Patterning

[The Heron]

I have patterned every shotgun I have owned and have been amazed at the results of various choke /cartridge combinations, does everyone on here pattern or not or think its a waste of time. 

[TIGHTCHOKE]

Always pattern when getting a new gun or changing another element.

[Ultrastu]

Yeah always pattern .how else would you know where the gun is shooting .? 

Not patterning is a bit like bolting a new scope on a rifle and expecting it to be zeroed and the bullet go exactly where the x hairs are pointing .

[Stonepark]

Pattern with new cartridges, most are within 95% of where they should be but you do get some that for (reasons as yet to be discovered - usually when cartridge is taken apart) can be as low as 50% of where they should be and are relegated to clays in only.

[Walker570]

I did pattern my 410 reloads with various chokes and found best to have full and full for a solid pattern at 35yrds. No, I don't consider it a waste of time.

[wymberley]

Yes.

[Smokersmith]

+1

Even if it only builds confidence to help put it in the right place.

[old'un]

No, never pattered a gun, shot the side of an old caravan once just out of curiosity.

[LeedsZeppelin]

Just out of interest, where do people actually go to pattern their guns? I've never seen pattern plates set up anywhere (admittedly, I've never actually looked for them).

[JohnfromUK]

What do you understand patterning to be?

The reason I say that is that I have tried two 'patterning' techniques, one of which I believe to be proper patterning - and the other a simple 'quick and dirty' assessment of pattern/point of aim.  Let me explain;

1. For proper patterning (as I understand it), I prepared a target at 40 yards (measured) and the target 'sheets' were about 6 ft square paper sheets.  These were then fired at from the 40 yard point from an already dirtied barrel - one cartridge to each sheet.  A 30 inch circle was then drawn around the 'perceived pattern centre' and the pellets counted.  The percentage inside the 30" circle was then calculated.  The 'distribution of the pellet impacts was assessed visually for gaps using a circular 'disc' (like a beer mat).  It was a long time consuming procedure - and with large brown paper sheets, needs a dead still day.
2. For a 'quick and dirty' assessment, I have fired at a sheet of target (whitewashed metal), photographed the result and examined the photos for both point of impact and evenness of distribution.  It was done with a approx 1m target sheet at 16 yards.  (I can't remember why, but I believe 16 yards is a 'standard' distance, possible with 1 foot at 16 yards being similar to 30" at 40 yards?

12 minutes ago, old'un said:

shot the side of an old caravan once just out of curiosity

I can understand that it might be very satisfying to shoot a caravan .............

Edited October 7, 2020 by JohnfromUK

[wymberley]

30 minutes ago, old'un said:

No, never pattered a gun, shot the side of an old caravan once just out of curiosity.

A couple of rounds of Brenneke into a Lightning aircraft is far more interesting.

 

21 minutes ago, JohnfromUK said:

What do you understand patterning to be?

The reason I say that is that I have tried two 'patterning' techniques, one of which I believe to be proper patterning - and the other a simple 'quick and dirty' assessment of pattern/point of aim.  Let me explain;

1. For proper patterning (as I understand it), I prepared a target at 40 yards (measured) and the target 'sheets' were about 6 ft square paper sheets.  These were then fired at from the 40 yard point from an already dirtied barrel - one cartridge to each sheet.  A 30 inch circle was then drawn around the 'perceived pattern centre' and the pellets counted.  The percentage inside the 30" circle was then calculated.  The 'distribution of the pellet impacts was assessed visually for gaps using a circular 'disc' (like a beer mat).  It was a long time consuming procedure - and with large brown paper sheets, needs a dead still day.
2. For a 'quick and dirty' assessment, I have fired at a sheet of target (whitewashed metal), photographed the result and examined the photos for both point of impact and evenness of distribution.  It was done with a approx 1m target sheet at 16 yards.  (I can't remember why, but I believe 16 yards is a 'standard' distance, possible with 1 foot at 16 yards being similar to 30" at 40 yards?

I can understand that it might be very satisfying to shoot a caravan .............

1 yard is taken as the eye to muzzle distance when fitting a gun which is then checked at 16 yards. One inch error on the plate is 1/16" adjustment to the stock comb.

In the past, the number of 5" discs which can be placed in a pattern without covering any pellets has been taken a a guide to a pattern.

As we now know that the pattern is not even throughout the 30" circle and is subject to what the Americans call "central thickening" which is far more sensible than "the gaussian law of distribution", checking the pattern in the central 20" circle is worthwhile.

[enfieldspares]

21 minutes ago, JohnfromUK said:

I can understand that it might be very satisfying to shoot a caravan .............

For some that might depend on who is inside it?

[JohnfromUK]

1 minute ago, enfieldspares said:

For some that might depend on who is inside it?

