Scully Posted April 23, 2019 Report Share Posted April 23, 2019 Explosion in sale of Hushpowers? 🙂 It will be interesting to see how its policed. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Essex Keeper Posted April 23, 2019 Report Share Posted April 23, 2019 The only people this will screw our the honest ones Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
grahamch Posted April 23, 2019 Report Share Posted April 23, 2019 And what are our organisations that cost a lot to join doing about this if anything. Tis a complete farce, Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Mighty Prawn Posted April 23, 2019 Report Share Posted April 23, 2019 26 minutes ago, arjimlad said: I have contacted my MP "I am writing to ask you to address/challenge/raise in Parliament Natural England's short-notice revocation of the General Licences GL04/05/06 under which it was lawful for landowners & pest controllers to shoot woodpigeons, crows, magpies etc. without needing to apply for a specific licence. This was announced only today and is effective the day after tomorrow. I shoot woodpigeons on a large local arable farm in (your constituency). It is the only effective method to protect growing crops which can be rendered uneconomic by woodpigeons grazing. This debacle will (unless NE puts sensible measures in place urgently) hugely impact the arable farming community and threaten the viability of crops across the country. Crops of peas, oilseed rape, wheat, corn, beans are all under threat. The woodpigeons I shoot are not wasted - my family and friends enjoy this nutritious and ethical free-range wild meat. May I request you swing into action to make sure that the general licences are reissued, or that suitable alternative licences are quickly issued to permit essential crop protection ? The effect on nesting birds of the removal of the general licences permitting control of avian predators such as crows and magpies will also be quite deplorable. This could not have come at a worse time for a biodiverse countryside & wildlife. For more information on the issue please see : https://basc.org.uk/blog/uncategorized/natural-england-revoking-three-general-licences/ Many thanks Yours sincerely," for whatever good it might do https://www.theyworkforyou.com/ I'm going to bang a copy of this over to Sajid Javid (my MP) if that's okay and suggest others do so too - let's get our pieces on the board at least Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
grrclark Posted April 23, 2019 Report Share Posted April 23, 2019 33 minutes ago, dbarnard said: The specific licences: General licence GL04: To kill or take certain species of wild birds to prevent serious damage or disease General licence GL05: To kill or take certain species of wild birds to preserve public health or public safety General licence GL06: To kill or take certain species of wild birds to conserve wild birds or flora or fauna They do not include licences to protect crops. Unfortunately that was posted by Fieldsports TV and it is disappointingly misleading. GL04, as mentioned above, is for crop protection. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
oowee Posted April 23, 2019 Report Share Posted April 23, 2019 2 minutes ago, grahamch said: And what are our organisations that cost a lot to join doing about this if anything. Tis a complete farce, Urgent meeting requested. Lets hope they all go together in the morning. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
panoma1 Posted April 23, 2019 Report Share Posted April 23, 2019 Surely NE via the police will need to inform all individual gun license holders of these changes? Otherwise the short notice of revocation, could lead to many shooters acting illegally and very reasonably using "I was not/have not been informed" as a defence? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
B725 Posted April 23, 2019 Report Share Posted April 23, 2019 April's fools day was on the 1st or have the EU moved it. How can this happen so quickly Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OddJob Posted April 23, 2019 Report Share Posted April 23, 2019 1 minute ago, panoma1 said: Surely NE via the police will need to inform all individual gun license holders of these changes? Otherwise the short notice of revocation, could lead to many shooters acting illegally and very reasonably using "I was not/have not been informed" as a defence? Ignorance or the law is sadly not a defence. It is up to the individual get get informed, especially with any kind of firearm. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Mighty Prawn Posted April 23, 2019 Report Share Posted April 23, 2019 1 minute ago, panoma1 said: Surely NE via the police will need to inform all individual gun license holders of these changes? Otherwise the short notice of revocation, could lead to many shooters acting illegally and very reasonably using "I was not/have not been informed" as a defence? Whilst I agree that is logical, ignorance is no defence in law and they would argue it's your responsibility to ensure compliance with the current legislation Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ultrastu Posted April 23, 2019 Report Share Posted April 23, 2019 Yes but surely the law cannot be changed in just 2 days making criminals out of unsuspecting people . Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
grrclark Posted April 23, 2019 Report Share Posted April 23, 2019 (edited) 9 minutes ago, panoma1 said: Surely NE via the police will need to inform all individual gun license holders of these changes? Otherwise the short notice of revocation, could lead to many shooters acting illegally and very reasonably using "I was not/have not been informed" as a defence? Not being argumentative, but ignorance of the law is not a defence. One thing that has been quite apparent over the last hour or so, mostly on social media, as this news broke is just how many shoot under the terms of the GL, but have no clue what that actually means or entails. The number of questions asking if this applies only to England or all of the UK means that they have no idea what GL they shoot under and who regulates that in their own country. Also the amount of people saying crop protection is excluded, as that is what Fieldsports TV wrote on their Facebook post, without appreciating that crop protection is covered under GL04 which is clearly stated as being revoked. Most of them don't even know where to find the information. 4 minutes ago, Ultrastu said: Yes but surely the law cannot be changed in just 2 days making criminals out of unsuspecting people . The law is not being changed, just that a licensed exemption under the law is being removed. Agree however that is is ludicrously short notice. Edited April 23, 2019 by grrclark Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
