at the end.  Cut and run, write it off, your mental health is worth more.

Now, I don't want this next thing to come across as supercilious or condescending, I don't mean it in that way.... I'm trying to make you think deeply about it... I hope you can see where the fundamental problem lies in your business model: you're renting out low grade housing to benefit claimers who don't give two poops about you.  They'll always do this eventually because they know how to work the system.

Get yourself into a different sector of the market, go up a level or two and do the houses up to a really nice standard so they're the amongst the best-looking ones for that type of property.  Even if you have to sell 4 houses and only buy 2 you'll still be better off than dealing with the sort of rubbish you're going through.  They'll rent out quick as a flash as well, loads of void time between tenants is excruciatingly expensive if your mortgage is a fair whack, even if it's not you've still got council tax & rates ticking away.

Use a local agent with a really good quality reputation to find and vet your tenants.  I think legally you can't specify "No benefits" any more but naturally the higher rent a decent house commands filters them out.

There are two absolute laws of the universe which apply to everything, including letting property:

1. You get out what you put in
2. If you keep doing the same thing you'll keep getting the same results.

Be bold.

Good luck

Been doing it 20 odd years so well aware of the pitfalls and to be honest I've not had too many bad tenants. 

 Tenants alone aren't the issue. Tenants being supported by a system which seems to systematically screw landlord is the issue.

How is 6 months notice reasonable!?!?!?

 

Edd

[MirokuMK70]

The council will encourage the scumbags to do that, because all the whole time that they are your problem, they are not their problem.

[Lloyd90]

21 minutes ago, eddoakley said:

Been doing it 20 odd years so well aware of the pitfalls and to be honest I've not had too many bad tenants. 

 Tenants alone aren't the issue. Tenants being supported by a system which seems to systematically screw landlord is the issue.

How is 6 months notice reasonable!?!?!?

 

Edd

When we were in the USA, they were absolutely amazed when we said a landlord had to give you 6+ months notice to leave and likely had to get a court order. 
 

They complained their system was slow, sometimes taking up to a month. 
 

They said most places pay their rent weekly and if you don’t pay your usually out within 2 weeks. 

[Rim Fire]

They say never rent to family but i had three lots of family in mine and i can say they never missed a payment in 7 yrs i have sold 2 houses and still rent 1 will keep it going for another couple  of yrs 

[TIGHTCHOKE]

Edd, improve the quality of your property empire, aim for letting to people who can afford to rent.

[discobob]

That is a Socialist/Marxist state for you - as in Wales

[enfieldspares]

A) Improve the quality of your tenants. B). Use a GOOD letting agent, rent out on the "assured shorthold" system and, last but not least, be prepared if needed to go to Court. C). Take a bond or guarantee. But if you've been diligent with A) and B) it should not ever be required to either go to law or for you to withold C).

[Smudger687]

I'll express a contrarian opinion here:

If you feel like everything is against you, try being a tenant in a world full of high house prices, high deposit requirements, predatory landlords, rampant price inflation and wage stagnation, then come back and tell me that everything is against the landlord that's taking a huge cut of your monthly wages in rent. 

As bad as you think you have it, at least you have more than one property (incidentally, driving up house prices so that people like me are priced out of the housing market), which is more than can be said for your tenants. 

[discobob]

20 minutes ago, Smudger687 said:

I'll express a contrarian opinion here:

If you feel like everything is against you, try being a tenant in a world full of high house prices, high deposit requirements, predatory landlords, rampant price inflation and wage stagnation, then come back and tell me that everything is against the landlord that's taking a huge cut of your monthly wages in rent. 

As bad as you think you have it, at least you have more than one property (incidentally, driving up house prices so that people like me are priced out of the housing market), which is more than can be said for your tenants. 

and I will too

If Councils done their jobs properly (and Governments) there would be enough housing to meet the needs of those needy - whereas we have it now that people are on waiting lists for years and years and having to go into the hands of private landlords - and therein lies the root cause of the issues. Private Landlords are filling a gap that has been left - rightly or wrongly 

Edited February 16, 2022 by discobob

[Smudger687]

1 hour ago, discobob said:

and I will too

If Councils done their jobs properly (and Governments) there would be enough housing to meet the needs of those needy - whereas we have it now that people are on waiting lists for years and years and having to go into the hands of private landlords - and therein lies the root cause of the issues. Private Landlords are filling a gap that has been left - rightly or wrongly 

It's not just the needy, it's about the average person that can't get on the housing ladder. It's very easy to blame councils and governments (and they certainly deserve their fair share of blame), but house prices are inflated in no small part from the countless landlords that were able to get a mortgage on buy to let homes. The tenants end up paying off a mortgage that they themselves wouldn't be given on the basis that they couldn't afford the monthly repayments. 

