Duty of Care.

[fatchap]

The title of this post means absolutely nothing to my boss, who today demonstrated what a heartless money grabbing **** he really is.

One of our 7.5 tonne drivers badly sprained his ankle today, all the way down in Southampton. He rang in to let the office, know who duly informed the boss. He didn't even ask how the driver was, his main concern was the recovery of the truck. In the end it was decided that a van would drive to Southampton taking a qualified 7.5 tonne driver to drive the lorry back and the other van would bring back the injured driver. This plan was then delayed by my boss who didn't want to send out a van empty, so waited a further 3 hours for confirmation of a delivery in Andover, which they would go to first then onto Southampton and pick up the driver and lorry.

I am disgusted at the company I work for. Left the poor bloke in sweltering hot heat, probably in extreme agony pretty much all day. I would have somehow made my own way home,  left the van and told my boss I'll see him in court.

[ph5172]

Devils advocate. 
I am sure if it was that bad whatever company site the injury occurred on could have organised medical attention. 
 

it’s a difficult one.

organising a spare driver to recover the truck who had hours left and another one to drive them takes time. 
 

not ideal though when you are crocked and just want to get home 

Edited August 11, 2020 by ph5172

[countryman]

I agree, there are some real money grabbing bosses, my wife had 1 hour deducted from her wages when I picked her up from work early to have our beloved Dog put to sleep when he had a stoke.

[Fuddster]

15 minutes ago, countryman said:

I agree, there are some real money grabbing bosses, my wife had 1 hour deducted from her wages when I picked her up from work early to have our beloved Dog put to sleep when he had a stoke.

If that had been me, I would have spent the 12 months quietly sabotaging what ever I could.

f.

 

[team tractor]

21 minutes ago, countryman said:

I agree, there are some real money grabbing bosses, my wife had 1 hour deducted from her wages when I picked her up from work early to have our beloved Dog put to sleep when he had a stoke.

Sorry but why should the boss pay ?  
we are good to our lads but they work an extra hour if a jobs to be finished. I never stop them doctors appointments but I understand with big companies. 
a business by us has 21 lads . If they have 3 minutes extra dinner that’s over an hour /5 hours a week , 20 hours a month . 
 

saying that , my lads have half hour but it’s regulary 40 mins but 5pm finish is 5:20 most days . Swings and roundabouts.

9 minutes ago, Fuddster said:

If that had been me, I would have spent the 12 months quietly sabotaging what ever I could.

f.

 

Sorry but that’s a bad attitude. 
I’m a boss and I’m no millionaire .

33 minutes ago, ph5172 said:

Devils advocate. 
I am sure if it was that bad whatever company site the injury occurred on could have organised medical attention. 
 

it’s a difficult one.

organising a spare driver to recover the truck who had hours left and another one to drive them takes time. 
 

not ideal though when you are crocked and just want to get home 

Now thats common sense 👍. 

[Fuddster]

14 minutes ago, team tractor said:

Sorry but that’s a bad attitude. 
I’m a boss and I’m no millionaire .

Good job I retired last year.

f.

[The Heron]

I'm sorry but nothing supprises me today. 

[Gordon R]

About 10 years ago, one of my staff came to see me to say he needed to go home. He was more than a bit upset and could barely get words out. I told him to go home, do whatever he needed to do and contact me when he was able. I said it doesn't have to be today, tomorrow or the day after - just go.

He phoned the day after - it turned out his wife had just been diagnosed with terminal cancer. 

When he returned to work, I told him I was interested in what he produced over a year, not just one or two days when he needed to be elsewhere.

Staff are a precious resource and if you want to get the most out of them, treat them properly. If you treat them badly, your results take a turn for the worse.

 

[clangerman]

57 minutes ago, Gordon R said:

.

Staff are a precious resource and if you want to get the most out of them, treat them properly. If you treat them badly, your results take a turn for the worse.

 

spot on lesson in how to get the best from staff the bit of leeway i allowed always paid of in the end if you forget staff are the ones earning your cake you will regret it 

[GingerCat]

i ve taken over a team, they are a good bunch. I've told them i couldn't care less if they were 20 mins late each morning or finished an hour early as long as their work load is done and well managed. im pretty nice when it comes to days off too. 

