What do you think?

[Flashman]

Can anybody point to a better system?

For example, name the Irish or German President?  Furthermore, many foreigners admire our constitutional monarchy - I can think of French and Cantonese ex-colleagues who expressed these views to me in the past.

Of more interest to me if how bitter and twisted are some members of this forum. It must be soul-destroying to be so unhappy about so many things so much of the time.  

I’d advocate emigrating, but who’d have you?

[enfieldspares]

6 hours ago, oowee said:

Should that work be down to the grace and favour of an entitled few? 

It's always been like that though. Back in the late 1980s I dated an African girl I'd met in London. She was there with her family as her father "worked in London". When I asked what he did she said it depended on what his diary was for the day.

Then I got invited back to the family home near Kenwood Park. The father was Zambian High Commissioner. On the "entitled few" the answers I got to one question was illuminating. He and his family had been previously posted to Italy and South Africa.

This was the time, still, of apartheid and I asked how did she had dealt with it when living in South Africa. The reply was this "It did not affect our class of people. It was for others. Not for us." So there always has been an entitled few. Always will be.

 

Edited September 18, 2022 by enfieldspares

[Spr1985]

On 17/09/2022 at 10:33, old'un said:

I hear people saying what the royals cost the tax payer but does anyone know what that figure is?

I believe if memory serves correctly it’s about £1.30 / £1.40 per year per tax paying adult.
 

the royal grant (which is what stops them From paying inheritance tax on the crown estate and NOT personally owned assets these are taxable)  was agreed in I think 1993 it means they forfeit 85% of the income from everything they own to government/the people  (arable land, mining land, common land, shooting estates, shopping centres, and the list goes on) and are not taxed on the remaining 15%. *
 

 *feel free to correct me if i’m wrong with evidence and links to such! *
 

so I can’t see the big issue really. A lot of moaning and whinging from what seems like a lot of people that don’t know what they’re talking about. 

as has been said above start with the actual  scroungers , benefit scammers, government wasting billions, companies Shirking tax liabilities, loopholes allowing tax evasion etc etc etc  before we moan about a couple of quid out of or personal tax contribution annually. 

[12gauge82]

5 hours ago, old man said:

Not done very well there for years have we?  Politics seems to be a home for liars?

Very true, elections are nothing more than a rigged game. 

[Weihrauch17]

1 hour ago, Spr1985 said:

I believe if memory serves correctly it’s about £1.30 / £1.40 per year per tax paying adult.
 

the royal grant (which is what stops them From paying inheritance tax on the crown estate and NOT personally owned assets these are taxable)  was agreed in I think 1993 it means they forfeit 85% of the income from everything they own to government/the people  (arable land, mining land, common land, shooting estates, shopping centres, and the list goes on) and are not taxed on the remaining 15%. *
 

 *feel free to correct me if i’m wrong with evidence and links to such! *
 

so I can’t see the big issue really. A lot of moaning and whinging from what seems like a lot of people that don’t know what they’re talking about. 

as has been said above start with the actual  scroungers , benefit scammers, government wasting billions, companies Shirking tax liabilities, loopholes allowing tax evasion etc etc etc  before we moan about a couple of quid out of or personal tax contribution annually. 

Personal assets from Monarch to Monarch are exempt from inheritance tax, Charles is getting around £700 million of the Queens private money tax free.  He pays no inheritance on the Queen's privately owned estates Sandringham and Balmoral.  They keep 25% of the income from the Crown Estates not 15% the value of which is currently going through the roof due to them owning the 12 miles of sea bed round the UK and the offshore wind going there.  Not sure how they stole the sea bed but there you are.  Security costs dwarf the value of the income of the Crown Estates 

https://inews.co.uk/news/sovereign-grant-how-much-where-royal-family-money-what-crown-estate-means-1847323

https://www.theguardian.com/uk-news/2022/sep/13/king-charles-will-not-pay-tax-on-inheritance-from-the-queen

Edited September 18, 2022 by Weihrauch17

[Spr1985]

1 minute ago, Weihrauch17 said:

Personal assets from Monarch to Monarch are exempt from inheritance tax, Charles is getting around £700 million of the Queens private money tax free.  He pays no inheritance on the Queen's privately owned estates Sandringham and Balmoral.  They keep 25% of the income from the Crown Estates not 15% the value of which is currently going through the roof due to them owning the 12 miles of sea bed round the UK and the offshore wind going there.  Not sure how they stole the sea bed but there you are.  

https://inews.co.uk/news/sovereign-grant-how-much-where-royal-family-money-what-crown-estate-means-1847323

https://www.theguardian.com/uk-news/2022/sep/13/king-charles-will-not-pay-tax-on-inheritance-from-the-queen

Yes correct, I wasn’t clear in my previous post “THE monarch” is exempt end of,  what I should have said is that any personally held assets ie balmoral, that are left to anyone other than THE monarch are subject to inheritance tax….example if it had been left to Edward he’d have had to pay inheritance tax on it. 
 

as for the 25% not 15% thanks for clarifying, but it’s the same thing…..the government and therefore the people benefit from it and it works out at far more benefit than the couple of quid a year it costs us 👍🏻

[Weihrauch17]

2 minutes ago, Spr1985 said:

Yes correct, I wasn’t clear in my previous post “THE monarch” is exempt end of,  what I should have said is that any personally held assets ie balmoral, that are left to anyone other than THE monarch are subject to inheritance tax….example if it had been left to Edward he’d have had to pay inheritance tax on it. 
 

as for the 25% not 15% thanks for clarifying, but it’s the same thing…..the government and therefore the people benefit from it and it works out at far more benefit than the couple of quid a year it costs us 👍🏻

General annual Security costs are three times their Crown Estate income paid for by the Taxpayer in normal times, after the last 11 days who knows.

[Spr1985]

10 minutes ago, Weihrauch17 said:

General annual Security costs are three times their Crown Estate income paid for by the Taxpayer in normal times, after the last 11 days who knows.

🤣 do you have a plausible link for that statistic? Bearing  in mind official costs for the security are not published ANYWHERE 
 

I find that very hard to believe. Although below I’ve included guesstimates for cost of security and ACTUAL annual figures for crown estate income and your figures sound far fetched at best 

Edited September 18, 2022 by Spr1985

[Weihrauch17]

It was on the first link if you read it.  Going to stop arguing now given the day.

Edited September 18, 2022 by Weihrauch17

[oldypigeonpopper]

Hello, I do not think people in UK will have the same affection for king Charles as the did the the queen ??

[oldypigeonpopper]

16 hours ago, old'un said:

Trying to undo the tangle of history of land ownership over the last 1000 years in the UK would be legal nightmare.

Perhaps that once you have sorted that out you could help the Aboriginals and the American Indian get their lands back.

Hello, your right , USA and Australia governments have a lot to answer for with the above, I will watch with interest how many commonwealth countries decide to severe their countries from the English system 

[old man]

3 minutes ago, oldypigeonpopper said:

Hello, your right , USA and Australia governments have a lot to answer for with the above, I will watch with interest how many commonwealth countries decide to severe their countries from the English system 

I think that's inevitable as all want to plough their own furrow?

Sotland and eventually Wales too being fed up with kowtowing?

Evolution?

[cardigun]

We tried having a Republic after the Civil War, and Cromwell governed us for a while.  But eventually we decided we didn't like being a republic, and recalled the King's successor from exile, dug up Cromwell's corpse, and Hanged it, and reverted to a Monarchy. The current Monarch is not a Executive ruler; that is reserved for Parliament.  My apologies if this has already been posted ( Its a very long thread)

[old'un]

14 hours ago, ditchman said:

i would imajine you would be part of the Sturgeon clan then ?

Nah, the Picts were living in the far north of Scotland in AD 300, long before the Sturgeon clan.

 

31 minutes ago, oldypigeonpopper said:

Hello, your right , USA and Australia governments have a lot to answer for with the above, I will watch with interest how many commonwealth countries decide to severe their countries from the English system 

Yep, they sure do, makes me smile at the old western movies showing the Indians as savages, whereas they were quite the opposite.

[udderlyoffroad]

It’s funny how those advocating for a republic appear to overlap strongly with those who were vociferously opposed to Brexit.   Of course, to abolish the monarchy there’d have to be a referendum.  14, in fact, across the Commonwealth, but let’s not complicate matters.  Naturally they’d expect the outcome of these referenda to be respected, no?