It really gets my goat. 

[Bobba]

When it comes to house price inflation let us not forget the greedy banks and building societies which created the interest only mortgage. These were used by uk borrowers to purchase a higher value property than they could afford with a capital or repayment mortgage thus driving up house prices.

[discobob]

17 minutes ago, Smudger687 said:

It's not just the needy, it's about the average person that can't get on the housing ladder. It's very easy to blame councils and governments (and they certainly deserve their fair share of blame), but house prices are inflated in no small part from the countless landlords that were able to get a mortgage on buy to let homes. The tenants end up paying off a mortgage that they themselves wouldn't be given on the basis that they couldn't afford the monthly repayments. 

It really gets my goat. 

Oh - I agree Smudger - prices are stupid - but you have landlords taking advantage buying houses for people who should be in council/housing association,  which reduces the amount of available stock - especially for first time buyers - which drives the prices up, so the landlords buy more houses to rent out which..... 

I have two lads - 16 & 18 and I do worry about them getting on the ladder - although we are older parents anything we leave will hopefully (on my side) be more than 20 years although before then we would have downsized and let them have some from what's released

[Sweet11-87]

15 hours ago, eddoakley said:

1st one hadn't had a rent increase in 6 years despite huge rise in local rental values. She really annoyed me as she said straight away that she would be out within a month. Council told her to withdraw that notice and it took 8 months, 2 months with no rent at all plus about £3k to clear the mess.

2nd one hadn't had a rent increase in 8 years. They took 9 months to get out and missing 1 months rent.

They were both offered increased rent still well below what I could get.

The most recent hasn't had an increase in 2 years that she's been there. Agents offered me guaranteed rent 30% more than she was paying. I offered her a deal well below what the agents offered me.

So no, not maximising potential profits.

Edd

well youve not really answered the question mate? not wanting actual figures but what % was your increase and when would that increase ber happening?. for instance if youve knocked on the door and said rents going up  20% next month thats gona catch allot of people out. As a land lord youre well within your right to do with the property as you wish, but every coin has 2 sides.

  i mean lets be fair, you only long term rent  when for watever reason you can get a mortgage. youre basicaly paying someone elses mortgage. its brutal if you think about it.

Edited February 16, 2022 by Sweet11-87

[eddoakley]

22 minutes ago, Sweet11-87 said:

well youve not really answered the question mate? not wanting actual figures but what % was your increase and when would that increase ber happening?. for instance if youve knocked on the door and said rents going up  20% next month thats gona catch allot of people out. As a land lord youre well within your right to do with the property as you wish, but every coin has 2 sides.

  i mean lets be fair, you only long term rent  when for watever reason you can get a mortgage. youre basicaly paying someone elses mortgage. its brutal if you think about it.

Specifics are no problem, first was paying £485, going rate is £750. I offered £600 they couldn't or wouldn't pay the extra.

Second was paying £500, going rate £750 I offered £600.

Most recent was paying £750, going rate £1000. I offered £850.

They were all offered 3 months notice before any increase.

 

So on those 3 alone I was short by £765 a month. I don't know many that could or would accept that situation.

 

And as far as it being brutal for renters then it's generally a lack of thought, forward planning or ability to save or spend wisely. Not always the case I know.

The only reason I own houses is because I worked hard and didn't waste money. Never had cars on finance, never had expensive holidays, worked 90+ hours a week for a long time and invested my money. It wasn't easy and sometimes I was adding money to the rent to cover the mortgage.

Am I doing it for the benefit of my health? Or to be charitable? No I am certainly not. But does that make me the bad guy and in the wrong for applying the relevant rent?

What about when I had to subsidise the rent? Should the tenants have felt sorry for me and paid over the odds?

The council sold off (almost) all of their property to private associations. The council have a duty to provide housing. Surely they should look after private landlords instead of screwing them?

I feel a story in the local paper explaining just what the tenants were told and how I will now never accept anyone claiming benefits ad the council deliberately abuse the system to support the tenant and screw me.

 

Edd