Guess what....they are by far the highest performing team and never grumble when its going to be late, like 8 hours late and the straight back too work. Its not hard really is it? pragmatic working and not being an ****, simples

 

[Retsdon]

4 hours ago, The Heron said:

I'm sorry but nothing supprises me today. 

It was worse in the past. During the Blitz my mother was a 16 year old trainee nurse in Great Ormond's Street children's hospital in London, and I can remember her telling me that one night when she was on duty, in the course of a particularly heavy air raid a bomb fell in the street next to the hospital. She was carrying a full china bed pan at the time, and the shock of the explosion caused her to drop it. For that, she had a dressing down from the Matron for being far too nervous, and the price of the broken bed pan was stopped from her wage!

I don't think that would happen today....

 

[moose man]

Staff are ten a penny , GOOD staff are priceless ,we always tried to make the job for good staff to good to lose ..

[mel b3]

5 hours ago, Gordon R said:

About 10 years ago, one of my staff came to see me to say he needed to go home. He was more than a bit upset and could barely get words out. I told him to go home, do whatever he needed to do and contact me when he was able. I said it doesn't have to be today, tomorrow or the day after - just go.

He phoned the day after - it turned out his wife had just been diagnosed with terminal cancer. 

When he returned to work, I told him I was interested in what he produced over a year, not just one or two days when he needed to be elsewhere.

Staff are a precious resource and if you want to get the most out of them, treat them properly. If you treat them badly, your results take a turn for the worse.

 

Well said Gordon.  Many bosses could do with taking a leaf out of your book 👍.

[Zetter]

I always try to do the best for my staff and dont stop time if they need to go to the doctors etc. I have given people as much time as they needed when loved ones are ill and have moved heaven and earth with my boss when employees have had the worst news.

However over the years you do get a bit cynical after dealing with quite a few blatant wee takers. If you have managed people you know the ones I mean, want all the extra time off for various appointments but you ask them to do an extra half hour or cover some extra work you would think you were asking for the life of their first born.

During Covid especially it has highlighted who are the people you can rely on  and those who if the axe has to fall will be at the front of the queue.

Edited August 12, 2020 by Zetter

[rbrowning2]

Goodwill should be both ways something in my experience in retail, the larger the business the more they forget, treat staff badly or inconsistently and they do not forget, treat them fairly then it is a win win situation for both parties.

[Scully]

7 hours ago, Gordon R said:

About 10 years ago, one of my staff came to see me to say he needed to go home. He was more than a bit upset and could barely get words out. I told him to go home, do whatever he needed to do and contact me when he was able. I said it doesn't have to be today, tomorrow or the day after - just go.

He phoned the day after - it turned out his wife had just been diagnosed with terminal cancer. 

When he returned to work, I told him I was interested in what he produced over a year, not just one or two days when he needed to be elsewhere.

Staff are a precious resource and if you want to get the most out of them, treat them properly. If you treat them badly, your results take a turn for the worse.

 

Good for you. 👍
 

[WalkedUp]

My father employed a Welsh architect,  he had a wife and young children. His wife was diagnosed with and then died from pancreatic cancer. My father gave him unlimited fully paid leave, he took over 3 months off and the other 3 months were not very productive. It was fine, who would be in his position or could judge? After her death he was obviously very absent. The guy asked my dad not to attend the funeral, which he had enquired about. Anyway, a few months later he was hooked up with a another woman and his wife’s life insurance came through. The welsh architect handed in his notice, and went. It personally cost my dad about £25/30,000 in salary but he was fine with it. 

Any way, a couple of years later my brother spotted a public social media post from that idiot welsh architect naming my dad as a bad employer! My brother was livid and I could have throttled the guy, but my dad still said grief is a weird thing. I’m now the boss and have zero compassion, people have taken the mick so it hardens your heart. 

Edited August 12, 2020 by WalkedUp

[JohnfromUK]

Firstly - to the original poster, I sympathise and agree the business has been at fault morally - whether it has been at fault legally, I have no idea as I'm not a lawyer.  I hope your driver gets better soon as some sprains can take a long time to get the strength back fully.

