Air travel - so unrealistic

[Cosmicblue]

I see  on the BBC that travellers returning from Spain are going to have to quarantine for 14 days now, as there are further spikes in infections over there.

I find it simply staggering that people are still sufficiently naïve to book air travel when in very real terms nothing much has changed since the end of March with regard to the risk of infection.  Since then we have learned 3 things for sure.

1) The virus is lethal, invisible/uncontrollable and there are at least 45,000 UK citizens who won't sitting down for Christmas dinner in 2020.

2)  Lockdown 'works' however it wrecks the economy and now many 10s of thousands have lost their jobs.

3) Life has to go on with suitable precautions for which we all have a part to play.

So why do people think it is suddenly safe to travel?  It feels as though a chunk of the population haven't grasped that Covid-19 is really serious, it isn't some common cold bug that will clear up in a couple of days -absolutely nothing has changed since pre-lockdown.   Rather than having these potentially infected fools fly home and cling to the hope that they won't go wandering around ignoring the quarantine rules why not leave them in the countries they have visited?  Is that too harsh?

 

[Dave-G]

Selfish lambs Mugs to the slaughter comes to mind.

I simply cannot fathom why so many people are so desperate to go get a bit of sun knowing they have to do it while breathing the same air conditioned atmosphere as hundreds of other passengers who are also naive enough to think the virus is over and done with - both ways and to a lesser extent while they are at the venue, and in bars and clubs.

Edited July 26, 2020 by Dave-G

[matone]

Stupid,selfish people who get what they deserve !

[TIGHTCHOKE]

Stupidity is still not illegal.

[oldypigeonpopper]

Hello, you would think the doctor and BBC reporter might have been more clued up 🤔

[sam triple]

Unfortunately people these days don’t have the sense they were born with , and find it hard to think for themselves, rather be the sheep than the shepherd and certainly won’t admit they’re wrong or have the courage to face the consequences of their actions ,so why shouldn’t go on holiday ,after all they’ll  be fine 🙈

[kennett]

It does seem insane, I'm not overly cautious about the whole thing but still sticking by the rules. However sitting on a plane with a few 100 similarly naive people to wander about in a country that is still half shut down and not many weeks ago had dead bodies stacked in hospital corridors is not my idea of a relaxing week.

[Smokersmith]

8 hours ago, Cosmicblue said:

very real terms nothing much has changed since the end of March with regard to the risk of infection

I would broaden your thinking here a little.

Firstly … booking a flight is neither something I would do, nor recommend.

The consequences of infection are a little better, with less pressure on the NHS, and more understood about treatment … but not something I would rush to get.

The likelihood of infection is statistically much lower. Someone with more time to do the research can do the numbers, but in March, there were huge numbers infected, with an R rate out of control. Now the numbers infected are reducing weekly, and we have much better systems in place to identify cases and keep outbreaks controlled.

We still need to take care, but I'm a little more optimistic … although not getting my passport out yet!

[matone]

2 hours ago, TIGHTCHOKE said:

Stupidity is still not illegal.

A good friend who was a Judge insisted that stupidity should be made an offence ! He said in many cases he presided over that was the greatest factor!!!!!

He was being serious too.

[Mice!]

17 minutes ago, kennett said:

It does seem insane, I'm not overly cautious about the whole thing but still sticking by the rules. However sitting on a plane with a few 100 similarly naive people to wander about in a country that is still half shut down and not many weeks ago had dead bodies stacked in hospital corridors is not my idea of a relaxing week.

Sums it up perfectly,  stay in Britain,  take sensible steps,  why would you go on a plane? I'm sure it's an effort to get the aviation and tourism sectors going but is it worth the risk?

[JohnfromUK]

9 hours ago, Cosmicblue said:

I find it simply staggering that people are still sufficiently naïve to book air travel when in very real terms nothing much has changed since the end of March with regard to the risk of infection.

100% agree.

19 minutes ago, Smokersmith said:

The consequences of infection are a little better, with less pressure on the NHS, and more understood about treatment … but not something I would rush to get.

This is true, but a (relatively few admiittedly) have a rough time - and either it kills them, or they have long term consequences.  Not sorething to be risked where reasonably avoidable.