islandgun Posted April 23, 2019 Report Share Posted April 23, 2019 As an aside and relevant to those that get licence. the laws of supply and demand will result in the value of pigeon at the game dealers increasing Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
panoma1 Posted April 23, 2019 Report Share Posted April 23, 2019 1 minute ago, OddJob said: Ignorance or the law is sadly not a defence. It is up to the individual get get informed, especially with any kind of firearm. I am aware of that.........but would it pass the "reasonableness test" expecting compliance after giving just two days notice and failing to publicise the revocation adequately? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
grrclark Posted April 23, 2019 Report Share Posted April 23, 2019 1 minute ago, panoma1 said: I am aware of that.........but would it pass the "reasonableness test" expecting compliance after giving just two days notice and failing to publicise the revocation adequately? Probably not and as equally unlikely that those who enforce and police the law will be aware of changes either at such short juncture. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
old'un Posted April 23, 2019 Report Share Posted April 23, 2019 That is the nail in the coffin….from the few bits I have read you will not be able to shoot any of the 16 listed birds without first trying and showing you have tried to use other non lethal methods first, it will be only then you can apply for a special licence to kill/shoot, can you imagine driving around looking for pigeons, trying all the non lethal methods, then applying for this special licence, same seems to apply to most corvids, its just plain crazy……https://www.fieldsportschannel.tv/generallicences/ Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dave-G Posted April 23, 2019 Report Share Posted April 23, 2019 (edited) So her post didn't bring the very important issue to our attention then? I'm assuming a new GL will be issued in the near future. Edited April 23, 2019 by Dave-G Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Katzenjammer Posted April 23, 2019 Report Share Posted April 23, 2019 Well this has set the cat amongst the pigeons! Way back farmers used to employ young kids as bird scarers. Had them walking around with sling shots and stones or football rattles etc. Much of the activity was just to unnerve the birds and stop them from landing which is essentially what a non-lethal gas gun does by blasting off periodically. I know our farmer had one until it broke but he had us as well. So what is to stop us walking around and firing off in a non lethal way to scare birds off? Not ideal but a stop gap until our special individual licence comes from out of the huge backlog of applications. NE will not be geared up manpowerwise for the deluge of applications. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wymberley Posted April 23, 2019 Report Share Posted April 23, 2019 Well, if this had been France some 230 years ago, then some aristo would have been heard to mumble, "Qu'ils mangent de la brioche." Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chezney Posted April 23, 2019 Report Share Posted April 23, 2019 Looks like I’ll be doing some clay shooting in my pigeon-riddled fields... did I mention I have terrible eyesight?! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ditchman Posted April 23, 2019 Report Share Posted April 23, 2019 You can take this a bit further...........if they catch Pigeon Controller without a liecence and in court he asks for 15,000,000 other offences to be taken in concideration.....thats one boy who will go down for life........... the you have "the kray twins" of pigeon shooting Motty & Muncher...........they will be doing 25 years - life....hard labour........... and at the rate i shoot pigeons i will get a verbal and 20 hours commmunity service........ Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Katzenjammer Posted April 23, 2019 Report Share Posted April 23, 2019 2 minutes ago, grrclark said: Probably not and as equally unlikely that those who enforce and police the law will be aware of changes either at such short juncture. The enforcers will be aware. I come from a licensing background. I worked on import licences for textiles etc for a short period. Any minor change such as inclusions or exclusions of certain commodities were known about by us very quickly and by our importers within a day or so by a Notice to Importers. I imagine a similar process operates in other circumstances such as this. Then we very quickly issued a change to the law by Statutory Instrument I think it was called. These actions we did and this action under discussion here is NOT a major rewrite of a law - just an amendment. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jaguar306 Posted April 23, 2019 Report Share Posted April 23, 2019 can we not use the following: Wild birds: licence to kill, take or disturb to prevent disease or agricultural damage, for conservation, or public health and safety (A08 and LR08) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ultrastu Posted April 23, 2019 Report Share Posted April 23, 2019 I guess that this forum is now perfectly named .as all we will be doing from now onwards is watching pigeons and not shooting them . Whats pigeon controller going to be doing now ? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ditchman Posted April 23, 2019 Report Share Posted April 23, 2019 (edited) 1 minute ago, Ultrastu said: I guess that this forum is now perfectly named .as all we will be doing from now onwards is watching pigeons and not shooting them . Whats pigeon controller going to be doing now ? packing his overnight bag for HMP Wandsworth...vicious murdering swine Edited April 23, 2019 by ditchman Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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