I was very fortunate throughout my working life in that I almost all of my life worked for good employers; the one occasion I didn't - I made my move and left for a new job.  In my case, in I mainly worked for smaller UK companies - and the employers were both considerate and caring - and (as an example) where a colleague had a leg in plaster, arrangements were made so that he could return to work (that was his wish) safely and receive assistance with transport and other things that presented challenges.  It worked well and everyone else was pleased to be able to help and 'make things work' in the temporary arrangements until he recovered including providing assistance in being conveyed to hospital appointments etc.  In later days when I worked for a big USA based company ...... the 'official' line was actually quite tough, and gave little help, but local managers had discretion - and generally used that sensibly to help the individual and not incur the displeasure of our 'higher management'.

The biggest problems I have seen - and no doubt some of the reasons for tough attitudes by (some) employers ....... is that there have been a few who have abused the generosity of the system or individual manager.  I won't quote examples - but a few have managed to obtain large amounts of 'special leave' for some very dubious reasons.

[figgy]

I don't see the problem, the driver could have taken himself off to get treatment if it was that bad.  Only your boss knows how tight things😲re at the moment and him wanting or needing to make a delivery after the van going to take spare driver. Asking how the driver is is par for the course and not on if he didn't.

I've worked for some complete insert your own swear words. Others even though absolute nightmares to work for, would not see a man not earn his wage, so would cover for them if they had to disappear for a short time appointments illness etc.

In some companies your nothing but a number. I've always maintained I don't expect to be paid if I'm not there, but if I have to work over I want paying. In other places I've worked it's been give and take. 

[Vince Green]

When my OH worked in the NHS (i.e. up till last year) it used to infuriate her how many staff would book time off for dental or minor non urgent medical appointments on working days despite having plenty of days off on their rota when it could be done in their own time.

And it wasn't just nip off an hour early or take a late lunch, they would take the whole day.

"where is Sarah?"  "Oh she's not in today she's got the dentist"

(last week it was the chiropodist, week before it was the optician) 

Managers never ever said anything, They were at it too    

Edited August 12, 2020 by Vince Green

[Benthejockey]

I've worked for a handful of people since I was too young to be legally working the hours I was working. I also employed staff for a good few years so I can see it from both sides. Theres a staff shortage in my industry for one main reason, the best staff get worked to death picking up the strain from the worst staff but the worst staff are much cheaper to employ so eventually the good staff get fed up and walk. But there are so many bad and lazy staff about that take the Mickey you can see why bosses take a hardline. For instance I know one girl who had a week off with a stiff neck, whereas I was back riding out 2 weeks after breaking my wrist with it strapped up tight.

[enfieldspares]

I don't see the problem with asking the guy to wait so that the employer can co-ordinate bring the injured party back with an outward going load. Indeed it's probably better as it allows the injured party to be certain that the sprained ankle is just that and not something worse. And that three hours gives him time also to seek that medical attention.

Imagine if it wasn't and that only becomes apparent when he's in the sent down van doing 70mph on the motorway with no A & E Department nearby. Yes, failing to enquire after the injured party's health is poor do's, but the rest isn't IMHO. The Boss should have said "I'm sorry...go to a hospital get it checked out that it's OK and safe to travel...and we'll sort out a van and driver to bring you back."

And in fact it'd probably be seen by any Court as a beach of a "Duty of Care" if the driver was brought back without him/her having had any time allowed for them to use that time to seek medical attention. That three hours gives him/her that time doesn't it? And sweltering in the heat? Is he not at a local A & E in a hospital? Or does the van not have a ventilation system?

Edited August 12, 2020 by enfieldspares

[PPP]

10 hours ago, moose man said:

Staff are ten a penny , GOOD staff are priceless ,we always tried to make the job for good staff to good to lose ..

Sums it up perfectly.

[fatchap]

2 hours ago, enfieldspares said:

And sweltering in the heat? Is he not at a local A & E in a hospital? Or does the van not have a ventilation system?

Our vans have no Air Con, even the brand new ones, he explicitly states they are not to have air con. Let the piece of human flotsum of driver suffer, as long as he gets his deliveries done and his bank account continues to swell, that driver can die of exposure as far as he's concerned, he would  wait a day or two and advertise his position. Don't want to look to uncaring.

Apparently for a multi million pound company that I slave for, having A/C in the vans would add an extra 17p a month to each vans diesel bill. obviously this being through the summer months. 17p!!! hardly going to break the bank when his turnover is around £1.5 million a month.

Edited August 12, 2020 by fatchap

[Vince Green]

Years ago on a lot of vans a heater was an optional extra