 

20 minutes ago, Smokersmith said:

The likelihood of infection is statistically much lower. Someone with more time to do the research can do the numbers, but in March, there were huge numbers infected, with an R rate out of control. Now the numbers infected are reducing weekly, and we have much better systems in place to identify cases and keep outbreaks controlled.

That is also largely true - though cases are remaining at a fairly constant level now - and it is well above zero.

The trouble in my view is that people these days are all about having 'a good time now' - and no thought of responsibility, or future consequences.  All part of the borrow and spend - and worry about paying back later culture we have now.  I come from the old fashioned 'save now - and you'll have it to spend later should you wish.  The trouble with my view is that when the chancellor sees you save (as he has encouraged you to do) - he then steals it - and that is what has encouraged the 'spend it now' culture.

[AVB]

I’ll be on a plane to Portugal as soon as it comes off the FCO ‘essential travel only’ list.
 

This virus is nowhere near as dangerous as it is made out to be if you are under 60 (probably 70) and in good health. 

Why stay in the UK when you don’t know if it is going to **** down with rain one day to the next. 

[JohnfromUK]

19 minutes ago, AVB said:

Why stay in the UK when you don’t know if it is going to **** down with rain one day to the next.

Personally, I'd take a drop of rain over a week ill with the virus any day ........ but that's me.

I haven't been overseas (other than business) for maybe 30 years (and that was a shooting and fishing expedition overseas!)

[blackbird]

This is how it could be now for the next 20yrs if no cure is found we have just got to learn to adopt to it, I can understand if I were elderly with health issues I would not leave the house let alone the country.

Edited July 26, 2020 by blackbird

[Cranfield]

We have been told that airlines are "self distancing" on planes, by leaving some seats empty, everyone wears a face mask, no unpackaged food or drink available, uprated air filters on board.
If all that is true,  it sounds as safe to me as walking into Morrisons, or a pub/restaurant.
If you avoid a large congested hotel, or resort on holiday and choose a villa, or something similar and then take all normal UK type precautions , I think you should be as safe as staying at home.
The only thing stopping us travelling abroad at the moment, is the Governments erratic quarantine and general advice policy.
 

 

[markm]

1 hour ago, AVB said:

I’ll be on a plane to Portugal as soon as it comes off the FCO ‘essential travel only’ list.
 

This virus is nowhere near as dangerous as it is made out to be if you are under 60 (probably 70) and in good health. 

Why stay in the UK when you don’t know if it is going to **** down with rain one day to the next. 

I should be in Miami now.

 

I’ve booked Portugal for mid August in the hope it does. If it doesn’t we’ll just right off the money.  It was only £130 for the flights, not booked cases or accommodation yet.

 

Being a school teacher, in straight in at the deep end come September anyway. 

[JohnfromUK]

2 minutes ago, markm said:

Being a school teacher, in straight in at the deep end come September anyway. 

Interestingly - apparently there has been no known case of a teacher catching Covid from a pupil; https://www.thetimes.co.uk/article/no-known-case-of-teacher-catching-coronavirus-from-pupils-says-scientist-3zk5g2x6z

or https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-8548461/No-proof-teacher-caught-Covid-19-pupil-scientist-says.html

or https://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2020/05/13/teachers-risk-catching-coronavirus-teachers-pupils/

I was surprised, but that is what is reported.

[Scully]

I see it like this.....the chances of infection are very small and the chances of it killing you ( dependant on age ) are very small, but there again, I don’t see the point in taking risks if they can be avoided.

Saying all that, I’m not avoiding a holiday because of the risks, I’m not bothering with one because I can’t be bothered with the restrictions imposed to do so. If I can’t go abroad and be totally relaxed about it, with no interference on my liberty to do so, then I’d rather wait until the time comes when I can. 

[markm]

2 hours ago, JohnfromUK said:

Interestingly - apparently there has been no known case of a teacher catching Covid from a pupil; https://www.thetimes.co.uk/article/no-known-case-of-teacher-catching-coronavirus-from-pupils-says-scientist-3zk5g2x6z

or https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-8548461/No-proof-teacher-caught-Covid-19-pupil-scientist-says.html

or https://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2020/05/13/teachers-risk-catching-coronavirus-teachers-pupils/

I was surprised, but that is what is reported.

