if its the end of lead, what about .410's

[quentyn]

without starting a war as to if we should or should not see the end of lead ammunition, what options are there for the .410 shooter ? looking on just cartridges there doesnt seem to be any non toxic .410 load at all. Is .410 viable in steel ? 

[TIGHTCHOKE]

ITM and home loading!

[Scully]

Trap loads? 

[Old farrier]

9 minutes ago, TIGHTCHOKE said:

ITM and home loading!

Got any recipes or fibre shot cups 🤔

 

[rbrowning2]

Bismuth shot and a second mortgage 😊

[wisdom]

Effectively if the total ban goes ahead all my guns including the s x s .410 will be virtually worthless.My clay gun is fairly open chocked but it's a no steel ground 

[grahamch]

Lobby for an exemption for 410s as they have in NZ?

[Ultrastu]

7 minutes ago, grahamch said:

Lobby for an exemption for 410s as they have in NZ?

Yes please 

Sounds like a good idea .one that I think won't pass .

[quentyn]

1 minute ago, Ultrastu said:

Yes please 

Sounds like a good idea .one that I think won't pass .

i think that they may have to else all the .410's are done for 

[tonyshooter]

I have it on good authority that .410 ga and 28 bores will become almost obselete !

 

Just look on Holts to see whats not selling, even at bargain basement prices.

 

[Walker570]

Already loading bismuth for next season. Yes, it is a bit more expensive so I will have to cut back on my shot of whisky each evening or some other luxury.

Lylevale have plans for a bismuth load I undestand and feel sure that other companies will follow suit.   

 

[enfieldspares]

BASC don't care. They've thrown you under the bus. The .410" owner, the 28 bore owner. All so they can protect their investment in the British Game Alliance that is the chosen vehicle connected to BASC in order to justify the " big bag boys' " (who see pheasants as little more than feathered clay pigeons) claim that everything that is shot goes into the food chain. 

Edited April 6, 2022 by enfieldspares

[Poor Shot]

I've been looking into this over the last few weeks and there is plenty of home loading materials available for the steel 28 and 410 guages. B&P have even developed a sub guage bio wad for use with steel but no solid release date yet. 

As far as commercially available non toxic loads there isn't anything other than "We're working on it and plan to have some available soon".

I've been looking into home loading 28 Bore 21g steel cartridges for clay shooting and depending on what and where you buy the components, they aren't a million miles away from a mid range 12 bore clay cartridge in terms of cost.

[7daysinaweek]

Forgive my ignorance.

Does the ban include all projectiles, will extend to rifle ammunition? After giving it some thought, I am thinking why would it not, after all lead is lead and they will see it in no different manner.

I wonder what alternatives there will be for rimfires and centerfire?, for myself, finding something that is widely available that my centerfire likes will probably be the biggest challenge.

******!

[8 shot]

9 minutes ago, 7daysinaweek said:

I wonder what alternatives there will be for rimfires

NOTHING... absolutley nothing

[rbrowning2]

23 minutes ago, Poor Shot said:

I've been looking into this over the last few weeks and there is plenty of home loading materials available for the steel 28 and 410 guages. B&P have even developed a sub guage bio wad for use with steel but no solid release date yet. 

As far as commercially available non toxic loads there isn't anything other than "We're working on it and plan to have some available soon".

I've been looking into home loading 28 Bore 21g steel cartridges for clay shooting and depending on what and where you buy the components, they aren't a million miles away from a mid range 12 bore clay cartridge in terms of cost.

If and it is a big if bio wads for the .410 become available, just how effective will the pattern of steel shot be when the recommendations are to use two sizes larger diameter pellets to compensate for the much lighter pellet.
Then the 28ga again similar issues.

You are also assuming bio wads become available to home load with.

if they do then tungsten based shot will be the sensible option, or bismuth with traditional fibre wads.

[rbrowning2]

31 minutes ago, 7daysinaweek said:

Forgive my ignorance.

Does the ban include all projectiles, will extend to rifle ammunition? After giving it some thought, I am thinking why would it not, after all lead is lead and they will see it in no different manner.

I wonder what alternatives there will be for rimfires and centerfire?, for myself, finding something that is widely available that my centerfire likes will probably be the biggest challenge.

******!

Lots of copper bullets for centerfire starting to be available, price is the issue, not so much for deer stalking but target shooting, rabbit shooting is another issue, we are heading to £2/£3 a round or more, if we are not already at that point.

[Ultrastu]

I'd love to get an expensive 410 .shotty as I love the calibre  . But I'm just gonna run single barrelled  .410 that cost me £120   4 years ago as long as I can then probably  scrap it when it's obsolete  .

I dont have the time to reload and have no intention  of doing so .

[Weihrauch17]

46 minutes ago, enfieldspares said:

BASC don't care. They've thrown you under the bus. The .410" owner, the 28 bore owner. All so they can protect their investment in the British Game Alliance that is the chosen vehicle connected to BASC in order to justify the " big bag boys' " (who see pheasants as little more than feathered clay pigeons) claim that everything that is shot goes into the food chain. 

This.

[7daysinaweek]

26 minutes ago, 8 shot said:

NOTHING... absolutley nothing

Just found CCI do a 22 all copper, if the rimmy doesn't like them then that's that! 

Will carry on using Vmax in the 17, from what I can see they are lead free. May see the end of my 22 and sole use of the 17.

1 minute ago, rbrowning2 said:

Lots of copper bullets for centerfire starting to be available, price is the issue, not so much for deer stalking but target shooting, rabbit shooting is another issue, we are heading to £2/£3 a round or more, if we are not already at that point.

Thank you for the reply.

I can believe you. Just looked up the price of 243 hornady that I use for stalking, now approaching £35-£40 depends on where I look, fortunatley as you say not such a price imapact if you only stalk and you may be able to absorb the costs a little better. I have a friend who target shoots ammo and self loads and it is costing him a fortune.

[8 shot]

5 minutes ago, 7daysinaweek said:

Just found CCI do a 22 all copper, if the rimmy doesn't like them then that's that! 

You couldn't hit an elephant at 50yrds with them, garbage

[7daysinaweek]

1 minute ago, 8 shot said:

You couldn't hit an elephant at 50yrds with them, garbage

 

[mellors]

11 hours ago, tonyshooter said:

I have it on good authority that .410 ga and 28 bores will become almost obselete !

 

Just look on Holts to see whats not selling, even at bargain basement prices.

 

Also all the moderated hush powers look like there destined for the scrap heap. 

The thick fibre wads will be a real problem. 

[Down South]

10 hours ago, Poor Shot said:

I've been looking into this over the last few weeks and there is plenty of home loading materials available for the steel 28 and 410 guages. B&P have even developed a sub guage bio wad for use with steel but no solid release date yet. 

As far as commercially available non toxic loads there isn't anything other than "We're working on it and plan to have some available soon".

UK cartridge assembly companies won’t put any r&d money into finding solutions, why would they? The answer will come from Europe; France, Italy and Spain. UK companies will buy in when the development is done.

[Centrepin]

Time to stock up on .410. So glad there's no limit to what you can have.

As for rimfire, I'll keep my stock of 2000 topped up just in case.

CCI do a copper round, I recently bought 5 boxes from someone who said similar to the posts above they're outrageously garbage. However, I found at 30m that they hit just 2" higher than my aim point but grouped ok given the wind, pic below. At 50m the group was wider but on target. At 100m I couldn't even find a strike mark on a pallet covered in wallpaper. I suppose your rifle either likes them or not.