The other strange parallel with Brexit is that the Remoaners talk strongly about damage to ‘brand Britain’ that Brexit did – yet fail to acknowledge how getting rid of the monarchy would damage the ‘brand’ like nothing else.

Ah, but we should be more like these social democracies across the channel?  Really, which ones?  Netherlands…oh hang on.  Sweden! Nope.  Denmark? er...Norway!  Not even in the EU, mate. Belgium.  Spain. Er….Germany?

End of the day, if Brexit has proved one thing, is that the British public sector, when faced with a once-in-a-lifetime opportunity to make things better or simpler for the British public, will do the exact opposite, at greater cost.  A president would be exactly the same, I.e. be worse and cost more.  And who would do it?  President Attenborough?  I’d rather fall winky-first into a badger hole.

[Jaymo]

57 minutes ago, udderlyoffroad said:

It’s funny how those advocating for a republic appear to overlap strongly with those who were vociferously opposed to Brexit.   Of course, to abolish the monarchy there’d have to be a referendum.  14, in fact, across the Commonwealth, but let’s not complicate matters.  Naturally they’d expect the outcome of these referenda to be respected, no?

The other strange parallel with Brexit is that the Remoaners talk strongly about damage to ‘brand Britain’ that Brexit did – yet fail to acknowledge how getting rid of the monarchy would damage the ‘brand’ like nothing else.

Ah, but we should be more like these social democracies across the channel?  Really, which ones?  Netherlands…oh hang on.  Sweden! Nope.  Denmark? er...Norway!  Not even in the EU, mate. Belgium.  Spain. Er….Germany?

End of the day, if Brexit has proved one thing, is that the British public sector, when faced with a once-in-a-lifetime opportunity to make things better or simpler for the British public, will do the exact opposite, at greater cost.  A president would be exactly the same, I.e. be worse and cost more.  And who would do it?  President Attenborough?  I’d rather fall winky-first into a badger hole.

As a ‘Remoaner’ and staunch Monarchist I wonder where such parallels are formed. Certainly not in the circles that I’m in. 
We have both remain and pro brexit, but support for abolishment is, from the limited conversations, extremely low. 
 

 

Now back to the service…..

[Bigbob]

Remove them all and install Mary Berry as the new queen 

[Good shot?]

And we can all eat 🍰😀

[oowee]

2 hours ago, Jaymo said:

Now back to the service…..

I thought it was a lead lined coffin? Take more than eight chaps to lift it. 

[Jaymo]

37 minutes ago, oowee said:

I thought it was a lead lined coffin? Take more than eight chaps to lift it. 

That thought has occurred. But I’m not going down that rabbit hole, that’s for you guys to explore. 

[ditchman]

to me the whole service was condensed into one "act"

 

that lone piper..........makes the hairs stand up on the back of your neck

[TIGHTCHOKE]

2 minutes ago, ditchman said:

to me the whole service was condensed into one "act"

 

that lone piper..........makes the hairs stand up on the back of your neck

When were you last chased by a big burly Jock in a frock?

[manthing]

On 16/09/2022 at 21:41, oowee said:

The wealth is stolen from the citizens and should be taken back. No one has the right to be above anyone else. The privilege of royalty pervades our institutions at the highest level. A grace and favour society that protects its own. Thousands of acres of land, thousands of properties, rights and entitlements to positions of influence that are immeasurable. 

It belongs to us and should be taken back. 

So when Charles I was executed and the Parliament ruled over the land Parliament controlled what was the last King's estates.

So when the Parliament put Charles II on the throne how did he get the riches you say were stolen?

I'm no big royalist btw but being pragmatic I can see the benefits of having them over the possibility of politicians and civil servants trying to run the show, ie its run as a business to generate income.

[Bigbob]

1 hour ago, oowee said:

I thought it was a lead lined coffin? Take more than eight chaps to lift it. 

The family where wondering much the same shes been lieing in state for a fair bit ?.

[TIGHTCHOKE]

1 hour ago, Bigbob said:

Remove them all and install Mary Berry as the new queen 

We'd have another funeral in 2 years!