I’m pretty sure it will have happened, until track and trace starts it’s been impossible to say who you caught it off. Kids spread everything else as schools are an absolute breeding ground for everything contagious to humans. 
 

schools need to reopen (which they are) and the world needs to move on with casualties along the way. Myself and others will just have to be careful when social distancing, masks etc all of a sudden just stops on a Monday. 
 

I bet the author(s) of these articles wouldn’t be happy jumping in, they’ll just sit and type from home or their social distanced office. 

Edited July 26, 2020 by markm

[JohnfromUK]

1 minute ago, markm said:

Kids spread everything else as schools are an absolute breeding ground for everything contagious to humans. 

I agree - that's mainly why I was surprised, but "news reports are news reports", not necessarily 100% factual!  It would be a shame if facts hampered selling papers!

[Bumble]

Permanently isolating all of those who’ve been to Magaluf or Benidorm is an excellent idea.

[Retsdon]

The quarantine thing is a joke anyway. I flew in three weeks ago from Saudi. On arrival at Heathrow everyone was supposed to enter details of where they'd come from where they were staying, etc, etc. It would have been possible to do this stuff in advance, but Saudia hadn't bothered to tell its passengers, so I had to do it on arrival.There were about 5 iPads on stands for probably 50-60  people, and one harassed offical trying to help everyone, most of whom only had the most rudimentary English language skills. To speed things up, I offered to help the three young men in front of me, who it turned out were illiterate Afghans coming in on a Turkish Airlines flight. Their contact address and phone number was some kind of hostel in New Cross, and they apparently had plans to stay indefinitely. (I put 3 months on their forms because ’forever’ seemed a bit extreme). Anyway, after getting them sorted, I filled out my own form only to subequently discover that I could have put anything at all on it because nobody took the slightest bit of notice of the content on my way out of the airport and nobody has contacted me at all since. The whole exercise was a complete waste of almost two hours. As for ’self-isolation’, I complied with the guidelines, but really there would have been nothing whatsoever from stopping me going out and about from day one after my arrival.

Having gone through the whole thing, I can only conclude that the ’quarantine’ story is really just a box-ticking / window-dressing sop to public opinion and not really much to do with public health. If it was about public health you'd expect something far more organized and formal.

[Newbie to this]

12 minutes ago, Retsdon said:

Having gone through the whole thing, I can only conclude that the ’quarantine’ story is really just a box-ticking / window-dressing sop to public opinion and not really much to do with public health. If it was about public health you'd expect something far more organized and formal.

Probably about sums it up.

[Scully]

13 minutes ago, Newbie to this said:

Probably about sums it up.

I can’t really argue with that. My local pub has an A4 clipboard to sign if you want a drink, where you are supposed to leave your name and telephone number. Last week there were several staff so it was carried out diligently, on Friday night there was one bar staff, and the clip board was on the bar. When I signed it I was fourth down the page, but there was at least double that number who were sat outside with drinks. Ah well. 

[Mice!]

2 hours ago, Scully said:

I can’t really argue with that. My local pub has an A4 clipboard to sign if you want a drink, where you are supposed to leave your name and telephone number. Last week there were several staff so it was carried out diligently, on Friday night there was one bar staff, and the clip board was on the bar. When I signed it I was fourth down the page, but there was at least double that number who were sat outside with drinks. Ah well. 

I was impressed when a lad at work said if you didn't sign in to the pub wifi then you didn't get in, but that was one pub I doubt they will all be doing it.

3 hours ago, Retsdon said:

Having gone through the whole thing, I can only conclude that the ’quarantine’ story is really just a box-ticking / window-dressing sop to public opinion and not really much to do with public health. If it was about public health you'd expect something far more organized and formal.

Sounds right, I can't imagine many of those arriving actually quarantining for two weeks, especially if they don't speak or read English. 

Probably only the Isle of Man has managed quarantine properly on the British isles because its been restricted to ferrys only and making people stay at a hotel, haven't heard much about the channel islands though.