I was thinking more of how long you have been stuck in a long slow moving queue of vehicles behind it.

[theshootist]

50 minutes ago, old'un said:

No, never pattered a gun, shot the side of an old caravan once just out of curiosity.

Chortling here! 

[Scully]

Have only ever patterned one shotgun ( if you can call it that ) and by that I mean took one aimed shot from one barrel of a tight trap barrel, just to see where it printed. 

[old'un]

7 minutes ago, Scully said:

Have only ever patterned one shotgun ( if you can call it that ) and by that I mean took one aimed shot from one barrel of a tight trap barrel, just to see where it printed. 

Caravan?

[Scully]

1 minute ago, old'un said:

Caravan?

😂 I wish! The teenaged delinquent in me would love to! 
It was an old oil bowser actually....unfortunately. 😕

[Lloyd90]

I have been to many clay grounds and only one I have seen that even has a pattern plate is Ian Coley’s, which you can only use by prior appointment and I didn’t even ask what they wanted as the place is expensive ish (although a beautiful ground). 
 

 

[Ultrastu]

I would say it largely depends on what information  you want to get by patterning .

For me its to find 

A ,  where the gun is shooing .

B , At what range I feel a certain choke is most suitable for a particular cart .

So  I like to use 28 grm of no 7.5 on pigeons through a 1/4 choke .this is so I can hit pigeons decoying in well for distances from say 10 _ 30 yds . If I were to use a 3/4 choke the pattern would be too tight close in but possibly extended  my range to 35 /40 yds ..

If I want  to shoot high crows I would use a 3/4  choke and no 5s pellets 

The info gained from the plate tells me these parameters  .

 

[JDog]

Pattern testing with a new gun or different cartridges or chokes would seem sensible to me.

Having said that I dare not pattern test my gun just in case I do not like what I see as I would be reluctant to change my gun (fixed chokes) or cartridges.

[Mr.C]

Patterned my clays gun when I 1st got it to reasure myself about the shape of pattern relative to my perceived sight picture (if that makes sense). It has one of those adjustable high ribs, an abomination to some but I like the more upright head position. 

[TIGHTCHOKE]

2 hours ago, wymberley said:

A couple of rounds of Brenneke into a Lightning aircraft is far more interesting.

I shot the Varsity on the fire dump, the white body gave a lovely representation of the pattern.

I have also fired Brenneke slugs at Galvanised steel plating, oh and some seriously large ballbearings through trees.

[wymberley]

16 minutes ago, TIGHTCHOKE said:

I shot the Varsity on the fire dump, the white body gave a lovely representation of the pattern.

I have also fired Brenneke slugs at Galvanised steel plating, oh and some seriously large ballbearings through trees.

Got quite good at it. The objective being to do as much damage as possible and varied with it so the trades could be tested on their battle damage repair capability when on exercise.

On my last job in the mob myself and the team plumber were called in to do a pattern check - on one of the aircraft based on the unit where we lodged. The pattern on the tailplane suggested that the guy was low - really low - Red Flag low - when he was hit.

[JTaylor91]

13 minutes ago, JDog said:

Pattern testing with a new gun or different cartridges or chokes would seem sensible to me.

Having said that I dare not pattern test my gun just in case I do not like what I see as I would be reluctant to change my gun (fixed chokes) or cartridges.

I have a new excuse for the list

[Gas seal]

Hi l pattern cartridges because I reload. Patterning can be to see where the gun is shooting, l was always told English guns shoot high so you will buy more cartridges ,and that’s why you can’t have one.. I pattern my reloads and chokes do make a difference. When patterning Steel loads sometimes a more open choke gave a tighter pattern. I use 30mm and 50mm Steel extended chokes in 28 gauge and they are much better. All commercial cartridges will be tested before they are sold, but not many shooters will try them though different chokes. My friend had a 8 bore muzzle loader we patterned it With bismuth in a wad we made from cardboard. The wad had four slits in it and it stayed together. He thought the bismuth might scratch the barrel. I don’t think these guns have any chokes but they will kill geese. I was once given AAA Baikal cartridges to shoot crows ,after (hitting )a few l patterned them on the side of a old tin sheet  at the back of the farm ,it was about a two foot circle. I never fired the rest of them . I did pattern them years later and they are the tightest pattern l have seen. It not rocket science to pattern a shotgun and changing chokes,if your gun has them, is cheaper than changing guns. A roll of backing paper and cello tape  an see where the pellets go. A lot of data on patterning was from years ago, we now have better cartridges and guns. The shooters in the USA do a lot of testing with choke and cartridges. There is a good pattern on a road sign on a dual carriage way nearby it been there for years, l should photo it and guess how far away it was shot from.